Class analysis...

[BertrandRussell]

Why do people find it so difficult? Am I being too simplistic and missing something?
White people as a class have more power than black people as a class.. Men as a class are more violent than women as a class. Is there anything controversial there?

Oh, I don't know. How about maybe men as a class stepping up and taking responsibility for the way they behave in relationships

That would be fabulous. How do we (society, so that’s all of us) put the wheels in motion to achieve this? (Still not sure what acting as a class means, sounds like individuals acting to me).

"Oh, I don't know. How about maybe men as a class stepping up and taking responsibility for the way they behave in relationships"

Only way to do that is for women to change the way they act. Don't have relationships with these people, don't have kids with these people. If they change in to one of these people, leave them. I don't think its fair to say men as a class behave this way, in my experience it would be a minority... But I accept I may be blinkered.

If it were a minority you would expect that to be reflected in the stats. The reason Bertrand has said ‘as a class’ is because the stats consistently demonstrate women doing twice as much.

Really? I'm genuinely surprised... Told you I may be blinkered.

Do you have a link to these stats? Would be interested to read them.

"Still not sure what acting as a class means, sounds like individuals acting to me)"

That's what I mean by disingenuous ignorance. It's been explained several times.

On the housework front - this is an Australian example sourced from the most recent census.

www.google.com.au/amp/s/theconversation.com/amp/census-2016-women-are-still-disadvantaged-by-the-amount-of-unpaid-housework-they-do-76008

www.europarl.europa.eu/RegData/etudes/STUD/2016/556933/IPOL_STU(2016)556933_EN.pdf

That's what I mean by disingenuous ignorance. It's been explained several times

No you described lots of individuals taking actions.

"Only way to do that is for women to change the way they act. Don't have relationships with these people, don't have kids with these people. If they change in to one of these people, leave them."

I think this may be starting to happen in more egalitarian countries. Then you end up with the likes of incels who blame women for not tolerating them, rather than examining their own tolerability.

When ‘lots of individuals take actions’ and it produces the effect of an inequality because the inequality privileges/disadvantages people along class lines (e.g. lots of individual men are not sharing the burden of childcare/housework, lots of individual women are in the position of having to gain the permission of men in order to make choices about their lives), that is when it becomes a ‘class issue’. That’s how class analysis works.

The reason it is needed is so we can take action to remove the disadvantage/privilege dynamic.

I actually think that it is not just a problem with cultural sexism within heterosexual relationships TBH.

It is also a problem with structural sexism within the economy.

It is really hard for a man to step into sharing ‘women’s work’ because a. It is culturally ‘emasculating’ (due to women’s low status) b. Socialisation around masculinity and the shock of a child can mean many men anxiously cling harder to the idea they ‘must provide’ and c. Structurally and socially the economy massively discincentivises and often actively punishes men who try to prioritise care work. It punishes women too but then you are left with both parents being financially punished.

"Only way to do that is for women to change the way they act. Don't have relationships with these people, don't have kids with these people. If they change in to one of these people, leave them."

flowersonthepiano said what I was going to say on this.

Since the divorce laws become liberalised and social expectations about long term cohabitation have changed many women have been voting with their feet by leaving men who pull this kind of thing. The problem is that a lot of these men don't see that they are doing anything wrong, so they don't change they just become angry and resentful towards women. Hence the rise of women raising children alone, the rise of angry groups of men like "incels", etc.

Caveat; IMO it’s very hard for any woman to leave.

However, I do think there is a difference in these patterns depending on economic status. Wealthier women are more likely to leave an unsatisfactory man. Poor women are more likely to be left. Poor women are aware that being a poor single mother means you are universally hated and despised.