Can we talk about the mental impact of being told the definition of woman is changing?

[UglyCathKidstonBag]

I’d like to hear specifically from women who feel their mental health has been in any way impacted by being told the definition of “woman” has or will change so that it either excludes them or includes men. Has anyone felt their mental health has been impacted by the “erasure” of woman.

I have long term therapy as part of treatment for PTSD and GAD both of which are centred around abuse from various men in my life. I had been able to control both to a manageable state thanks to this treatment until the past 3-6 months.
I am now unable to use places such as gyms, swimming pools, changing rooms and similar settings because of my fear of being in intimate spaces with unknown male bodied people. This is now starting to have a knock on impact for my work.

My mh has been in a serious hole recently. I have been drinking too much, smoking again and eating crap. I have been self harming again, for the first time in years.

It's not just the obvious threat to women's rights. The attitude and TWAWnodebate mantra from everywhere reminds me of gaslighting I have previously experienced. Telling and telling me that what I can see in front of my eyes is wrong, and I'm not allowed to state the truth.

And to have that from somewhere I have relied on heavily for improving my mh over the years is beyond awful.

I have decided I need to act in the small ways I can.

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/scotsnet/3296966-Women-by-definition-no-longer-exist-in-Scotland-What-can-we-do

I feel quite hopeless about thus all sometimes.

I’m also very concerned about freedom of speech. Which is being totally eroded and the way we are trying to be detaching from physical reality.

Another one who has to step away at times. This is so harmful to our individual and collective mental health. When I see what is happening to children and young people in particular - the gaslighting, the deliberate unpicking of safeguarding rules, the casual encouragement of drugs that will harm and sterilise - I think I am going mad. To live in a society where this is actually encouraged, funded and enabled is frightening.

Some days I stay away from online and deliberately do other things to take my mind off what is happening. People are right, it is a massive battle for the safety of women and children so we do need to engage. And we have made massive progress thanks to so many brave women (and men). We have to persist for the sake of others - but we also need to talk about cake and recipes when we're up against the toxic ones.
and for all.

We have to persist for the sake of others - but we also need to talk about cake and recipes when we're up against the toxic ones.

Amen sister!

will help us through the hard times

I'm angry. I think about it at night; it's the first thing I think about upon waking.
I came off Twitter and Insta..too stressful. I discuss stuff on FB but my goodness it's emotionally debilitating when people are trying to threaten you to accept their lies

Yes I feel very scared that we are watching the end of a period of progress. Freedom of speech, the very idea of facts and evidence going up in smoke. Lobbying for decriminisation of prostitution, commercial surrogacy, sex robots, violent porn all being supported by mainstream politicians and academics. The will is now finding the means with new US based global tech companies running roughshod over puny little democracies. Not to mention climate change. I didn't fell this scared in the Cold War.

What I find hard is if you say something GC that the TRAs/handmaidens obviously call upon each other to come and initiate a pile-on

Often it's just me, being GC on a FB post. I'll get LOADS of likes but it's very rare that another person will even say "I agree". I wish we had a FB group where, if we were getting piled on on social media, we could go for support and back up!!

I don't post much here; I use FB a lot

ChickenMe yes, it's the relentless pressure to accept and endorse lies that I find the most personally damaging. I cannot emphasize enough how familiar I am with these coercive techniques in a religious setting - the social pressure, the isolation, the attempts to shame and belittle, the use of repetitious, distorting language, even the co opting of science to create a worldview that shuts out critical thought. I guess the only thing this bunch don't have is the threat of an eternal hell, but I'm sure they're working on it...

Yes Floral to all of what you said.

The attempts to shame and belittle are running right through the threads on FWR like a stick of rock at the moment and are tiresome in the extreme...

Yes Floral it is cult-like and I don't get why the powers that be do not see this.
I'm so grateful that the switched-on women here can see it
It's abusive to force people to lie

My MH is shaky at the moment anyway, but this is making it worse, and I don't seem to be able to step away - it feels too important.

It's the lies that get to me - TWAW - no they're not, they're just not, it's not logical, it's not possible, just no. And the fact that people we should be trusting are fully buying into this, or are being bullied into this, and anyone speaking sense is shouted down.

What does frighten me is that events through the last few years - brexit, Trump, the way vulnerable people are sidelined and oppressed - point towards something bigger on the horizon. It frightens me that all the individual events are adding up to something possibly life changing for many people, but saying this makes you over anxious or pathetic in other's eyes.
There was a video shared the other day saying that from a historical point of view a period of androgyny/self ID usually precedes cultural collapse, and I'm angry that so many people are saying it yet are being ignored.

I'm particularly upset/angry/confused at MNHQ's stance.

The attempts to shame and belittle are running right through the threads on FWR like a stick of rock at the moment and are tiresome in the extreme

It’s like a form of conversion therapy.

Yep. And on that note I shall call it a day on MN. Once you see it, you can't stop noticing the behaviour, and sometimes you have to step away. Already there's a Gadfly employing the belittling tactic on other threads, where those who object to the juggernaut are either evil transphobes or in the thrall of said evil transphobes. And all of us on a 'fools errand'. The toxicity of this is underestimated by the women who sit in power here and have never had to face the endgames of these ploys. I take no pleasure at all in pointing out that they may well come to regret that naiveté.

This is a very important thread. My MH isn’t too bad at the moment, but I suspect only because I am staying as busy as possible to do what I can to fight all of this. I do know that should self-ID be introduced, and some of our fears come to pass, then I will start to struggle. I know what losing your sense of self feels like, and I suspect that’s where it would lead me.

So yes, mostly trying not to think so much on the scary parts and channeling my fear and anger into something positive that might bring in change.

I agree with so much of what has been said in this thread; fears for the future. It’s all stress. It’s important we learn to self-care and support each other.

Something that really gets me is going on twitter and finding some godawful crap by by someone TRA or woke, and then about ten replies supporting them or saying terfs are disgusting or whatever. I find the sheer numbers of supporters for these lies quite overwhelming.

Joy, I didn't see that video, do you have a link to hand?

I feel the same feeling in my chest as when I was living with an abuser. The lies, the belittling, the ridicule. At the same time every time I turn on the tv I see more male violence. My daughter is half convinced she is male, there is no room left for non feminine girls.

Young children now believe you can change sex and the stereotype is what makes you male or female.

We should be fighting stereotypes, not....this.

I am quite despairing about the future.

Something that really gets me is going on twitter and finding some godawful crap by by someone TRA or woke, and then about ten replies supporting them or saying terfs are disgusting or whatever. I find the sheer numbers of supporters for these lies quite overwhelming.

This has always been something that shocked me on Twitter, it feels like the whole world buys into the bs and it's hard to take.

In my more positive moments I try and remember that much of it is virtue signalling and that many of the posters are very young.

Also that thing of "it's a small space so it seems like a lot" is relevant to Twitter, plus who you follow/who they retweet etc etc can make it seem that everyone thinks like this. It's one of the reasons I ration my time on there as I think it's very much a distortion of the real world...at least I hope it is!

Androgyny isn't necessarily a problem, but science denial really really is. The totalitarian nature of the TRAs is the problem. What do I do if when my workplace starts handing out those pronoun badges? I won't be able to go along with it.

The impact on my mental health is already on another thread.

I was a very angry second wave feminist back in the 60s/70s and spent a lot of time challenging entitled men over salaries, mortgages, banking and general male-led fuckwittery.

I thought by the 80s we were slowly getting there. Now male-led fuckwittery coupled with female turkeys voting for Christmas is giving me a sense of deja vu. I am angry again at an age where I should be putting my feet up and feeling mellow.

But the TRA barstewards don't frighten me. I will challenge them on every conceivable occasion they try to shut me up. They can go fuck themselves. I'm too old to care now about me, but I will fight for my daughters' generation and my grandchildren.

I alternate from feeling really angry and incredulous to depressed and hopeless. Yesterday actually made me tearful what with the Women’s and Equalities minister stating TWAW and then MN saying we can’t discuss our biological reality.

I’d like to think the worst case scenario wouldn’t happen but since we already have Brexit and Trump, anything could happen...

In the early 20th century Eugenics became a hugely influential ideology. University departments of Eugenics were opened in the USA and the academic weight and legitimacy they were granted influenced public policy (sterilization of people belonging to minority groups) and were used by the Nazis to justify their own ideology.

Although discredited by the horrors of the holocaust, eugenics still clung on for many years as acceptable.

At the height of the popularity of these ideas some voices came out strongly against eugenics, such as the Catholic church. However this "new" ideology was promoted as sophisticated and with the help of pesudo-science and popular culture these ideas gained currency and were allowed to stand.

This to me is a direct comparison with the ideologies of the trans enthusiasm sweeping the world, by ignoring hard facts of biology and heavily promoting these ideologies through popular culture and even directly being supported by the medical establishment. The very same people (gender non-conforming) that would have been targets of forced sterilisation under Eugenics are now those who are encouraged to dramatically modify their bodies to the point of (surprise!) sterilization and constant lifelong medicalization.

And now to be able to continue with this lack of logic and biological facts women are being told we must accept these ideas, even when they directly negatively affect us and our human rights.

I am shocked at how rapidly these concepts are being embraced with very little critical thinking in how the redefinition of the meaning of "woman" negates women's reality.

The mental impact upon me is I now believe I am being betrayed by the legal, political and medical establishments in which women are already barely represented at the highest levels of leadership. I believe I am being told that reality will be redefined and I MUST accept it or be expected to be verbally or physically attacked if necessary. Or alternatively, silenced, ignored or possibly expect to have my employers contacted in the hope I will lose my job.

That I am no longer allowed free speech and talking about my biological reality is offensive.

In other words I find my mental health is being very negatively affected because I have to accept another person's ideology as having greater authority than my own lived experience as a biological woman.

Popular ideas, even those supported by the law, universities and medical professionals can be wrong, Eugenics is a very recent modern example.

The mental health of women is another aspect of these rapid changes that is completely ignored.

All this is happening at the same time as women are crushed unfairly by austerity measures, they have to sign forms to prove they were raped and claim child benefit. Sexism in schools increasing. The lives of women and girls are steadily declining. Period poverty in schools, sexual assaults increasing. Now they take away our privacy and the words we need to describe our lives. My biggest fear is the youngest generation, they genuinely believe stereotypes are what makes you male or female.

I need to go to work now so I can't contribute fully, what I will say is I do suffer from depression and anxiety and have for many, many years. It can be very severe. These issues have really affected me and I've had to take long periods of time away from looking at anything to do with them. I wish I hadn't but I really have cried over this and worried and my OH has pointed out I have made myself ill over it.

There are many people with issues out there not just one minority group but I can only imagine that I'm not in the group that counts as a woman. Plus ca change.