Some lighter reading - gender non-confirming goths oppress trans people!

[AngryAttackKittens]

Given how much recent news has been horrifying I thought some of us could do with a laugh, so hear you go - Robert Smith's eyeliner is oppressive to people who want everyone to know that wearing makeup means you're a woman.

www.slate.com/blogs/outward/2017/06/23/goth_culture_needs_to_embrace_the_gender_identities_of_all_its_members.html

I don't want to be mean but, that is so 'Kevin the Goth Teenager does Politics'. But the person is in their 20s.

That has made me smile, though.

I tried really hard to read that and extract some understanding from it but all I got from it was "me, me, me, me, me, me me"

I feel like I'm expected to ring my ex and demand that he give back the necklace he nicked from me many years ago on account of that's a girl's necklace and him wearing it without declaring his pronouns might create a hostile club environment.

OMG dude, leaves the Goths ALONE! As if they don't get enough shit already!

So ridiculous! I remember when being goth was an escape from the world of gender stereotypes, rather than an opportunity to enshrine them and create a 72 page handbook to issue to all you meet on how other people should feel about your lipstick.

Really is the height of privilege when you want to pose as an oppressed group and oppress everyone else at the same time.

Makeup, clothes etc etc do NOT have to be gendered - if someone wants to make them gendered that should be their own issue to sort, stop making it women's/goths/whoever-you-say-is-causing-you-literal-violence-today's problem and just let people wear what they like and learn to live as the sex biological reality has made them.

Men wearing eyeliner, be they goths or not, often look fab, am so annoyed some people are trying to say they have to be women to do it without stepping on some trans-snowflake's toes.

even in fully styled pin-up goth looks. “I’m still explaining myself,” Kuill writes. “I always get weird looks and attention while out, every single day. I’m sorry I have chest hair. I'm sorry I usually have facial hair (because shaving sucks). I'm sorry I can't fit into any of your boxes.”

you're not a fully styled pin-up goth if you have chest hair and stubble - that's why they're looking, because you haven't executed the look properly.

No-one care's you're 'agender' least of all goths..

Excuse me but to whom do I complain about the indie lads in eyeliner and skinny tshirts I fucked in the late 90/early 00s?

The purpose of eyeliner is to draw attention to the eyes. Men also have eyes, and if they're pretty ones might like people to notice them.

I feel that given that the Ancient Egyptians were able to manage this without pretending that painting your face changes your sex then we ought to be able to manage it in 2018 also.

The purpose of eyeliner is to draw attention to the eyes. Men also have eyes, and if they're pretty ones might like people to notice them.

well exactly - look at Tom whatsit in Lucifer (who I presume uses a bit of guyliner)

you're not a fully styled pin-up goth if you have chest hair and stubble - that's why they're looking, because you haven't executed the look properly.

I like you, we should be friends.

RE the skinny lads in eyeliner of one's youth, I'm really hoping none of mine have lost the plot to the extent of pronoun rounds etc.

So - because wider society associates lipstick with women, wearing lipstick as a Goth man makes people think of women, which totally stops them being able to think of you as a transwoman?

But they're still going to wear lipstick because they're too Goth not to?

What?

If Robert Smith triggers them just wait till they see KISS.

Not a goth, or my type, but this is my favorite response to the idea that wearing makeup and having long hair means a male human has a female gender identity.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khal_Drogo#/media/File:Khal_Drogo-Jason_Momoa.jpg

I couldn’t figure out what they were banging on about. Someone thought they were a lassie or something? How on Earth did anyone survive the 70s and 80s?

Dear god, I'm so glad I'm not young now. What is it with their need to pigeon hole their identities into tight little boxes.

At one time there were just mods, rockers and old people! So much simpler!

I wonder if it's possible to be more self obsessed?

People are always hating on goths, which seems unfair as most of the goths I knew growing up were lovely people.

Also happened when Will Smith's kid wore a dress. Apparently it was borderline transphobic to do that while identifying as a man - if men can wear dresses how can people tell transwomen are being (stunning and brave) women when they do it??!

I remember that article! Someone should post it too.

Did you notice the standfirst?
"Goth culture is a haven for gender play, but it can make trans folks feel invisible."
I'll leave it there.

Really, how on earth can Robert Smith trigger anyone?? He’s as benign a pop star as it’s possible to be, surely.

I thought all rock stars wore eyeliner. Are they transphobic?

If it's transphobic to wear a dress while identifying as a man (still trying to bend my brain around that) is it transphobic to wear a dress while not identifying as a woman?

Does your eye shadow mean you’re goth, or does it mean you’re trans?

It's a spoof, surely?? Tell me it's a spoof and no one is actually agonising over whether eyeliner is the hallmark of their niche oppressed identity or a direct contradiction of it...