Ffs lib dems

[QuentinWinters]

Just opened my inbox to this little gem from the lib dems. I'm going to resign my membership I think.

Self-ID is libdem policy and has been for many many years

I didn't ask about Self ID. I asked about what you said which was:

You may well have concerns about who you are changing with, and who your mother is sharing a ward with, but those concerns just simply aren't going to change our policy or our minds.

You are saying that the Liberal Democrats are not interested in the concerns of elderly people in hospital. Is that something that Lib Dem candidates would be prepared to support?

Sarah Olney only lost by 40 seats in Richmond. Do you think she is prepared to back you up?

It's just my elderly parents have 2 votes in Richmond.

And they have always voted Lib Dem.

Orangesnake, why have NO lesbians decided to stand for the LGBT LD executive? Don't you think it odd? Or concerning? Or lacking in diversity?

Well the Chair is a bisexual (or pansexual i'm not actually sure how she personally identifies), and has a female queer perspective. There are lesbian trans women on there as well. While many more women then there currently is would be desirable, its a systematic problem across all parts of all parties and not a specific issue with LGBT LDs.

You are saying that the Liberal Democrats are not interested in the concerns of elderly people in hospital.

I'm saying the perceived concerns that people have of the affect of trans women being on hospital wards is not going to change libdem policy. Because those concerns are unfounded and baseless. Trans women do not pose a threat to elderly women on hospital wards.

I’ve only ever attended local meetings and never made a conference but I have never seen another BAME person there. I’m also usually the only person under 40.

There are lesbian trans women on there as well.

You mean trans homophobes?

Self id does though. Fairly obviously.

If male bodied trans women don't pose any threat at all, why do we bother having single sex wards at all?

And why is safety the only issue? What about dignity and privacy?

Why not do away with any sex segregated spaces then? Have mixed sex spaces everywhere and never divide into men’s and women’s under any circumstances.

Lols at orange snake
Hahaha 🤦‍♀️🤦‍♀️
Crack on. You destroying libdems almost single handed

I am still awaiting this discussion on democracy within the Liberal Democrats...

Why the silence?

Gone down the Borg plughole red

Firstly, there is nothing currently stopping abusive/violent men from just walking into a womens toilet, and some do and that is an issue with male violence that we need to tackle and face as a society
Social convention and the real possibility of other women being in or about to enter the same room is a deterrent of sorts. Being able to just walk in unchallenged is No longer a deterrent.

But the idea that there is a single abusive man who is not carrying out their abuse because they don't want to break into a womens space
and instead want to go through the process of legally changing their gender (which while self-ID will make it easier, it would still require them changing their legal gender and likely not being able to change
it back easily, if at all), is just absurd and delusional. It just fundamentally misunderstands how abusive men behave

In the Scottish consultation thingy it was asked how many times a person should be allowed to change 'gender'
And abusive men will go to many lengths to abuse. Join a religion, become a dj, get to the top of the tree in any sphere (Harvey weinstein).
Soon they will just be able to pronounce woman and get in any space. We can't ask for proof, we can't do anything other than confirm. Else we will be 're-educated '

Trans women are not Adult Human Females. Women don't have penises. I'm glad you don't want my vote because you wouldn't have been getting it anyway - the Lib Dems only have 12 MPs in 650 ! Hardly in a position of power are they.

lesbian trans women

Heterosexual men.

Actually a few more pages of this and the LibDems will have no voters left.

Well quite clearly.

I do like discussing homophobia and democracy with Liberal Democrats.

I know the local party around here, isn't like that. The gulf between the grass roots and the central party who can afford the time and money to have a party in Brighton (of all places - makes you wonder who planned that one) for a weekend, is astonishing.

Trans women do not pose a threat to elderly women on hospital wards.

The question is not whether trans women pose a threat, but whether women have a right to single sex hospital wards. Most men do not pose a threat to women, but it is accepted practice within the NHS that hospital wards should be single sex to protect privacy and dignity.

You can argue that under the current system (with gate keeping) a trans woman with a GRC must be legally treated as a woman, and that it is within the NHS's power to sensitively accommodate the 4,000 people with a GRC.

However under self ID there is no objective way of deciding who should have a GRC and no gatekeeping.

I look forward to Vince Cable explaining why the Lib Dems support mixed sex wards.

Well the Chair is a bisexual (or pansexual i'm not actually sure how she personally identifies), and has a female queer perspective.

So is she, like, male female, or actual female female?

If you think that males can be female, what does female even mean on this context?

How do we know what you’re on about?

Women do not have a right to dignity. They do not have a right to speak. They do not have a right to participate in democracy if they can't get to Brighton. They can not be homosexuals. It is fair to intimidate women.

Anymore things the LDs support we should add to the list?

But the idea that there is a single abusive man who is not carrying out their abuse because they don't want to break into a womens space
and instead want to go through the process of legally changing their gender (which while self-ID will make it easier, it would still require them changing their legal gender and likely not being able to change
it back easily, if at all), is just absurd and delusional.

You haven't been following the situation with the man in Canada who has been trying to get intimate waxing services from women in their homes then?

I'm saying the perceived concerns that people have of the affect of trans women being on hospital wards is not going to change libdem policy. Because those concerns are unfounded and baseless. Trans women do not pose a threat to elderly women on hospital wards.

I did not say threat. My mother has 89 years of female socialisation. 10 years into Alzheimers, she is not going to change her ingrained attitudes. Dignity is important. When she was in convalescent care she was upset about being helped in a shower by a male carer, though accepted it. But having to share sleeping space with people she would see as men, is many steps too far. I assume that a Muslim woman, or anyone with a conservative upbringing would feel the same.

(Though FWIW I assume that the LibDems risk assessments would have pulled up that there are risks involved when not seperating people of different sexes in a dementia care setting.)

Sorry LibDems, but compassion has a place in politics, As well as an understanding that diversity includes diversity of background, and hence of attitudes and socialisation

Red I think they are just saying we should STFU, and then vote for them because
I can't quite fathom out why

Merrymouse, there are no problems with self ID in other countries

waves hand in a jedi mind trick manner

Why should I vote Liberal Democrat?

Can ANYONE give me a reason?

I'm a Remainer, but that's not relevant to local politics, and the people's vote policy is only time limited.

I have voted LD previously.