Trans Widows Escape Committee 2- The Trans Widows Strike Back..

[TinselAngel]

The previous thread is nearly full, so here is a shiny new one.

I'm thrilled that this took off enough to merit a second thread.

This is a support area for women who are, or have been, in unhappy relationships with male partners who are transitioning, or exploring their "gender identity"

If you are in that position-

1. You are not alone
2. It is not a situation that you should be expected to tolerate, let alone celebrate.
3. There is always a way out, if you want it. The thread is called Escape Committee for that reason.

Hi socialworker
I just feel so embarrassed I think.
I just can't find the words to tell them that the person they thought they knew would be the person he has turned out to be!.
I think I will have a lot of friends walk away.
The most common reason, people think he has gone off with someone (they will never guess he has gone off with someone!, being his alter ego self).
I despise him.
Did any of your children need counseling?

Thanks for being there.

Hi. If you can't SAY it you could email, write or text... I found it really hard to say the words. But I would still pick someone to try it out. Yes my kids are badly affected.the one who was 12 (FFS) has had various problems (depression, derealization, trauma (told me she feared her father might 'rape her' or try to wear her clothes because he was so 'creepy' and at no point talked to them, prepared/warned them as he made his changes... He had agreed to do it slowly and collaboratively but just did it including posting pics she saw without warning)(hence my homicidal rage). He worked at the time with children and young people (having previously been in IT btw)!!! They quickly stopped wanting to stay over and had he challenged it I would have gone to SS. Anyway she ended up with anxiety and was referred to CAMHS but a wonderful relative helped pay for private CBT which is helping but I believe she has significant trauma. Plus I suspect she found porn/toys/God know what at his flat. I worry for her going forward. His (only view) emotional abuse of his children is what I struggle to move on from. What helps a bit us to see him as a woefully inadequate f*ed-up adult/parent who is incapable of empathy or mature ways of relating and is kind of a useless human being. (But most of the time I hate him 🤬). I would take a risk with one person and open up. I could not have managed this without friends and family knowing... I owe them hours and hours of listening to me.

Sorry abuse (only in my view)

kitten have you seen this thread for parents of "trans" kids?
Families of trans kids/teens/adults http://www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3505685-families-of-trans-kids-teens-adults

Start, please tell the people you can trust. By letting him have control of the narrative you are continuing the pattern of him being in control of your life. I think you will find it quite liberating

My daughter was 7 at the time. We were already separated so I was clueless of his secret (at the time) life until I got an email late one Saturday night when he had her staying to tell me he was now a woman, had dressed as a woman that day and taken her out with his new friends and she was fine with it all. She came home the next day hysterically sobbing and refused to see him for a year. I arranged a family support worker who saw her weekly at school, she saw a Cafcass social worker, a "relaxed kids" therapist and Cafcass. She totally shut down. Eventually after a year and a half she agreed to see him for a few hours on a Sunday with stipulations about what he's allowed to wear but still won't stay overnight with him. She's gradually being coached by him to call him she and that she's "fine with that" whenever she mentions his behaviour but yes she's needed a lot of support and still does now she's almost 10.

Senterkitten that is so hard. We have a trans identifying youth in the family.

imablackstarnotapopstar that is heartbreaking.

Imablackstarnotapopstar your poor daughter, and poor you

I just finished watching 'The making of me', found the wives predicament particularly hard to watch. That 'phrase' I'd marry me' & the obliviousness to their friends discomfort were telling

With the middle aged transitioners the need to be seen as sexually desirable women came across very strongly. Which is unfortunate for them, it's a hard enough aim as a middle aged woman.

I was surprised no mention was made of the Scottish transmans hair turning grey after a year on T, shame it was such a nice colour before.

cadanita1 I'm glad you found your way here and some support.

So I am new on here, but the woman's hour transcript is so like my story, though mine isn't complete. I haven't made it clear I want him to move out, but I don't know if he is going like it. Our children still don't know, I have known for over a year, he isn't presenting as female at all at the moment, though I suspect he does when we are out. He has one more psychological assessment, and the next stage is hormones. I have financially supported him for years, because of the depression and emotional turmoil, he hasn't' worked for years. There is no aggression, no arguments, then again, not much discussion either. I don't want it to be nasty, I just want it to happen. I am coming more and more to the reality that if he can make changes, I can't just take it, like I have taken so much other rubbish in my life with him. I have to make changes too. Weirdly, the one thing I want from this is to find myself a new man, that is a man, that I find attractive, that I can cuddle up to, that physically is there for me, as well as emotionally. This probably doesn't make much sense, much of my ramblings don't. I have always known I am not the only one, but I am hoping with support from other widows I will have the strength to react with strength.

Hi @Iworkmiricles, what you say does make sense.

You probably feel like you are currently in the worst of times, but you are actually in an exciting place. You have decided what your boundaries are, and from now on your life will get better as you find your own path, rather than being dragged along his.

The relief of no longer being subject to somebody else's whims, is tremendous.

Iworkmiricles excellent user name. You sound like you are getting your strength back after years of hassle. I'm not a trans widow but you have my admiration.

Iworkmiricles you sound well-placed to calmly work out a plan. And if this is the next in a long line of crap you have tolerated, that helps to form your resolve. Are your kids young? It helped me to be massively pragmatic ... Money, job, house, kids. Decide what outcome you want. You are probably calmer and more rational than him so you can keep control of the plan. Knowing what you want is the central thing. There is lots of support and advice here. Without being hippyish/creepy, it feels at time like love and care for other women going through what is for many simply a nightmare. Oh and nothing 'weird' about wanting someone you fancy to get close to.... We all deserve that after sharing our lives with and trusting these inadequate and self-centred men. So talk to us if you want help with anything. And all credit to you for your resolve and strength.

I started a thread on relationship's last night as my dh of 20 years had just told me that he liked wearing women's clothes and some lovely posters directed me here. I read through but thought this was too 'much' for me as my dh only occasionally wears a pair of knickers. Anyway today I have been hunting for his stuff, there's body shaping underwear, a wig and shoes that have definitely been worn outside. I know there's no going back. Our marriage is over.

Toomanytears I'm so sorry for your situation.

Hi @Toomanytears I'm so glad you've found us. When many of the posters on here were in your situation, we did not have access to information about how such situations usually progress, we had to live through the drip feed, the lies, the boundary pushing and the escalation. At least you will be able to make an informed decision.

If these threads enable one woman at the point of finding out that their husband cross dresses, to decide what her boundaries are and assert them confidently, then I will feel like it has done some real good.

Bear in mind that the days of your bank manager secretly putting on a silky blouse in the evening while he settles down to read The Times, are long gone. The "stunning and brave" narrative is so strong and society so much more accepting now, that transition is much more likely.

That's great for the individuals involved, but less so for those of us who are married to them.

In my experience, he is likely to have been much more involved in this than he is currently telling you. Indeed you're finding that out already I think. Expect him to have an extensive online double life.

One thing that strikes me in your initial post on your thread is that you say "my dh has told me that he cross dresses for sexual kicks and wants to 'explore this further". If you have been together 20 years and have only just found this out, who has he potentially been getting said sexual kicks with? Does he work away a lot?

Is he a high earner working in IT by any chance?

Sorry I posted to early, I was going to offer you and .

I was also going to add- fuck him not wanting anybody to know- if you want to talk to people you trust IRL then do so.

Here is Toomanytears thread, for everyone else's reference.

Dh of 20 years is a crossdresser. I don't know how to cope. http://www.mumsnet.com/Talk/relationships/3533521-Dh-of-20-years-is-a-crossdresser-I-dont-know-how-to-cope

Sheila Jeffries has just being speaking about the impact on wives / female partners and families when adult males announce they are women

www.facebook.com/WLRNews4Women/

This is at the launch of Declaration of Women's Sex-Based Rights in New York.
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3526970-Declaration-on-womens-sex-based-rights

tinsel he is high earning but I have access to all of our money. We agreed a long time ago that I would manage our joint account and then we both have around £200/250 a month go into our own accounts for personal spends. He has some expensive 'legit' hobbies that he spends his money on so probably doesn't actually have that much left for this. I have been through his account and seen where his money has gone recently.

The expensive hobby will have been a good cover for the cross dressing activity I suspect. Does it involve going away overnight?

Me and my ex had a joint account but he still managed to somehow amass a collection of women's attire to rival Imelda Marcos and Princess Diana.

No, he doesn't go away for work or leisure.

As for his hobbies, I don't want to be outing, but think buying a car and then just needing petrol. The petrol goes on our joint credit card and then he pays it back within a week from his spends. So he does have some money that I don't know where it goes (do now obviously!) but not a great amount.

I just found this post after seeing the one on relationships - thanks @TinselAngel.

I wish I'd known you were here a year ago when I realised I didn't have a future with my 'DH' after 19 years of lies and deception around agp and cross dressing.

We also had an undiagnosed ASD (his) into the mix which explained to an extent why he was completely unable to understand that I could have different feelings about something (cd) than him.

I am grateful that i found the strength (with much support) to separate but I still worry about what the future holds. We have a preteen daughter and I know he wears his special clothes very often (probably most days) now that we don't live together.

I don't know if/when she will 'find' them and how that will affect her. She lives with me but she visits him and stays over at his sometimes. I've asked him to be discreet and not show her anything but he drinks and gets forgetful sometimes. He is definitely supported online by a community and tells me I'm narrow minded and a horrible person for not letting him do exactly what he wants and when...... apparently I'm not allowed to have an opinion!

Thank you for listening

Hi mashed. Welcome on board.

I hope you stick around as it's so important women who have experienced this, talk to each other.

It sounds like your DD is around the same age mine was when her Dad and I separated.

I'll give you some advice which might be a bit blunt but which I think is sound.

Here's my take on your situation- by trying to control what he wears around your daughter and trying to stop her from finding out, you are still caught in the familiar cycle of compromise/ boundary pushing/ escalation that you were in during your relationship. You won't have managed to make him behave reasonably and considerably then, you've got no chance now.

Also you're allowing him to keep his role as victim of your terrible oppression which he will have an online Greek chorus sympathising with him over.

I'm well aware of the stress and anxiety that is part of this situation and the affect it has on one's health.

You need to let it go and accept he is responsible for his own actions and you cannot influence them. If you try to control a situation you have no control over, it will drive you mad.

The relationship between your daughter and her Dad is now between the two of them. It is his to fuck up (and there's every chance he will).

It would be better for her if she knew and it was all out in the open. In your situation, I told my ex to tell her and he did. If you can't trust him to do this, I'd seriously consider telling her yourself- far better she hears it from you than finds out by accident. If he's indiscreet (as my ex was), she could even hear about it via gossip.

I hope this is helpful

Considerately not considerably

Thanks Tinsel,
it is useful to be reminded that the relationship is his to fuck up as I often try to manage this.

With the cd behaviour - we have clearly agreed boundaries to stop her being exposed. I know he may not keep to those boundaries but he is usually very secretive with his behaviour which helps.

He is very ashamed of his behaviour (which I think is sad for him to be honest) and only cd's when he is drunk. This is the one thing that I can control because he only has access to her at certain times and he is not allowed to drink to excess in her company as agreed in formal mediation.

How did your daughter cope with this information about her dad?

It was slightly different for us mashed in that I left DD's Dad and he started to "transition" very shortly afterwards, so she definitely had to be told.

She seemed to cope with it fairly well. It was assisted by me having made sure he was living far enough away (about 30 mins), so that people she knew wouldn't be bumping into him. It's still not general knowledge amongst her school mates, over 5 years on.

The long term effects remain to be seen, but they still have a good relationship and she goes there EOW.

Don't expect him to remain embarrassed about the cross dressing when the entire Internet will be encouraging him to be stunning and brave. If he sticks to your agreements I will be amazed.

Long time lurker ready to tell my story. I began a LDR with a seemingly nice, respectful man after meeting through work. There was an instant spark and we chatted/texted for two months and I booked flights to see him. He held and still holds a prominent community position in another country outside the UK. A few days before I arrived, he disclosed he had a fetish for wearing women’s underwear. I was OK with this, thinking myself fairly liberal minded. However this opened the floodgates and his dressing became the focus of our first visit together. We did not even have full sex that time because he wanted us to have sex ‘like girls’. There were multiple red flags but I stayed in touch with this man and we met again several times, although each time his CD/AGP was increasingly dominant. I think I only stayed in touch because with him living in another country, it was not in my mind a ‘real’ relationship. But it went on for several years. Multiple photos of him sent to my phone dressed in all manner of frilly knickers, bras, you name it. Vivid fantasy life where he was a slut/tart/whore etc. More jewellery than you can imagine. Massive porn user. I went along with all of it and to this day I do not really understand why. I am still working through all that. I also found he had a sleazy online life with dating accounts on hook up sites in his home country. Twice I left the relationship because he was seeing other women but on each occasion he lured me back in. More fool me. Anyway it escalated further - polyamory - which I think is not uncommon either in some of these men. I don’t think I really lost my senses, I think he was just extremely persuasive that his way was somehow ‘enlightened’ and ‘correct’ and exciting.

Other stuff went on that was not directly related to his AGP but more towards him having inappropriate behaviour with his just-turned-adult kids and I left and informed his ex wife (their mother) so that she could step in and protect them.

So to anyone facing a CD partner I say - it will likely escalate. They will likely keep secrets. What you see may only be the tip of the iceberg. My AGP seemed to have a fundamental hatred for women. His exquisite sexual enjoyment came from being shamed a slut. That’s how he sees women. That’s how he was treating me. He was happier wanking in lacy bras than in any other pursuit, real women were mere props. My life is immeasurably better now that I am not subject to his hairy legs in high heels and pretending to feel sorry for him for not having a vagina and breasts but having a cock, the same cock he used with enthusiastic vigour to be unfaithful to me with countless other women.