Lily Madigan and the School Saga

[dillydallyXX]

Lily Madigan has been self-praising again, with more details about how they "sued" their school.

They hired a "team of solicitors", to "advice" Lily and the "principle" gave in on all their "demands".

The truth is slightly different.

Lily arrived at school wearing basically a boob tube. They were sent home because it was against uniform policy. Any girl wearing that for school would have been asked to change or go home. It's clear Lily was looking for a reason to kick things off.

Lily was not "made to wear a man's suit". They were asked to adhere to the school uniform - like any pupil. The girls wear a blazer too and can wear a skirt or trousers; many girls choose to wear trousers and the blazer.

Lily organised a petition. It was an ONLINE petition, quite different to a paper one. The support Lily claimed she had is very difficult to prove.

The school's staff tried very hard to placate Lily. They had meetings with their mother, the pastoral care team, etc - and got nowhere. It apparently caused distress to Lily's younger sister who was at school.

Lily contacted a solicitor in London. Because of the Equality Act the school did have to cater to transgender pupils - and when the school was informed of their obligations they changed their policy in accordance to the Act.

There was no suing of the school. There was no legal action, certainly no "legal battle", as Lily repeatedly claims.

There was no victimisation of Lily. Afterwards, the school said they had tried very hard for Lily and their words and actions had been deliberately twisted.

And now Lily still says that "they won", they "got it all", and that they did all this behind their parents' backs, and then "embarked on a media tour".

Lily's parents knew about it all, right from the day Lily was sent home.

Is lil still going on about that non event and using slurs? They really don’t have a bloody off switch do then?

Disappointed but hardly surprised to see a terf handing out transphobic leaflets in an area where a house was recently vandalised with transphobic slogans.

Good opportunity for anyone in any of the real life or online Momentum, Labour party, NUS, transgender communities to intervene maybe, if they think this is wrong and contributing to the 'mess'.

I thought twitter doesn't allow "terf" anymore
The fragrant one should change it to something sweet like "the plague carrier" or "women" .... "vagina owner " etc

Its only Mumsnet & The Economist (I believe) that do not allow 'terf' to be used against someone.

I believe their are several complaints in with the party rowan
Seems Lily is really pissing a lot of people off

But of course now that Lily has been in hospital for a "head injury" and "concussion" that has "wiped her memory", she now has a perfect excuse to deny any past, present and future bad behaviour

I believe their are several complaints in with the party rowan
Seems Lily is really pissing a lot of people off

I think Lily Madigan is also doing a lot of damage to the Labour Party.
Just as Challenor did to the Greens and Brown & O'Connell are doing to the Liberal Democrats.

With politics being at such a critical point in time, the parties that may be more vulnerable should really take this seriously.

Also by contrast its important to be aware of how complaints against Venice Allan were dealt with by the Labour Party:

Mirand Yardley article,
'The Labour Party Is No Longer A Safe Place For Women’ – Venice Allan
POSTED ON 8TH MARCH 2018 BY MIRANDA
"Thank you to Venice Allan for giving me permission to reproduce this transcription of her recent disciplinary interview conducted on behalf of The Labour Party. This is very long and contains some of the most batshit crazy doublethink you will ever encounter: part outrageously funny, all absolutely outrageous, it reads like an Orwellian collaboration between Franz Kafka and Monty Python and will likely be the most stupidest thing you read this year, thanks to the surreal and bizarre line of questioning by the Labour official." (continues)

extract from transcript quoted in article
"D (let’s call him O’Brien): Obviously I will be going through the evidence as I said to you previously; a few other questions as well. I’ll ask you about the social media posts, your intention behind them and other conduct. I imagine you’ll probably have some questions as well. I will allow you to ask those at the beginning and end. Following this investigation I’ll be making a report to the National Executive Committee Disputes Panel along with the recommendations to further action. They make a decision on whether to take further action in your case. At its most serious that can take the form of a referral to the National Constitutional Committee and a hearing there. That can result in expulsion from the Labour Party at its most serious. However, if my recommendation is that the investigation is closed and your suspension is lifted that’ll happen immediately and that will simply be noted at the next meeting of the NEC Disputes Panel. Like I say, I’ll allow you an opportunity to ask your questions at the end of the interview but in the meantime do you have any questions for me right now?

V (Venice Allan): When you say immediately would it be like in a couple of days, or…?

D: Well, as soon as I’ve had a chance to reflect on all the evidence and reach a conclusion.

V: My other question is that in the initial letter I was accused of breaching the Labour Party Rules on social media and in person, but I didn’t see any…

D: Well, it’s hard to provide evidence of something that’s happened in person. We’ve had…

V: So we’ll be talking about that too?

D: We will be talking about that as well (continues)

D: What effect do you expect your post and other ones like it might have upon the Labour Party in terms of it being a welcoming environment for people with different backgrounds?

V: I’m not finding the Labour Party a very welcoming environment for women right now as are a lot of women as this reflected in your latest poling.

D: And in respect to my actual question.

V: Sorry, can you repeat the question?

D: What effect do you expect your post and ones like it might have upon the Labour Party in terms of it being a welcoming environment for people from different backgrounds, such as transpeople?

V: What effect? I expect this particular post to have very little effect because it’s just my Twitter and I’m not an Officer of the Labour Party. I’m just a member of the Labour Party and I think we should be able to discuss these issues without being suspended or investigated.

D: What effect do you believe this post and posts like it may have upon public perception of the Labour Party?

V: I don’t think any. I don’t think Labour members discussing Labour policy, I think it shows a Labour Party that is willing to engage in debate. I don’t think women should be silenced for the feelings of trans-identifying men. If you look at Heather Peto’s own Twitter profile I don’t think h** particularly bothered about my feelings either. Other Labour members including Heather Peto who have elected, official roles in the Labour Party, not just members like myself, some of the things that they’re saying about women have the potential to discredit the Labour Party far more widely than my posts.

D: In Item C1 you reply to a post by Paris Lees. She says, “If it isn’t intersectional it isn’t feminism” and you replied, “If it has a penis it isn’t female”. What do you mean by ‘it’?

V: Just copying the words that are written in Paris’ post. So I’m just changing as little as I can to make my point. I’m not referring to Paris Lees. When I talk about male and female I’m not just talking about humans, I’m talking about all species of the animal kingdom. If it has a penis it isn’t female and that applies to a human or a cat, or any such creature. Paris’ is a general point and so’s mine.

D: So are you or are you not referring to Paris Lees as ‘it’?

V: I’m not referring to Paris Lees as ‘it’. I don’t think you’ll find any evidence on my social media where I’m calling people ‘it’.

D: Do you believe that a reasonable person looking

[at?] this post might assume that you were describing Paris Lees as ‘it’?

V: No, I don’t think so. I don’t think that’s a reasonable assumption to make from that post I’m afraid. I think I said, “If it has a penis it isn’t a woman” I would be talking about a particular person, but as I say that male and female can be used to describe humans but they can also be described generally of any creature.

D: Is feminism a notion that exists in the animal kingdom?

V: No, I’m not talking about feminism. I’m talking about male and female.

D: Yes. My point is…

V: [Overspeaking] Feminism, obviously no. As far as I know is not a belief system amongst animals other than humans.

D: So this is a conversation about feminism?

V: No, this is Paris Lees’ pinned Tweet. Paris Lees says, “If it isn’t intersectional it isn’t female”. I’m not talking about feminism, I’m talking about male and female. If it has a penis it isn’t female. I think it’d be a misunderstanding that post to say that I was referring to Paris or any other person in that way. If you look at my social media profile you can see that I have never described any person as ‘it’. "(continues)
mirandayardley.com/en/the-labour-party-is-no-longer-safe-place-for-women-venice-allan/

NB it was a bit tricky to find articles which include the transcript due to Venice Allan & others being banned from Twitter and Gendertrander from Wordpress

interview with Allan here:
www.feministcurrent.com/2018/09/24/interview-irrepressible-venice-allan-fight-changes-uk-gender-recognition-act/

Cara Delevingne Wants You To Know Trans Activist Lily Madigan | Teen Vogue
1,328,822 views

www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=15&v=a2VSyCrzhXE

Lily provides a narrative.

Maybe the video will help Lily remember her life, now that her memory has been wiped

dilly what is the story about the memory. Sounds like a very clunky plot device.

Yes it's rather odd. Like very conveniently odd.

Lily was "in hospital" last night because of a "head injury" which has "wiped her memory".

She tweeted about it - and she is currently in another twitter spat with a black woman who is challenging Lily about her comments. It is interesting - Lily just responds by playing the victim. Shades of the twitter debacle a few months back when Lily said she felt uncomfortable around black people.

Here

Gosh, how timely.

Deus ex machina for the win!

Lily was "in hospital" last night because of a "head injury" which has "wiped her memory".

She tweeted about it - and she is currently in another twitter spat with a black woman who is challenging Lily about her comments.

So memory not wiped then if this twitter spat is happening post the bumped head?
Seems likely no harm done which is good.

Comments to the woman (adult human female) who is black, not good.

anyone from any of the Labour, Momentum, NUS, Trans communities going to try to stop this/ minimise damage etc?

anyone from any of the Labour, Momentum, NUS, Trans communities going to try to stop this/ minimise damage etc?

Its really not a good sign when Madigan starts saying things like, "the statistics are clear"

This thread is about the LM issue. Apparently it is OK to make assertions about other posters, though. ( see @ 12.50 today, and repeated at @ 13.29) Since I have taken part in this discussion, and had my contributions discounted by some as coming from someone who has seemed to be " deceitful and manipulative" on this and other matters, I feel I can say in defence of my comments on LM that ;

I can truthfully say that I have been on Mumsnet as Kay M, Ceinwen , and Kay M 2. Some readers will know that I have always been Kay M on all websites, transgender ones or otherwise. This is because my legal name is Kay Mxxxxxxx, so I am being more truthful about my identity than most people. I was Ceinwen for a short while, because after some hard things were said, I retreated. But I found out that it was only a minority who were being unpleasant. So I came back; I believe I told Mumnet HQ who I was . It was me who " owned up" that Ceinwen was me.

If anyone thinks that I have been here under other names, I will say now that I have never done that. As it happens, it is not uncommon for people to be on Mumsnet under a variety of names, spottable by textural analysis, but it ain't me. I have no need for secrecy.

Now, back to LM; the fact that some of us try to see her, and the issues surrounding her, in nuanced terms, is not manipulative. People are not all good, or all bad. Everybody, including LM , is the hero in their own story.

There are massive issues here, for women, for the Labour Party, for transgender people. All that results from unrelenting suspicion and insults is more people starting to dismiss the justified misgivings about self I-D, and transgender people being in single sex spaces as scare mongering.

We are not trying to position ourselves as" in the centre", as a tactic. That is where we are. Why not hold your nose and put up with us as "arms-length allies"? And being nasty to us on MM only fills our inboxes with messages from polite people, who don't approve of the insulting posts.

Loving this:

Anna @anncirca
You’ve uploaded pics of you wearing Calvin Klein and diesel clothing as well as wearing an Apple Watch, how do you afford these things without a job?

Lily Madigan
The Apple Watch was a gift and the others were from a photoshoot.

Sar'z @sarz_world
Sell it!!

Lily Madigan
You want me to sell my watch?

I use it everyday and it monitors my heart rate because it gets high sometimes and I have to know to relax.

Can you imagine a single mother on benefits coming out with that crap, whilst simultaneously claiming that she wasn't middle class?

A Jarvis Cocker moment if ever I saw one.

Other people would be accused of scamming or gifting in this situation.

Talk about being out of touch with reality and what poverty looks like.

Yes - with Lily there is always a reason and excuse. Accused of being materialistic and taking things from the evil capitalist Western world, she suddenly says it's for her "health"

Perhaps Lily should use brains and instead of getting payment via 'gifts' ask to be paid with money.

Of course if you accept gifts for work, then HMRC can't tax you... And yes HMRC would be interested in individuals who get lots of gifts in return for work.

mutters Al Capone under breathe

Can't someone "gift" her a hairbrush?

Can you imagine a single mother on benefits coming out with that crap, whilst simultaneously claiming that she wasn't middle class?

Or jollying off to hang out with well known commoner, Cara Delagetsonlangsnerves?

It's the people who come from comfortable middle-class backgrounds that try to describe themselves as working class the most.

Lily's mother has her own business. Her father is a builder - builders actually earn good money. And Lily seems uncomfortable in her interactions and thoughts about people of colour. I think Lily comes from a safe, nice, middle-class, white, fairly privileged background.

Ultimately though, as we all keep saying, the Labour Party is going to have to deal with making itself a welcoming place for women and to deal with misogynist entryists - there are plenty of them. Last poll I saw, the lead it had with women over the Tories has completely reversed to a lead for the Tories. The Tories! Winning women! FFS.

Perhaps it will need to lose yet another election before it comes to its senses?