Posie on This Morning

[RepealtheGRA]

Posie Parker will be on This Morning tomorrow.

Not sure which TRA/AWA will be provided for her to chew up and spit out though.

A better response would have been "What about women in the refuge?"

But, hey, Posie's response while seemingly harsh was valid. I'd not have done any better.

I think PP needed to be a bit more sympathetic to India's journey.

No. I was one of the feminists who was sympathetic to the journey of transsexuals back before the GRA.

I ignored the feminists who refused to comply. I thought they were mean, even though they weren't. They were just stating the truth as they saw it.

I should have listened.

I will never again ask a woman to be nice, be emphatic, be understanding when she is arguing for the rights of our sex.

When I read Stephen Whittle boasting on how they got the GRA through under the radar, it makes me feel sick and it makes me feel used.

And I'm sorry we didn't set off the alarm back then.

There is no "journey". People are allowed to alter their appearance as they wish, but fundamentally India is exactly the same person as before, just with longer hair and a few body mods. The whole idea that taking hormones and undergoing elective plastic surgery is some sort of hero's journey needs to be challenged.

Where can Posie - and other GC feminists – go? For the most part the media aren't covering this issue, and when they are, they're doing it in an extremely biased way. If much of the internet is closed off, and broadcast media is hostile, and you're not even allowed to post up a dictionary definition on a sodding billboard, what are your options?

Just repeating you, hackmum. What are women's options, if we are not "nice"?

I posted a comment on the youtube of this and went out. Just went to look to see if anymore had been added they've gone and disabled comments and removed the ones that were there!

Saying if she got raped she should start her own organisation was a bit much even for me.

Why? If gay men and/or trans males are subject to domestic abuse and need refuges, they should get their own so that they don't trigger the women and children in female refuges who have PTSD related to the male body.

If you think that is an unkind thing to suggest, it's clear to me that you don't give much of a shit about abused women.

No, sorry, ‘enriched’ but it is NOT our problem to fix if India or other transwomen are being assaulted BY MEN. Inserting that into the conversation was deliberate emotional manipulation and I applaud Posie for not just immediately accepting it was her problem to fix. Because it damn well isn’t. The entire thing was, India has had a hard time, transwomen need help, shouldn’t women stop everything & fix this too? NO. NO. NO. I damn well want those of us appearing in media etc to say it loud and clear: This is about women protecting their own rights, we are NOT obliged to prioritise anyone else’s because their ‘journey’ has been hard. Sorry but I have had the week from hell with my period/endometriosis so my fucking journey is hard too.

I think PP needed to be a bit more sympathetic to India's journey

Why, where is she going? [cpnfused]

Performing femininity and putting pressure on other women to perform femininity is not the way to smash gender stereotypes.

Fight it sisters

I am not sympathetic either.

It used to be that we used 'she' to 'be nice' and spare feelings. Then they claimed the word and gender women

GC people started talking about sex and female and lo and behold... that includes them too. I bet they go after the dictionary folk next. Give an inch and a mile is taken.

Plain talking is exactly what is needed. The emperor has no clothes... TWAM

Fight it sisters

Aye --

and I don't actually buy into the concept of a sisterhood--

Yes, I know (and understand) why you don't think she should have been sympathetic to IW, as you guys know the background of the whole debate. However the spot on TM was a chance to bring the GC viewpoint into the public sphere - to people who have no idea about the background of the debate.
I think a lot of people (including myself) do have sympathy for people with genuine gender dysphoria. However that does not mean I have to believe that they are women. It certainly doesn't mean I have to believe that Bunce who puts on a dress every now and again is a woman, deserving of accolades intended for women.

Yes. I am getting infuriated atm with these bloody wet lettuce comments.

We need badaass not wet lettuce.

Keep punching through the syrupy, manipulative, gaslighting shit Posie!

Why is Posie the only woman told off for not being nice enough?

Why isn't India being told off for not being more agreeable towards Posie?

India could have been nicer to Posie. India could have said she agrees that Karen White shouldn't be in a women's prison. She could have said she agrees that a female should not have to accept a search by a male bodied policeman if he says he feels like a woman. India could have been much more empathetic with women seeing as she says she is one. Nobody's saying that about India though. I wonder why not.

'it is NOT our problem to fix if India or other transwomen are being assaulted BY MEN.'

I think PP needed to be a bit more sympathetic to India's journey. Saying if she got raped she should start her own organisation was a bit much even for me.

IW made it emotive, she upped the ante to be deliberately provocative with her example, she was goading Posie. She may not have been "sympathetic" but it was a hypothetical example designed to press right into the heart of an argument that SHOULD get all women cross.

She chose to use rape as her example. IW said if she was raped (hypothetically, I am assuming she has no real life experience of rape as a woman because she transitioned quite recently) where should she go - why couldn't she go to a women's shelter?

Do you not see the staggering self-absorption in that? That IW chooses to imagine her own plight BUT NOT THE OTHER SURVIVORS OF MALE VIOLENCE? And that she used it as an example to centre herself and goad PP to seem unsympathetic.

We should all be as mad and unsympathetic as PP.

IW wasn't being "nice", either.

Yes ... And nobody is saying -"India can you stop fucking talking about yourself all the time?".

I thought Posie was great. Articulate and concise, in stark contrast to the waffly ' But what about India's feelz' of E and R. Someone should ask Eamonn whether he would shag a transwoman. They never seem to want to answer that one, strangely enough.

Also Eamon asking Posie to have empathy with India. How the fuck is she supposed to empathise with a situation that has bugger all to do with her?

Eamonn is falling foul of the sort of techniques that are used to coerce people into contributing to crowdfunding of 'alternative' cures for terminally ill people.

It doesn't matter how much sympathy and empathy one has for the ill person - it's not magically going to make nonsense into life-saving medicine.

*Enriched
*
In a limited time it will stop the GC expressing their view.

It's the return of the angry feminist trope and it doesn't matter how kind or conciliatory one is, it won't be enough.

Posie is one voice, she will speak to some.

'We need badaass not wet lettuce.

Keep punching through the syrupy, manipulative, gaslighting shit Posie!'

So much this.
Posie is reminding me of Germaine Greer - not that I am suggesting she has anything like Greer's originality or analysis, but Greer is always great on tv because she says what she thinks loudly and clearly and doesn't apologise for it.

I am guessing that before this thing is through, Posie will have said more than one thing that makes a lot of us take sharp intakes of breath and go 'well I don't agree with THAT,' but that's fine.

why couldn't she go to a women's shelter

I wonder how many will think aww poor India and others will think that's not what shelters are for.

I think a lot of people (including myself) do have sympathy for people with genuine gender dysphoria. However that does not mean I have to believe that they are women.

I think it would be AMAZING if someone was allowed on TV to say this, calmly and clearly, over and over.

But TV demands "debate" so if you don't like Posie Parker then you won't get anyone at all. That's the reality.

Being nice is not going to get anyone booked to discuss the issues.

You can't talk about it:

-- in terms of safeguarding women (prison rapes)
-- in terms of safeguarding children (GirlGuiding)
-- in terms of logic (can't change sex)
-- in terms of definitions (legal, dictionary)

You can only talk about it if you acknowledge beliefs and feelings.

What is this world we are in?

@AngryAttackKittens I totally agree.
The point she made about what it means to "live as a woman" was good. But we needed more on that.
I'm not saying PPs view points are wrong or that she shouldn't be angry or "not nice".
What I mean is, it was a really good opportunity to peak trans people who are supportive of the trans community, but have no idea how far it's all gone. A lot of people believe all trans women have had surgery and live quiet lives. They won't understand why PP is so cross about that.