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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Green Party thread 3

999 replies

FermatsTheorem · 30/08/2018 17:21

Previous thread here:
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3347925-Green-Party-statement-continuation-thread?pg=40

Will post links to AC's public statement and Caroline Lucas's appalling white wash job in a moment, but for me, Andrew Gilligan nails it yet again:
twitter.com/mragilligan/status/1034776005326581767

OP posts:
Thread gallery
31
Rufustheyawningreindeer · 31/08/2018 23:20

CL wants other "talents" to come forward so is not standing for re-election as the Leader. She says that she has enough on her plate and that it's important that more Greens take the strain

Really?

colouringinpro · 31/08/2018 23:25

Where on Twitter is this being said?

thecatfromjapan · 31/08/2018 23:32

I don't know about the 'talents' thing. I suspect that's an pld statement, from when she announced she wouldn't be running for Leader of the Party again.

Is that right?

CL is, however, on Twitter tonight, doing listening and damage limitation.

It's interesting ... to put it mildly.

BUT

It begs the question: where are Jonathon and Amelia?

Did Jonathon know about BlockTerf?

What are his views, and Amelia's views (given they are likely to be elected Co-Leaders)?

BitOfFun · 31/08/2018 23:40

on a break Grin

ecosomething · 31/08/2018 23:58

While there was a view of utter despair for those of us on the gender critical side in the Green Party yesterday following Caroline Lucas's badly-judged article on top of a week of awful dithering and wholly unsatisfactory responses (and a number of members either threw in the towel or were close to it) today there has been something of an encouraging backlash. I've been having private conversations with a number of fellow party members today. The editor of Left Foot Forward (himself an ex Green) has said he had many leading Greens get in touch to give scathing off-the-record quotes about the way the hole thing has been handled. Even Caroline Lucas has been emboldened to be a bit more openly critical (eg criticising AC's involvement in 'Terfblocker' and agreeing to listen to more moderate transsexuals not just hardcore transgender activists. A very significant section of the membership is unhappy about the transgender ideologues but there's been a culture of bullying that has made people fearful to speak out. But the shock and horror at the Challenor case, the poor way its been handled since the revelations last week and CL's sycophantic article yesterday appears to have peak-transed whole swathes of the membership. A backlash is brewing. Finally. Too little too late I know but today feels like we are finally starting to get somewhere.

thecatfromjapan · 01/09/2018 00:17

So much to say about your post ecosomething. Lots to think about.

Something's gone badly wrong with that culture of bullying, though. A culture of bullying so strong, that people trying to act against it are called bullies, and the Leader seems intimidated.

And it's looking a lot as though control of the Party was actually held somewhere quite other. 🙁

thecatfromjapan · 01/09/2018 00:21

I was really impressed with Left Foot Forward, though.

I'm so, so glad this wasn't entirely left to be something only more right-wing outlets would cover.

It would, I think, have been a disaster, in the long-term, if that had happened.

I'm glad The Guardian did cover it. I wish they'd been quicker.

It really matters.

thecatfromjapan · 01/09/2018 00:22

But mainly ...

... good luck on the gender critical side of the GP. 🍀

thecatfromjapan · 01/09/2018 01:27

Hmm. Green Party Women have just issued a statement which effectively redefines 'questioning the oversight and safeguarding practices of a political Party' as 'transphobia'

I want to link but I'm not sure I can.

Anyway, they look to be deep in that 'bunker mindset' of identity politics that they are actually in denial about the shortcomings here.

It's actually quite scary.

They genuinely don't get it & have no idea that their lack of oversight and structural shortcomings are massively wrecking their credibility as a Party capable of organising themselves, running institutions and holding power. And having a seat at the table in matters of governance.

They.just.don't get.it.

thecatfromjapan · 01/09/2018 01:27

thecatfromjapan · 01/09/2018 01:28

Nope. didn't work.

thecatfromjapan · 01/09/2018 01:29

Again.

Green Party thread 3
BitOfFun · 01/09/2018 01:32

Yep, I saw that earlier. Tosh.

RedToothBrush · 01/09/2018 01:35

Cat how many of the Green Party Women Leadership are women not trans women?

MotherForkinShirtBalls · 01/09/2018 01:40

That statement references "survivors" - plural - of Dc's actions and his family separately. Does this hark back to prior questions about if more than one child was violated by this evil man?

And I also add my thanks for all the research, knowledge and insights on this thread.

womanformallyknownaswoman · 01/09/2018 01:46

Green Party Women have just issued a statement which effectively redefines 'questioning the oversight and safeguarding practices of a political Party' as 'transphobia'

I've been posting on the other thread about this - they really don't get it and keep putting their foot in their mouth again and again. Whistleblowing on red flag behaviour isn't transphobic. Conversely constantly putting down whistleblowers is scapegoating on a huge scale. The DARVO in their statements at this stage is mind-blowing.

RedToothBrush · 01/09/2018 01:48

But the shock and horror at the Challenor case, the poor way its been handled since the revelations last week and CL's sycophantic article yesterday appears to have peak-transed whole swathes of the membership

I bloody hope that's true.

Not holding my breathe.

thecatfromjapan · 01/09/2018 01:48

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

thecatfromjapan · 01/09/2018 01:54

Seriously, I actually wonder if the Green Party is actually composed of two distinct factions at this point, with quite dissimilar, non-congruent aims.

And one faction is incapable of reigning in the actions of the other faction; while that faction is incapable of seeing their actions are blowing up the good ship 'Green Party'.

That's a shockingly I'll-thought-out statement from the Women's Group.

womanformallyknownaswoman · 01/09/2018 02:03

That statement references "survivors" - plural - of Dc's actions and his family separately. Does this hark back to prior questions about if more than one child was violated by this evil man?

There's an implicit assumption in their logic that all the children & wife have all been harmed and thus are victims too. That may well be the case - by emotional abuse apart from anything else.

However and this is a big however - some of those victims are adults now and are showing little capacity to self-reflect plus have been incredibly hostile to women demonstrating some dangerous traits of misogyny, breaking boundaries and attacking others. The sad fact is not all victims are remorseful. Some do go on to abuse others and need to be held accountable for that adult action. And it takes time and a lot of therapy to unpack this stuff. And whatever that impact, the GP has to take responsibility for the fact it has allowed itself to be used as abusers by proxy and that many, many women have been harmed in that process.

The GP has become a cult that is openly attacking and hostile to women. That cult needs to be disbanded and amends made. They have destroyed many online lives and caused real injuries. They are not responsible for what DC perpetrated but they are responsible for allowing some of their officials to attack and injury women online and irl on a gross scale. They have been complicit in policy changes that are offensive to, and exclude, women. And when women have complained they have been demeaned and attacked further by those same office holders.

And it's still happening and being labelled as transphobic, which it is not.

RedToothBrush · 01/09/2018 02:05

Cat I am not wondering it. I have been pretty damn certain of it all week.

I'd be more surprised if this didn't tear the party apart.

It's important not to lose sight of Tina Challenor in this. A woman with a serious conviction for animal cruelty who stood for the party, without so much of a blink from HQ.

That really is at odds with the principles and values of so many of the membership.

Tina is most definitely being allowed to hide behind Aimee on this.

You can't use transphobia as a defence here over the party's handling of the family.

I also am unclear over Tina's current membership status. Have I missed where the Green Party informed us all of this in the midst of their series of statements?

thecatfromjapan · 01/09/2018 02:07

Mind you, it sounds as though someone else in the Party is being lined up to take the rap for this.

The statement says: 'What little Aimee knew' was passed on to the Party and calls on the Party to acknowledge this in all subsequent atatements.

Gives the Party a get-out clause with the idea that the information was dropped somewhere along the line.

However, that sounds to me like two factions, fighting it out.

Ouch!

thecatfromjapan · 01/09/2018 02:13

Absolutely agree with you Red

Tina has disappeared.

I suppose people asking questions about the wider Challoner family can't be labelled 'transphobic'.

I honestly think AC is both smokescreen and scapegoat at this point.

How Tina Challoner, with her conviction for animal cruelty, came to stand as a Green Party candidate (for the Council) really is quite the thing.

And is she still a Member? Is she subject to the same disciplinary process as her daughter? Having also used DC as electoral agent in the period? Or has the process been different? Has she been expelled? Is she subject to an investigation?

Mamaryllis · 01/09/2018 02:18

I hope Caroline, Justine, and Sophie can sit down somewhere very very private, drink gin, and be ruthlessly honest about how fed up they are with being unable to be honest in their public facing roles. And then sort this shit show out.
That’s wishful thinking obviously. I’m such a bloody optimist that I find it impossible to believe that bona fide women of their ages are genuinely blind to the issues.
But just in case, my kitchen table is available if you need a safe space, ladies.

thecatfromjapan · 01/09/2018 02:22

It's not good, is it, woman?

Amaryllis 😁