Julia Long asking Munro Bergdorf about child exploitation

[happydappy2]

Julia Long was asked to leave the venue, after asking MB if it was normal that an 11yr old child dancing in front of adults, has money thrown at them by grown men. This was at Transmission & was deemed an offensive question....video footage on twitter of the incident.....worth a watch, sorry I can’t link to it but hope someone else can.

[Edited by MNHQ to add video link]

I don't understand the sidebar thing?

I'm assuming it's the coercive control video on the desktop site

You couldn't make this stuff up...

MN have collaborated on and are promoting, an excellent video about coercive control that helps women to identify it. It would help matters if MN applied the insights there to moderating FWR.

If the OP, @happydappy2 contacts HQ and says it's okay to put that link in the OP, I'm sure HQ will amend it.

@MichaelMumsnet

Thanks for the reply. Sorry if I am being a bit thick, but I'm still not totally clear:

the title/introduction clearly broke our guidelines Are you saying that the text of the link itself broke guidelines? E.g. www.donquixhoteisaterf.com. Or are you saying that the website linked had a prominent title which broke talk guidelines. If the latter, surely lots of websites might not follow MN rules?

If it is external site that is the issue, could you please give a little more clarity?

• Is this a change in general policy?
• Or is it specific to one type of breach (e.g. misgendering)?
• Or is it simply that the videos/sites linked were really unpleasant (as would normally be removed) and we've just got the wrong end of the stick?

I'm a bit confused because just underneath all the deleted comments on the first page, is a link to Posie Parkers FB page with all the comments underneath, but I thought that was what had been deleted?

HQ please would you link the video to my original OP, fine by me-thank you

BertrandRussell - I know.
I was involved in a very 'progressive' and political arts sector at the time and people who I know and otherwise have great respect for, felt able to talk about children having a right to explore their sexuality.

I think the swift-on-its-heels campaign for rape to be recognised within marriage focused people's minds on consent to a greater degree , and all the people I know now fully support full safeguarding protocols and recognise that the PIE line was exploitative.

It was part of the smokescreen that enabled the care home atroctities, Savile, the jolly japes (not) described in the Joe Orton diaries (though even he is particular about age and condemns the 'pederasts' he sees on the Tangiers beach.

Glamour, frocks, nail varnish, long hair - the new smokescreen.

happydappy2

I'm going to report your post in order for HQ to see your request. Hope that's okay.

Mmn. MNHQ this looks like taking the same approach to coercive control as the NSPCC take towards their PANTS campaign.

Ie that women and girls' rights matter except in a few very specific situations. In those situations the right thing to do is be abused nicely. And we really mustn't talk about it.

The cognitive dissonance is clanging like Big Ben

As a general guide, we'll delete if we think the system is being gamed in order to post something you couldn't write directly on the boards

Worth considering that the reporting stystem is open to being gamed.

Datun yes of course, thank you. Am rushing around as is 1/2 term & kids need my attention. Is bizarre how many comments have been deleted on this thread.

Interesting that Munroe hasn't mentioned this incident at all on Twitter. You would think that Munroe wouldn't miss an opportunity to show them being 'attacked' in public. The Desmond twitter page has posted a video of this (which conveniently stops just as Julia is reiterating that Desmond is 11), and has tagged Munroe in it, thanking Munroe.

Munroe hasn't retweeted it. Normally this is the kind of thing that Munroe would be all over, to show solidarity.

Munroe knows.

Yes.
The clip that Desmond showed very much distorts the exchange.
The audience booing is the most shocking part.
I was not surprised to see it didn't feature on Munroe's feed.

I am trying to understand the audience reaction 'Boo, how dare you ask about child abuse'

I would imagine most of them are unaware of Desmond, maybe they are just reacting to the absence of fawning in Julia's voice.

'Boo. Transphobia!'

If Bergdorf doesn't realise what they are supporting is the dismantlement of child safeguarding, then they should start to listen.

Because there will be men in that audience who are fine with sexually exploiting children. You don't get to throw money at a child grinding on the stage if everyone is against it.

If Monroe says nothing, then they are complicit. And part of the problem.

a picture came up in my twitter feed of desmond wearing a gag with the word 'joy' written on it

i won't link to it because frankly it would feel like sharing an image of child sexual exploitation

it was very sobering and has frankly shocked the life out of me

i can't believe the bbc are running an unquestioning segment on this exploited child

Thanks HQ for putting a new video link in the opening post!

When I grow up I want to be Julia Long

Very weird moderating decisions on this thread @MNHQ I'm glad an acceptable version of the video has at last been added to the OP.

If we can't link to anything that doesn't comply with the special trans discussion rules, does that mean we can't link to any article that uses the terms T*F or cs? Those are as much banned here as 'misgendering' or 'deadnaming'.

I realise this is probably theoretical because the monitors are not likely to report those links but if some arsehole decided to push it, this new interpretation of the rules could completely shut down discussion here.

Are we allowed to link to woke articles we want to discuss that use the term c*s?

Are we allowed to link to sites like T**fisaslur so we can discuss the type of abuse we get?

What about Miranda Yardley's site, or any other writer of excellent articles that refuses to call men women?

Can we link to articles about / by Meghan Murphy and the reasons she is taking Twitter to court?

When I grow up I want to be Julia Long smile

Me too.

I really like her style.

I have seen that picture of Desmond wearing the mask as well. It's sick.

Also apparently it's part of a campaign to raise awareness of youth sex trafficking.... Now apart from the obvious irony here, let's just remind ourselves again that Desmond is 11 years old. 11 year olds shouldn't even have any real understanding of what sex trafficking even means.

And, as always, it's accompanied by lots of 'be yourself always' 'lgbtq' hashtags.

And apparently, at the ripe old age of 11, Desmond is a #gayicon. A gay icon for who exactly?

Yes thanks for linking to the video, the original one I saw was much clearer though & you could clearly see the very see through dress, the person with the long red hair, next to MB was wearing, which looked most odd, not the sort of thing most ladies would wear. It was this individuals dramatics about ‘trigger warnings’ & ‘safe spaces’ which just made no sense to me....child safety should never be hushed up under the guise of safe spaces.....

I would imagine most of them are unaware of Desmond, maybe they are just reacting to the absence of fawning in Julia's voice.

That is exactly what they were booing at. They are clueless.

I really do love Julia, imagine the ovaries it takes to stand up and ask that question in that setting. I would have shit myself!!!

It was this individuals dramatics about ‘trigger warnings’ & ‘safe spaces’ which just made no sense to me....child safety should never be hushed up under the guise of safe spaces.....

Well quite. And under normal circumstances, or general circumstances, or hitherto circumstances, it isn't.

So what's changed?

It was this individuals dramatics about ‘trigger warnings’ & ‘safe spaces’ which just made no sense to me

It's just the stock response these people have when people question them about anything they don't like. 'Triggering.... Safe space..... Stop trying to stop us from existing' blah blah blah.

I think they are so tunnel vision with this, so used to rolling out these lines to anyone who doesn't fawn all over them, that they don't even realise that they are very obviously silencing concerns about child safety.