Sharron Davies

[EugeneWrayburn]

www.bbc.co.uk/sport/swimming/47428951

Brilliant gif! Thanks Kate Lees.

Though I (and some other women on this board?) probably look more like our lovely RMK than Sharon.

But I still don't need validation from others (especially those males performing 'femininity', even more those undergoing facial feminisation surgery, as to whether I'm veering away in the 'eyeball test' from SD to RMK.}

Because, guess what. Biology. (Booo - bad word used!) We know who we are.

Exactly Floral.

It's the ultimate problem for those who conflate sex with gender.

If 'you look like a man' is an insult for women.

Those women (and transwomen) who feel hurt?

Maybe they may (and I recognise I'm projecting here so other's perspective is very welcome) be upset because they feel that someone hasn't 'read' their performance of gender norms as being 'a woman' wrong, despite their understanding of their own biological presentation.

But even if she did, she isn't a man so it doesn't affect anything at all.

This is what challenges those who want to 'opt-in' to gender stereotypes. You and Sharron have to adhere to the stereotypes, otherwise there's nothing for them to opt into.

Where do you go, when you're a male who feels 'female' if the 'females' are not bothered whether they're read as men or women?

Women - stick to your boxes, so others can 'opt-in' to them!

.

I think when RMK says sharron looks like a transwoman she means that she wishes transwomen looked like that.
Dream on RMK!

Quite, pombear. This is why there was that silly nonsense criticizing Will Smith's son for wearing a skirt as a male while not being trans - if those items are no longer coded 'female', how would the author be able to express their inner female identity?

And all those ridiculous come backs to women who say "I don't 'identify' as a woman" that say "Well, you aren't a woman then. You're something else."

Exactly as you say - and I am sure this is one of Bewilderness's rules - women must be exactly as men define, so that they may be more readily appropriated when required. This is precisely why 'cis' is so monumentally offensive - it is not just a description, it's a demand that women do as they are told.

Sister Outrider
@ClaireShrugged
“...a woman is tremendously controlled by what the man’s imagination makes of her - literally, hour by hour, day by day; so she becomes a woman. But a man exists inside his own imagination, and can never be at the mercy of a woman’s.” - James Baldwin, If Beale Street Could Talk

Such jealousy. Sharon is all woman. Something they will never be and, my, how they hate her for it.

Exactly AuntyCJ. And they still pretend to be women and mainsplain what it means

Sharon on Today now and is brilliant.

She's on R4 now

Sharon was fab!

I agree with her - how can we ignore averages? Averages are why we have women's sports in the first place.

She was fucking brilliant!

I just heard the last minute or so - she was fab! Pulling no punches.

Sharron was brilliant - so calm and considered and what she said about competing in the 70s and 80s against the Eastern European nations who were routinely doping and dominating competitions was so relevant.

She was totally awesome on the Today programme. Go Sharron!

At last - finally someone who doesn't get drawn into side issues, but gets across her points. Eg listing the changes to boys at puberty. No side tracking onto intersex conditions or other points. And clear on when the changes to the Olympic rules will take effect.

Just heard her on Today. She's brilliant. Calm. Sensible. Just what's needed.

Someone has been busy editing Sharon's Wikipedia page adding details saying she is a transphobe.

Ffs, they don't let up do they?

And someone has been busy editing it back.

I can’t be the only one who has a massive, helpless girl crush on Sharron right now She was my favourite Gladiator back in the day. Classy, clever, strong, and a total goddess.

Tall women over forty are way, way beyond giving the measliest fuck about being called manly. I’m a muscly six-footer with huge shoulders. If we apply ladybrain science, in the way that it looks like Joss is trying to do (forcing distributions into binaries) then as I have a male height, I am a man.

Nope. I am a height that is more commonly seen in males. Still a woman.

McKinnon has been apparently been contacting people in Kelly Holmes' professional life and telling them she's a transphobe. One has said they will 'look into it'.

McKinnon also thinks that Sharron and McKinnon look alike?? So hats off to all the posters who called that one in advance.

Sharron comes across as completely neutral and sensible. And I I love how grown-up she seems compared to the spite and angst levelled at her.

I mean does McKinnon actually think, in their wildest dreams, that saying testosterone makes no difference, followed by the assertion that the IOC should eliminate it's reduction as a criteria, will ever, ever fly?

I want someone to address that with McKinnon. I want McKinnon on record everywhere saying that there should be no criteria. That men should be able to compete with women purely on the basis of some magic words.

McKinnon also thinks that Sharron and McKinnon look alike??

If the BBC feature this ongoing story on their website, they really need a pair of photos.

And it's not all about testosterone. It's about muscle mass, limb development, red blood cells, size of heart. Which gets advanced through male puberty as a matter of biological fact.

I have had a girl crush on Sharron Davies since I was 13, she is, was and will ever be my shero. She was always my favourite Gladiator too

I heard her and RMK on the Today program this morning and Sharron was awesome - so calm and sticks to the facts (although I'm sure the TRAs will pick up on her reference to females as YY instead of XX )

With RMK it's all about looks - what someone looks like is apparently the most important thing It's just so illogical.

It was great that Sharron had the second interview and so was able to refute all of RMK's garbage. Unusual because generally the TW gets the last word on the BBC.

I've deleted the BBC news app from my phone - it was doing my blood pressure no good.