How do SA and rape survivors cope in this climate?

[JohnnyMcGrathSaysFuckOff]

When I gave birth last Feb, the staff wanted a load of people observing me inc men. I always knew I wouldn't cope well with that but when it came to it, he strength of my feeling surprised me. I couldn't go through it.

I was told last week that that same hospital now employs a transwoman ultrasonographer in the EPU who specialises in vaginal US. The person who told me was a local GP, speaking to me in a social context. He said some of his patients had been distressed by it.

It got me thinking - how do you/ would you cope as a survivor faced with that kind of thing? For me, loos aren't so much an issue but healthcare definitely is. But we all have our specific triggers.... what do we do if we cannot avoid them?

Why is it that women always have to move over so they can make way for men’s ‘feminine feelz’? Why is it more acceptable to overlook women’s very reasonable fears so that men can feel validated, as if that is more important?

I accept that not all women feel like this and that’s fine. We’re all different. But men are not women.

If you request a female, you should be given one, and you should be informed if the female is a transwoman prior to your appointment so that you can make an informed decision.

No, if you request a female you should not be offered a male person.

The NHS should never be putting forward transwomen HCPs as females when female requested or intimate care/examination unchaperoned.
If there are transwomen HCPs who do not recognise why this is innapropriate and contrary to fundemental principles of good practice, consent etc, there is a serious issue & training need.

They are not female.

Sex matters

From this thread I’m getting

- women who have been raped or sexually assualted and now don’t want strange men performing intimate examinations are irrational, not thinking about men’s jobs, boring and basic with their experiences of sexual violence, need to get over it because men are half the population and you can’t avoid them all
- women who have been sexually assaulted by women have a more important experience and this is something other women should apologise for if they don’t centre it in their response regarding their experiences

Actually I am getting the exact opposite - that only women assaulted by men should expect to be accommodated in their need to choose the sex of the hcp and that women assaulted by men are judged as having the more important experience. That women assaulted by women are expected to move over and that their needs don't count.

saying you’ve been raped or sexually assaulted by a hcp is ignored as a minor detail when someone’s up on their high horse because it doesn’t fit their point they’re pushing

There are a lot of really important comments on this thread by women who have been assaulted.
They really should be respected better.

The OP started the thread specifically to discuss how SA and rape survivors coped in this climate .

for all who have talked about their experiences and also for those reading who have been affected.

The NHS should never be putting forward transwomen HCPs as females when female requested or intimate care/examination unchaperoned.

If there are transwomen HCPs who do not recognise why this is innapropriate and contrary to fundemental principles of good practice, consent etc, there is a serious issue & training need

This very much needs to be recognised.

Clearly the solution is for women to always be asked prior to appointment "do you have a preference for an HCP? We have a trans woman/trans man/female, male HCP available" (as applicable, even using "cis" if necessary to be PC.) The woman can then say what she prefers. In a situation where an appointment is not made, the nurse should then tell the woman for example "we have a male/trans woman HCP available now, but if you're not okay with that we can wait until a (cis) female HCP is available to see you."
All the relevant details up front, non-judgementally, with the option to choose.

women who have been raped or sexually assualted and now don’t want strange men performing intimate examinations are irrational, not thinking about men’s jobs, boring and basic with their experiences of sexual violence, need to get over it because men are half the population and you can’t avoid them all

You have completely twisted it tbh.
I didn’t think you even deserved a response, but on the off chance you struggle to interpret things rather than you’re deliberately twisting things I thought I should. Men are half the population, you can’t say no men in the hospital ever, if you want that sort of care then go private.
In terms of actually performing the procedure I have said and as has everyone else that if you request a female you should get a female. If the trust regards a transwoman as a female, they need to let the woman know in advance so she has the option to decline.
Saying everyone should by default be offered a female, is saying that men in the profession shouldn’t work there, men who have trained and studied to get to where they are. Some woman have a problem with a man giving a smear or similar, some woman do not. saying that every one should be defaulted to a woman, would push men out of the profession in order to pander to some.
The current rules work fine, if you want a woman then request one. This has turned into some sort of parallel universe where you think all woman hate/are scared of men, it’s actually a small minority. But if they want a female, yes they should absolutely be given one.
And FYI the only people that were criticised over how they react after being sexually assaulted were me and people with experiences like mine that don’t have an issue with all men afterwards.

"Men are half the population, you can’t say no men in the hospital ever, "

Has anyoen said this?

Not wanting a man to do your smear also doesn't mean you "hate men" what on earth?

Aside - I really hate it when people refer to women as "a female" rather than just "female". It's so dehumanizing, like you're not sure if you're talking about a person or a sheep or a cow. It's one of those tells for someone spending a lot of time in spaces full of men who don't like women very much, in my experience.

The current rules work fine, if you want a woman then request one.

Well actually, why not just ask the patient's preferences? Rather than making a potentially vulnerable woman have to gather the strength to speak up for herself?

Well, ‘if you request female’ doesn’t make sense does it? ‘If you request a female’ does. Stop trying to make everything into an attack on woman.

Scrumplestiltskin

Exactly.

Would be easy enough to add "Do you prefer to be seen by a female HCP?" to the forms patients fill in, or to the questions asked when booking the appointment. It makes sense to do so for the procedures where that's a very common request, and those who for whatever reason would prefer a man instead could say so. So it's interesting when people balk at the idea of women automatically being given the opportunity to make a choice, and instead want to create a series of hoops that women need to jump through.

Just to clarify I was agreeing with Scrumplestiltskin first post.

And EarlyWalker exactly right.

I am a female and actually I can choose to call myself whatever I like.

Patients should be able to request a woman and have that be assumed to mean a female human, but since certain people are determined to muddy the waters...

Also, as a woman who has suffered CSA and also rape and assault as an adolescent, I prefer female HCPs. If a male HCP is sprung on me in an unavoidable/rushed situation I feel very wary, trembly, and frightened - catapulted back to being a helpless child victim again. Saying no in the moment to a man is impossible for me - I freeze up like I did when I was being abused and comply, while feeling violated and retraumatised.
I did have a male surgeon and anesthesiologist during my c section, which was unavoidable, and cried due to that and other fears on my way into theatre. Happily my husband was there which kept me grounded, and the anesthesiologist ended up being a lovely, kind, likeable man who held my hand, chatted to me, and kept me calm when a few things went wrong. So I do recognise that male HCPs can be fantastic.
But given a choice ahead of time, I would always choose females. My healthcare should not be retraumatising if it can possibly be avoided.
And it can be mostly, by (where possible) actively asking a patient for their preferences.

Well actually, why not just ask the patient's preferences? Rather than making a potentially vulnerable woman have to gather the strength to speak up for herself?

Well in an ideal world this would be great, but in reality have you visited an NHS hospital recently? I had to wait 10 weeks while I was bleeding uncontrollably due to retained miscarriage products just have a procedure. The only person who did this procedure at the hospital was a man, I dread to think how long id have waited if I had been asked which dr I’d prefer. sometimes it’s just not feasible to offer everyone a choice, but if you have a preference then of course it should be adhered too.

If the trust regards a transwoman as a female, they need to let the woman know in advance so she has the option to decline

No, this is likely the 'clerical error' that was identified as the cause of the issue in the NHS Trust's apology.

With regards providing medical & intimate care: the patient's needs, safeguarding, good practice and consent require that the NHS do not put forward/ regard transwomen (who are male) as female HCPs.

Scrumple

And it can be mostly, by (where possible) actively asking a patient for their preferences.

Yep. So let's do that, and not follow it up with eleventy billion layers of "ah, yes, but what does woman or female mean to you (you potential bigot)?"

No, this is likely the 'clerical error' that was identified as the cause of the issue in the NHS Trust's apology.

Indeed.

It makes sense to do so for the procedures where that's a very common request, and those who for whatever reason would prefer a man instead could say so. So it's interesting when people balk at the idea of women automatically being given the opportunity to make a choice, and instead want to create a series of hoops that women need to jump through.

Yes it is really interesting. I, and others, made this suggestion hours ago but got told that no, the default should be for female hcps and anyone not wanting that has to specifically ask.

Why would people be so against women being offered a choice?

You should ask Early that. I'll make the popcorn.

Do you prefer to be seen by a female HCP

Angry just a side note, I hope you realised you just referred to female as ‘a female’ do you hate woman and spend a lot of time around men?

As people have said, women can be asked when they join the practice whether they would prefer a female HCP. And then if there isn't one available and it will cause delay they can be offered a male one if they wish, with the understanding that they have the preference for a woman. But it should be centred around the patient and they shouldn't feel pressure in the moment.

And when they say female, that is what it means.