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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

The Sun admit the Ian Huntley isTrans story was made up

232 replies

FeministFrequencyFan · 11/02/2019 14:18

twitter.com/theJeremyVine/status/1094931865318948864

A timely, if incredibly worrying reminder, that we should view all stories about minorities from our press with extreme skepticism. I hope this is the only fabricated inflammatory anti-trans story our press has published, it would be awful if the debate regarding trans rights was being used as cover by bigots to spread anti-trans hatred.

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deepwatersolo · 11/02/2019 15:42

Not sure what you are referring to OP. Surely, you cannot know whether Huntley currently feels to be a woman. Or do you have him on the phone right now?

CaptainKirksSpookyghost · 11/02/2019 15:43

"Criminal lies about being trans"

"Yes, made people tripping over themselves to call him "her" look a bit stupid doesn't it"

"but it proves you want to get rid of trans rights"

"huh, which rights???"

.....

And now the continuation of "silence from the OP"...

CaptainKirksSpookyghost · 11/02/2019 15:45

You might wonder whether we should be so quick to take the words of people who are, by defninition, criminals

Has the penny dropped?

Whatisthisfuckery · 11/02/2019 15:51

Hang on, I’m confused. The OP thinks we’ve been spreading stories about a child murderer identifying as a woman, is that right? Well no, we haven’t been doing that though have we. The papers printed it, because clearly it’s not that much of a stretch, and some people, again, not GC women and feminists, said that if Liam/Nicola Huntley says he’s a woman then s/he is a woman, and to refer to him as Ian is dead naming and transphobic. Not sure what any of that has to do with GC women and feminists.

And, of course, it’s a rediculous story that would never have gained traction if it wasn’t for self ID, and other male rapists and paedophiles being moved to womens’ prisons under the auspices of being trans. If it looks bonkers then some people need to ask why it would even be possible, let alone believable. We still don’t know how Ian/Liam/Nicola identifies though, so it might all still be true, or it might have been true at the time but Ian/Lian/Nicola now identifies as a man again because it’s not a goer. It’s got nothing to do with GC women and feminists though.

There’s one way to avoid such stories in the future, and that’s to stop putting males into womens’ prisons, then no child murderers or rapists or paedophiles need bother identifying as women at all.

LangCleg · 11/02/2019 15:54

Because this made up story was used to argue for a rolling back of trans rights.

LOL. Which rights?

What actually happened was that fundamentalist genderist activists rushed in with the acceptance without exception catechism, used social media to report "misgenderers" for "hate" aka apostasy, and have now been hoist with their own petard.

In common parlance: spectacular own goal.

FeministFrequencyFan · 11/02/2019 15:55

Op you seem confused, which right do you think this took away?

You seem to be suggesting that no one argued that this story proved that no trans woman should be in the female estate, not the ones with GRCs, not the ones who have gone through a comprehensive assessment by prison staff, none. This very obviously did happen so you're right, I am extremely confused by your revisionism.

OP posts:
CaptainKirksSpookyghost · 11/02/2019 16:00

This very obviously did happen so you're right, I am extremely confused by your revisionism.

Right and which rights were being rolled back?

this story proved that no trans woman should be in the female estate

Karen white and the others did this. But what rights have been rolled back?

FeministFrequencyFan · 11/02/2019 16:01

You seem to be suggesting that no one argued that this story proved that no trans woman should be in the female estate, not the ones with GRCs, not the ones who have gone through a comprehensive assessment by prison staff, none. This very obviously did happen so you're right, I am extremely confused by your revisionism.

Just to expand on this, the very next RT from Jeremy Vine is someone doing exactly like this while insisting "a significant number of rapists/paedophiles have infiltrated the [trans] movement", a repeat of the slur that was used against lesbian and gay people in the 1980s.

So, yes, I am very, very confused by your revisionism.

OP posts:
CaptainKirksSpookyghost · 11/02/2019 16:02

YOu seem to be confused about what is actually a 'right'?

FeministFrequencyFan · 11/02/2019 16:04

what rights have been rolled back?

You've asked this a few times, I suggest you go back and reread my initial post which said "was used to argue for a rolling back of trans rights"

I know it's easier to argue against what you wish other people had said but please don't waste everyone's time with it.

OP posts:
CaptainKirksSpookyghost · 11/02/2019 16:05

"a significant number of rapists/paedophiles have infiltrated the [trans] movement", a repeat of the slur that was used against lesbian and gay people in the 1980s.

So in your opinion people like David Challenor have not piggy backed on the coat tails of the Trans movement for their own gain?

userschmoozer · 11/02/2019 16:05

@FeministFrequencyFan You do know that PIE actually were actively supported by the gay movement? Thats not a baseless slur.

CaptainKirksSpookyghost · 11/02/2019 16:05

I know it's easier to argue against what you wish other people had said but please don't waste everyone's time with it.

And again which rights?

LaurenOrdering · 11/02/2019 16:06

In prison you lose your liberty, the right to vote etc.
You should also lose the right to change your gender.
Ian Huntley is a man, will always be a man. If he were ever to be released (which he isn't) then he can decide to be a trans woman when he leaves prison.
Prisons are punishments not birthday presents.

RockyFlintstone · 11/02/2019 16:07

Just to expand on this, the very next RT from Jeremy Vine is someone doing exactly like this while insisting "a significant number of rapists/paedophiles have infiltrated the [trans] movement", a repeat of the slur that was used against lesbian and gay people in the 1980s.

So let's get this straight. You don't think any man ever would ever take advantage of a law which says you can self id as a woman and therefore have access to women in prisons, changing rooms or toilets, or be able to carry out intimate exams of women 'as a woman'?

Honestly? Given everything that you know about the lengths that men will go to to access vulnerable people, you don't think self id is ripe for being abused?

Come on now.

Vixxxy · 11/02/2019 16:07

So, which rights were argued to be rolled back? The right of male people to shift to female prisons, with no thought at all to the female people it affected? Yes if somethings totally made up for a story, its bad. However, whether it was Huntely or not, predatory men would take advantage, and have. So really, nothing has changed with this.

It was TRAs who massively shot themselves in the foot over this tbh. Rapist hill indeed.

CaptainKirksSpookyghost · 11/02/2019 16:08

There is no right for transpeople to be put in the prision of the opposite sex.
There are calls for open discussions around how and what to implement.

userschmoozer · 11/02/2019 16:08

Actually I disagree. I don't think convicted criminals should be able to change their name or sex.

OP has ignored evidence that shows trans activists accepted Huntley as a trans woman. If anything, this whole story shows the utter confusion created by not having a GRC.

terryleather · 11/02/2019 16:09

As Captain says, which rights do you fear would be rolled back?

NottonightJosepheen · 11/02/2019 16:09

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

CaptainKirksSpookyghost · 11/02/2019 16:09

You can't roll back what isn't in place.

FeministFrequencyFan · 11/02/2019 16:12

And again which rights?

I try to remain civil when discussing things online with strangers but it's really hard for me to believe you're not being this dense deliberately.

The right to be placed in a prison that matches their gender, subject to a review by prison services.

Jsyk, I'm just going to skip straight to ignoring you if your next argument is there's no specific law that gives people this right, as if arguing that there's no specific law that gives you the right not to be murdered means you don't have the right not to be murdered when obviously we all have the right not to be murdered.

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CatandtheFiddle · 11/02/2019 16:12

Well of course it was made up.

Because this never happens.

CaptainKirksSpookyghost · 11/02/2019 16:13

And yes, PIE also tried in infiltrate the homosexual movement too, the difference was the gay community distanced themselves instead of defended them.

McTufty · 11/02/2019 16:14

I know it's easier to argue against what you wish other people had said but please don't waste everyone's time with it

OP, could you engage with the point made that the fact people were so quick to affirm this gender identity shows that actually people are entitled to be concerned about self ID?

Could you also confirm, given you seem to dislike straw men, that no one sensible has argued that all trans women are predators or that trans women shouldn’t have the right to exist which I hear with alarming regularity on Twitter?

That’s irrespective of the Lian issue suggesting the story wasn’t totally fabricated.