Girl guiding email to parents.

[Wildboar]

Has anyone seen the mass email sent out this evening? They haven’t acknowledged any concerns put to them. All they have stated that there is no risk and they won’t inform parents of transgender members due to data protection laws.

Firgot????

What da fuck!!

A lot of discussion since I was around this morning, but I would just like to re-post an important point from MsBeaujangles

In light of the post below it makes it even more frustrating that Muslim girls, foster children and those who have suffered abuse should lose a safe space just to appease a tiny minority.

*"I work with trans kids. Trans girls are not girls and trans boys are not boys and it is not helpful for anyone to suggest they are. it is think thinking that denies kids access to the support they need.

The vast majority of children I work with (well over 90%) end up feeling comfortable with their natal sex. Those that don't need support managing their dysphoria. No therapist or medic worth their salt would suggest disassociation as a healthy way forward. Whilst you may be well intentioned in saying people should see trans girls as girls etc. but I think this is problematic not only for natal girls but also to the trans kids trying to cope with very difficult circumstances."*

When thinking about their trans strategy, they could have decided to encourage male bodied applicants to steer towards the Scouts. But instead, they decided to encourage female bodied members to leave and male bodied non members to join. That makes no sense for a girl orientated organisation. Or a trans friendly one.

Why have people decided that gender identity reigns supreme in the face of all evidence that discrimination is sex based?

I don't think this has been posted

metro.co.uk/2018/09/26/girlguiding-including-trans-members-is-not-up-for-debate-im-sick-of-defending-my-identity-7981058/?ito=twitter

Why should anyone care what Owl's opinion of the GG guidelines are?

The media category of "professional trans person" really needs to go.

time Interesting.

I see however Owl makes no mention of the transboys that would be managed out of GG, so where is their support? Why are they not also allowed to access activities that will help them to grow?

Again, all those shouting transphobia about the transgirls seem to have forgotten about the transboys.

There's a lot to take issue with in that article.

I see however Owl makes no mention of the transboys that would be managed out of GG
Of course it doesn't it twists things to be Anti-trans rather than pointing out the issue is very little To do with trans children joining and everything to do with poor guidelines based on infringement of everyone else's rights, and the complete shutdown of communication and secretcy on the safeguarding policy.

But being level headed isn't in, everything needs to be black and white, so being against this means you want trans people do die and so on.

Ugh. Thanks for posting that article Time but Ugh.

It’s the fucking same old same old.

No one is debating your existence!

No one is calling trans teens ‘predators’!

No one is ‘dressing anything up as a concern’ to thinly veil prejudice or transphobia. They’re questioning safeguarding priorities that don’t stand up to scrutiny.

The GG safeguarding is not ‘robust’ on this point.

A proudly single-sex organisation has stealthily changed its remit without consultation or transparency.

I’m interested in this though:

Girl Guide’s policy has already been in place for several years now

I thought it was updated in 2017? So no more than 18 months, surely? But actually I thought these new guidelines came in officially much more recently?

Metro need to fact check and clarify if necessary...

If I didnt want to discuss something, I'd probably write an article discussing it.

Maybe someone should point out that these are totally different to the scout's guidelines?

I suspect that not wanting to discuss it may not have been why Owl and Fox didn't want to go on TV to talk about this.

I see however Owl makes no mention of the transboys that would be managed out of GG, so where is their support? Why are they not also allowed to access activities that will help them to grow?

Why would they mention that, afterall it doesn't fit with the rhetoric of everyone is being mean to trans people and won't anyone think of the children, they just want to be allowed to enjoy the group with their friends.

It's twisting the facts to fit with their agenda. Just like they twisted the 86% of girls in guiding think trans people shouldn't be discriminated against, into them somehow being ok with trans girls joining their single sex space.

So what is the argument? Parents shouldn't be cross with our policies secretly allowing teenage boys into their daughters' tents without telling them because we've done it behind their backs for a couple of years now. WTAF?

Girl Guide’s policy has already been in place for several years now

Well if that's the case then girl guides have broken all the rules about safeguarding and put biological girls at risk at the same time. They need to legally be held accountable for this. Without booting out these 'woke' adults who are prepared to put girls at risk, (and indeed have worked their way into the organisation with the sole purpose of doing exactly that) then the organisation is no longer fit for purpose.

How does that fit with issues over respecting religious beliefs? And does that leave them open to being sued for failing to do so?

Times today:
'Ban for Girl Guides who identify as boys'
(extract)
The Times can reveal that the same policy advocates the exclusion of girls who say they are transgender. Those who identify as male or “non-binary” will be discouraged from joining the Guides, while those who are already guides and have taken the “Promise” — the Guides’ oath of allegiance — will be asked to leave, the charity confirmed.

“Girlguiding is for girls and therefore we expect a young person who identifies as male wouldn’t look to join,” the charity said." (continues)

“Guiding will be an important support network for them and we would want to ensure that the process of leaving is done through conversation with the young person and planning what is most appropriate for them.”

Women who identify as male will also be forbidden from taking any adult role that requires them to make the Promise. The policy, which was written with the help of the transgender interest group Gendered Intelligence, has angered parents and guide leaders, who accused Girlguiding of double standards."

concludes:
Girlguiding recently faced criticism for expelling two guide leaders who claimed that the new transgender policy contradicted elements of their safeguarding duties. The women questioned why boys who identify as transgender must be treated differently from the sons of guide leaders.

A Girlguiding spokeswoman said: “We’ve had advice from Stonewall and Gendered Intelligence and continue to review our policy as new guidance and best practice emerges.”
www.thetimes.co.uk/article/0eba70ea-c1da-11e8-a932-84839f5183a4

So two children rock up wanting to join Guides.
One female
One male

The female says,
'I feel like a boy'
And is sent home, no support, no friend group, no nothing for her.
The male says,
'i feel like a girl'
He gets unrestricted access to bathrooms, sleeping rooms, showers and support etc

Is that about right?

Girl Guides... Supporting males, letting down females.

We need someone who has been managed out (and ideally then detransitioned to show the ridiculousness) to sue as a test case. Not nice but nicer than it going to court after someone gets pregnant (could be consensual, not suggesting rape) or worse.

Girl Guides... Supporting males, letting down females.

I think they're letting down males too. Because the males need to learn that the world does not really work like this and that you can't change sex. And there will end up being a backlash - how many will get caught up in that?

BertrandRussell, coming back late to this thread but check out this exchange on Twitter.

twitter.com/spinach_magnet/status/1044823645376454656

Not that it actually answers your question. The reply comes back about the other cohort of religious families, the ones who are fine with mixed sex groups. I guess the answer is that no-one has an answer, nor is anyone interested in looking for one, to what is there now for those girls who needed single-sex spaces.

As I've said elsewhere if children can have the protected characteristic of "gender reassignment" which doesn't require a GRA just an intention then to "live as the opposite gender" then the guides policy is discriminatory.

The Masons will not expell transwomen not because they are being "woke" but because they would be acting in a discriminatory way against males who have protected characteristic of "gender reassignment"*

I find it very odd that trans advocacy groups have not pointed it out. One wonders how the two organisations can be operating in a diametrically opposed fashion without one being called out for being wrong.

• NOTE TO MODS I can't explain the law without mentioning the sex of transwomen.

Oops didn't mean to bold, meant to asterisk my male reference to the Mods note.

Can I ask if anyone has had a reply to their email yet? Are gg simply going to ignore or should I give them a few more days?