Why is misgendering a big deal?

[FortunateCookie]

Hope someone can help because I’m really trying to understand why not affirming someone’s identity is that big of a deal.
I understand that it’s polite to go along with whatever someone’s chosen gender identity is, but I can’t believe that it’s actually a big problem if you don’t?
Surely if your friends and family accept your identity, it doesn’t matter if someone at work doesn’t?
Would it really make someone suicidal?
Do any of the trans organisations say why it is so important?
I just don’t get it.

Thought by many in the field to also have a biological component.

Which there is ZERO evidence for. Until scientists can point out the biological etiology of gender dysphoria, your statement is BOLLOX.

Why is it difficult to use the language a person needs to combat their dysmorphia? Imagine going through life being called the wrong name.

I have BDD and if it's triggered then I can end up accidentally harming myself trying to fix it.

Raven88
It is not our job to manage your mental illness.

the incredible weight of lies women are required to tell to and about men on a daily basis to survive the hostile environment men have created is overwhelming.
Now you want to claim that women who refuse to obey you are responsible for what you do to yourself.
Those are traditional abuser tactic you are using. I suggest you get counseling as soon as possible.

Well said thebewilderness

Gaslighting and DARVO on an individual, family, corporate and societal level always portrays women as "the problem" when they refuse to sacrifice their needs on the pyre for someone else's male ego

I wonder if we will ever see the day when men stop telling women what to do, what to say and how to behave.

Luckily we're unlikely to ever see the day when women stop telling them to fuck off when they make those demands either.

Why is it difficult to use the language a person needs to combat their dysmorphia? Imagine going through life being called the wrong name.

Most people will call someone the name they tell them.

If a man cannot leave the house without threats of what they will do to themselves or others, should someone identify them as a man...they need to not leave the house. As thebewilderness says, get some therapy. As for women, it doubles down on exactly WHY these men need to be avoided.

@womanformallyknownaswoman @TERFragetteCity @thebewilderness

I was using my BDD as an example of how dysmorphia can present its self. I've been treated and I'm a lot better. My trigger has nothing to do with my gender. It's to do with skin imperfections and weight. In terms of harm I don't mean self harm I mean trying
to fix the imperfections which can result in me injuring myself or making myself ill. I didn't ask anyone to manage it I do that fine.

I just don't see the issue with using pronouns or names, if it helps someone accept themselves.

A smart person in another thread said...

Mollifying people with this condition is not the job of the public. They need to find a more robust solution than the expectation of collective pretense

And she's right. It's not the job of society, much less specifically of the female half of society, to maintain a collective lie in order to alleviate some people's dysphoria.

And she's right. It's not the job of society, much less specifically of the female half of society, to maintain a collective lie in order to alleviate some people's dysphoria.

This. It shows up the narcissism of this movement. This isn't advocated for other psychological conditions, that we all pretend it's how it is in people's disordered perception.

I just don't see the issue with using pronouns or names

Names, most people will use the name of the person that they have just been introduced to, won't they?

But take a man who was wanted for sex offences. He had escaped and was on the run. Instead of putting the word out that a male sex offender was on the loose, the story was a woman who sometimes dresses as a man should be looked out for.

It twists reality. That reality can be fatal to women. People need to just stop doing it.

@TERFragetteCity I agree in that situation that using a different pronoun is dangerous and shouldn't be allowed.

I think my experience is more with females who don't want to be called she/her so that's why I am more accepting but I see your point.

I am perfectly happy to call transwomen I know by their chosen name and refer to them as she. Not because I worry about the damage misgendering may do but because because it's polite. In the same way I call teachers Mrs X or whatever even though I know their first names.

But media reports of TIM should not refer to them as women. We shouldn't have to look at a photo or read far down into the article to find the violent offender isn't actually a woman.

I just don't see the issue with using pronouns or names, if it helps someone accept themselves.

We've already covered how difficult it would be for people to judge - bearing in mind that some TIMs have full male features such as beards but expect to be addressed as "She".

But it doesn't stop at simply using pronouns and names. It's progressed to male-bodied persons demanding - and in some cases receiving - access to sex segregated spaces simply because they "feel" like a woman. You have a MH condition which can be triggered, so surely you can understand how a woman who has survived sexual violence might not want to share a bathroom with a man? That if she needs to go for a smear test she will be seen by a woman and not by someone who "feels" like a woman?

That progression includes TIMs applying for roles in domestic violence refuges, as rape counsellors, offering themselves up when a woman asks for a female HCP for an intimate physical exam. At what point do you think any of that is reasonable? Can you see that if someone genuinely gave a shit about women they would accept that there are going to be situation where a TIM is not welcome? Yet they are shouting about discrimination and having their "existence" denied - which is a clear indicator that this is nothing to do with respect and everything to do with having their chosen identity validated.

"I don't FEEL I'm a sex. I AM a sex. What you're describing is completely subjective, meaningless and cannot be tested. "

Exactly how trans women feel, I understand.

"access to sex segregated spaces simply because they "feel" like a woman."

Again, trans women don't feel they are women - they know they are women just like we do.

I know I'm a woman because I was born with a vagina and then when I hit puberty I grew breasts and started menstruating, so no.

I don't agree with a male who self identifies as a women entering female spaces. That is too far. My support is for only using pronouns in a social sense. Using she doesn't affect your sex it's just a gender identity. Honestly I've always thought of it more in terms of a young woman identifying as non binary.

@DailyMailClickbait Usually someone will tell you.

Again, trans women don't feel they are women - they know they are women just like we do.

Good for them. They aren't women though. They can have their own reality but the public at large are under no obligation to believe in it

Again, trans women don't feel they are women - they know they are women just like we do.

They can't "know" they are women. They can only know they don't feel like what they think a man should feel. But they are male. So their feelings are male.

Well they are wrong then

Usually someone will tell you.

But that doesn't address the complaints from trans people who are upset that they aren't addressed using their preferred pronouns on a daily basis, does it? I've used the NUStrans conference as an example earlier - multiple complaints on twitter of being "misgendered" by hotel staff.

Imagine you are a hotel receptionist. You have hundreds of guests and visitors walking past you every day. Can you see yourself managing to remember to use the correct pronouns (don't forget "ze" for those who identify as non-binary) all of the time - especially where the person looks like their natal sex but "identifies" as the opposite?

In the case of the twitter complaints, they were upset because the initial address "misgendered" them. But if someone who looks, walks and talks like a man arrives at your reception desk, is it really unreasonable to address them as "sir"?

Again, trans women don't feel they are women - they know they are women just like we do.

But they are not. They can feel all they want but it does not change the reality that they are men.

Honestly I've always thought of it more in terms of a young woman identifying as non binary.

Everyone is non-binary. Unless you are GI Joe or a disney princess, every person on the planet likes a range of things, some of which are categorised by the patriarchy as 'girls' and some as 'boys'. Feminists have been fighting this bullshit categorisation for decades. Nobody is binary. That is the point.