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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Feminism: chat

Original poster

Sharron Davies

382 replies

EugeneWrayburn · 02/03/2019 20:28

www.bbc.co.uk/sport/swimming/47428951

OP posts:
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20
Girlofgold · 02/03/2019 22:42

Thank you Sharon. Where are the mail voices of support on this in sport?

mammoon · 02/03/2019 22:54

Can someone explain wtf this means? How is Sharron's tweet white supremacist? This is so confusing to me. I don't get it.

twitter.com/sunnysingh_n6/status/1101779869640347648

TemporaryPermanent · 02/03/2019 22:56

I wish someone would push back against McKinnon's use of the 'human right' aspect of their argument. Absolutely nobody is being excluded from participation in sport by a requirement to compete in the correct category. You might as well say that a 12 stone rower is having their rights infringed by not being allowed to compete in a lightweight rowing race. Rules are for the birds, amirite Rach?

Datun · 02/03/2019 23:01

Can someone explain wtf this means? How is Sharron's tweet white supremacist? This is so confusing to me. I don't get it.

I don't get it either. Logic is not their strong suit. It will be something about privilege and transwomen being women the same as black women and red haired women.

I just appears to be something they throw at feminists in order to backfoot them.

I'm sure they can string two or three utterly irrational things together, in order to make their point, though.

Beamur · 02/03/2019 23:04

Well done Sharron. An athletic icon for my generation.
Nothing she said is wrong.
Interesting that the BBC acknowledge in their own (rather biased) report that Sharron points out that her opinions are widespread and that currently competing athletes are powerless to speak out. I hope people see that message in this story and it piques interest to find out more.

JamesBlonde1 · 02/03/2019 23:06

I heard some of that broadcast Bubble.

Yes Sharron was great, but there was some complete knob, talking utter bollocks.

Sharron referred to the historical doping scandal of the former East Germany and how it was so difficult to challenge them. Yes, that would be right as those poor lasses were given drugs which effectively caused them to act like men.

I tell everyone I can about this issue. It’s an international scandal.

It needs more air time than a few articles on the radio. It needs a full TV show with brilliant women like Sharron and Martina. Anyone opposing their opinion will just come across as a dangerous idiot.

mammoon · 02/03/2019 23:10

I just appears to be something they throw at feminists in order to backfoot them.

But this is a woman, a feminist herself??

I know there are a few women out there who are pushing the TRA line but I was surprised, I thought she was an intelligent woman. She seems to be saying that understanding biological difference exists is a white imperialist discourse??

Jesus god I am so confused.

NotBadConsidering · 02/03/2019 23:12

It was Ellis Cashmore, an actual professor, of sociology at Aston Univeristy who said he “knew of” research that if you had a man and a woman of equal stature and then trained them the same then there would be no difference. Just such unadulterated bullshit it was amazing he didn’t choke on it as the words came out. Sharron did well.

JamesBlonde1 · 02/03/2019 23:12

Quite right Girlof. The thousands of men need to voice their support. I very much suspect they sympathise with women in sport.

I know all the men I speak to, including my DH, think men being allowed to compete and annihilate these poor talented women is disgraceful.

It’s like living in a parallel universe. Who are the loons in power, on the board of decision makers, allowing this to happen?

JamesBlonde1 · 02/03/2019 23:15

Ellis Cashmore doesn’t like women. No respect for their efforts at all.

That study must have been carried out in East Germany...40 years ago.....Hmm

youllhavehadyourtea · 02/03/2019 23:16

any relation to Michael Cashmore?
he doesn't like women either.

youllhavehadyourtea · 02/03/2019 23:18

haha! oops Cashman
can be difficult to tell misogynists apart.

BubblegumFactory · 02/03/2019 23:23

That’s him, Ellis Cashmore. I was very disappointed that he was given such free reign to peddle utter bullocks.
Then I remembered it was BBC and Jeremy Vine, radio version of the Daily Fail.
I just now wish that all the sportswomen friends SD refers to find the strength to join her and make their voice heard.

EweSurname · 03/03/2019 07:37

I don’t have a share token

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/sharron-davies-trans-threat-to-women-sport-g6tcwtptt

MsTSwift · 03/03/2019 07:49

I find it frightening that an obvious to anyone fact (men are stronger faster than women generally”) is dubbed a “dangerous myth”. It’s gaslighting and it’s terrifying.

Sharron is speaking the simple truth which the majority surely agree with.

placemats · 03/03/2019 07:54

Well done Sharron Davies.

Telling the truth sometimes hurts. RM needs to get over it!

bellinisurge · 03/03/2019 07:58

Hurray for Sharon.

AuntieCJ · 03/03/2019 08:01

Thanks, Sharron. Natal women shouldn't have to play nice.

MrsJamin · 03/03/2019 08:04

It really feels like the tide is turning. When I see a friend of mine sharing this then I will really know that it is reaching the mainstream.

CherryPavlova · 03/03/2019 08:09

It’s very sad when the obvious becomes news. It’s very sad when pointing out the obvious is interpreted as hateful or phobic.

I’m sure most reasonable people don’t mind men dressing up as women. I’m sure most people don’t want to bully or hate someone who feels so uncomfortable with themselves they are prepared to take drugs or have major surgery. Few people would think it acceptable that anyone was assaulted because of their appearance.

That doesn’t make them women though, does it? It doesn’t give them female physiology. It’s just pretending. A bit like the emporers new clothes.

RedToothBrush · 03/03/2019 08:24

Just make sure everyone keeps in perspective that transgender athletes in sport was THE thing that burst the bubble on that attitudes survey and only a small minority of people supported them competing without questions being raised.

It was startling to see how people who were pro-trans on other issues must not have been for sport as the percentages were much lower in terms of support than for other issues.

The idea that this is far right ideology just does not fit with that unless you are calling over 80% of the population far right.

But then reality isn't the militants strong point is it. Cheating the system is.

AuntVanya · 03/03/2019 08:36

Agree with Sharron Davies- wanting fairness in sport does not make anyone transphobic. I admire her for speaking out, because she will have known in advance that putting her head above the parapet will lead to some serious abuse. I just wish other high profile athletes would go public with their views- but I can see it's impossible to speak out without fear of vilification, and current elite athletes can't risk it. Perhaps this is the time for all the retired athletes to speak out for the current competitors.
I heardSharron on Jeremy Vine and she handled it well. I actually like how JV allowed the other guy to speak because he was obviously ridiculous and the more he spoke, the more he strengthened my opposition to him.

bellinisurge · 03/03/2019 08:40

I don't get why eg Paralympic Sport has several categories for one event so why can't trans athletes participate in a special category within Paralympics. No one would deny that e.g Ellie Simmonds is a superwoman. Who competes in the Paralympics.

Mner2019 · 03/03/2019 08:42

Well done to Sharron for speaking out. The abuse must be horrible but it’s just too important.