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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Universal credit & domestic abuse

404 replies

QuarksandLeptons · 09/05/2018 22:52

Good article in the Financial Times

www.ft.com/content/aaaaf2fa-4c63-11e8-8a8e-22951a2d8493

Brief summary:
10% of the households receiving the benefit are couples. The new system puts it all into one account which means that in the event of it going into the account of a controlling & abusive partner, the abusive partners can end up not sharing the money, leaving women and children vulnerable. There are cases documented of women and children going hungry and not having money for nappies or sanitary items.
Worse, women & children end up being forced to stay in dangerous circumstances because they don’t have the money to leave.

How can changes like these be made to the system without thinking through the real life consequences to huge numbers of women & children? Surely, this would have been flagged up if relevant women’s groups had been asked to comment on proposed changes

OP posts:
lightthedarkness · 10/05/2018 07:03

This is dreadful. Are they any signs that our cloth eared politicians are listening?

QuarksandLeptons · 10/05/2018 08:00

I found a previous thread which detailed the (non) response from government

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/3088384-Government-response-to-universal-credit-petition

OP posts:
LangCleg · 10/05/2018 08:21

www.katebelgrave.com/2017/12/in-a-refuge-domestic-violence-no-universal-credit-money-since-october-this-government-is-vicious/

I could find you hundreds of stories like this.

Men abuse women. If they leave, the state abuses them instead. If they don't leave, quite often school invokes social services and they lose their kids. If they do leave, the state abuse leaves them unable to cope and they lose their kids anyway.

This is happening to thousands and thousands of women. Care applications are up 40% on what they were five years ago. It's all linked.

UC is a disaster. Government won't listen and the crises it creates will cost 10x any money it saves.

Greymisty · 10/05/2018 08:31

I'm another on UC. No one and i mean no one understands how it works, job coach your assigned dont understand it. The split payment option is there but its phrased in a way that indicates it's a hassle so dont bother. The gap between starting and receiving payments is massive, you can have a loan to bridge the gap but you have to pay it back. The coaches themselves can be lovely but but if you have a bad one then your even more screwed.

rollingonariver · 10/05/2018 08:41

Yes! My partner initially claimed UC and I joined his claim later, they just added 'my' money into his account. Luckily, he's not an arse and we just made it into a joint account but I do worry for so many women.
Even if their partner isn't externally abusive, i have a friend who's awful with money and her partner would definitely keep the money and say he was doing it because she's bad with money and it's better for her and child if he keeps it 😡

QuarksandLeptons · 10/05/2018 08:41

This is outrageous. What can we do?

OP posts:
rollingonariver · 10/05/2018 08:43

The only good thing about UC is the amount of childcare you can claim but to claim it you have to ring them and send them 'receipts' every time you pay your childminder. Also with it all going into one account, if it's your partner's account and they keep the money allocated for childcare, you'll lose your job and be screwed.

rememberthetime · 10/05/2018 09:30

I don't think most people actually believe this type of abuse happens. In my case it was a shared account that we both had access to, but all transactions were scrutinised and permission had to be asked for anything out of the ordinary.

nothing less that your own personal bank account is good enough for women in abusive relationships. Shared bank accounts can be just as controlled - yet they look fair and reasonable.

if the government say that payments of this type must go into a shared account - they are overlooking that the man in the house will simply control it's use.

ItsAllGoingToBeFine · 10/05/2018 09:42

I just wanted to point out that this is just in England and Wales, in Scotland UC credits are split by default.

ItsAllGoingToBeFine · 10/05/2018 09:45

Oops, sorry I got that wrong Blush the Scottish government has written it into their Social Security bill that they want this to happen, but as UC isn't devolved they will need to push the UK government .

KittyKlaws · 10/05/2018 09:58

THIS is the current fire rad fems need to put out. Men in women's changing rooms are one thing but this policy is abusing vulnerable women here and now...

I think you are right.

And thank you QuarksandLeptons for posting this article and bringing it to our attention. I think another thread in Chat or AIBU (maybe Chat would be best actually) would be useful.

MyDcAreMarvel · 10/05/2018 10:04

“ but as soon as something changes eg you move house, whoosh, away goes child no.3s money.”
Thankfully that is not true , you will lost transional protection for other reasons of yiu hsve a new partner , stop working etc ( not move house) but you won’t lose the extra money for a third child.

Greymisty · 10/05/2018 16:07

Giving this a bump for the afternoon crowd!

Btw no idea what you can do about UC...think at this point im just keeping an eye on the Glasgow(i think it was glasgow) trial for a literal universal wage...working not working everyone gets a flat rate to live off no matter what. It's very "new" but there's been some great (short) trials of it in other countries.

Bluelonerose · 10/05/2018 16:13

That's disgusting!

I'm not in a dv situation but my dh is appalling with money if it was paid to him we would struggle as hed see it in his bank and think he could spend it Hmm

Wtf is wrong with the government that is knowingly screwing people over? Especially vulnerable people Angry

DJLippy · 10/05/2018 17:34

Fools. Child benefit was introduced precisely because of financial control by abusive male partners. It ensured a mother and her children would receive a small amount of money, enough for basic things like FOOD.

AskAuntLydia · 10/05/2018 20:16

Fools. Child benefit was introduced precisely because of financial control by abusive male partners. It ensured a mother and her children would receive a small amount of money, enough for basic things like FOOD.

They're not fools. They're knaves. It's deliberate. They know this is a terrible attack on women. They were told. They don't care.

Terfulike · 10/05/2018 20:42

“ but as soon as something changes eg you move house, whoosh, away goes child no.3s money.”
Thankfully that is not true , you will lost transional protection for other reasons of yiu hsve a new partner , stop working etc ( not move house) but you won’t lose the extra money for a third child.

I moved house and it was treated as a change in circumstance. One of the problems is you get a different answer to a question every time you phone them. It also depends who processes your claim. You rely on them to implement the rules correctly, but they aren't familiar with them. Even CAB have to look it up as its all different. By contrast, at the Housing benefit office there was always someone with expertise based on knowledge of a system they'd been working with for years.

With regards to children, I see they've brought in new legislation, but it only counts for children born before 6 April 2017 ie babies not exempt.

*Quarksand Leptons
I know it’s a vast and complicated question but as someone with direct experience of it, what do you think we can do to make the system fair to women and children? *

This is difficult, but surely giving half to each parent by default would make sense. My ex changed the arrangement so all the CTC got paid into his account though. There is not a lot you can do if they're determined. He used to demand my payslips and get me to write a cheque to him as well. He worked out my allowance for the month and left that.

Financial abuse from my middle class privately educated ex was not well understood by professionals I encountered including social workers and barristers. The police are definitely our greatest advocates for this apart from, obviously, actual women's groups and domestic violence charities.

biscuiteer · 10/05/2018 20:52

Having just watched the system fail a friend whose emotionally abusive partner was receiving payments and also financially abusing her, I’m really dismayed that it also failed her because she was denied benefits after she split up with him. She contested the decision and is now ok but had nothing for weeks and weeks. He had always received child benefit into his account and then refused to pass it on to her account when he finally moved out. He was also able to ensure she didn’t get housing benefit by refusing to leave the property so she could apply for support. All delay tactics to hurt her for nothing - well having the audacity to leave him. He purposefully ran up rent arears before he left because the system was so catastrophically in his favour and made it easy to keep abusing her even after she had split up from him and got away.
To be honest even the ( 2 female ) police officers who were called out numerous times and assigned to her case seemed to be on his side as he played a huge manipulation game with them too, being the ‘heartbroken victim’. I didn’t know that being heartbroken allows you to try to falsely imprison or restrain someone.

HelenaDove · 10/05/2018 21:04

Anyone else been watching Britains Fat Fight. Hugh Fearnley Whittingstall couldnt work out why more people didnt want to join in with #newcastlecan Its a Universal Credit area Hugh. Hmm

UC means no money for weeks and being reliant on carb heavy food from food banks. And there he is running around extolling the virtues of fresh veg. Im not saying UC caused the obesity problems but it certainly doesnt help. And neither will over privileged know it alls ignoring the elephant in the room.

moofolk · 10/05/2018 21:19

There is so much wrong with UC for women it's obscene. I liked the motto when Child Benefit was introduced that it 'takes money from the wallet to put in the purse' (Bevan? Beveridge?), but UC has basically stolen from women.

Friends on it have had untold problems - I don't know anyone who gets UC who has been happy with it. It seems like an awful lot of work to claim every month, and if childcare costs vary then you're screwed.

The two-child policy is related and is another thing that leaves women at the mercy of abusive partners.

moofolk · 10/05/2018 21:20

@lippy just noticed you made the same point!

angieaw · 10/05/2018 21:54

I am a mum with kids who has a controlling alcoholic husband and cannot afford to leave this tragic situation because of the introduction of universal credit as he has the payments now me and my kids have no hope of leaving this abuse as my family are in Scotland so we have no support financially or emotionally.

HelenaDove · 10/05/2018 21:56

angie Thanks Thanks im so sorry. do you have any family members who can help.

PencilsInSpace · 10/05/2018 22:00

Yes this was bound to happen and lots of people have been saying so from the beginning. Quite early on, the Money Advice Service (a semi-government organisation) produced an advice page about financial abuse and UC. If a govt. backed org is having to produce advice for people affected by govt. policy then something's gone badly wrong.

UC is built on the ideas of Lord Freud who was commissioned by Blair's government to rethink welfare. Other splendid ideas this man has had include:

Such splendidly efficient systems as long as you can avoid remembering that benefit claimants are human beings.

angieaw · 10/05/2018 22:08

Thank you Helena Dove for your concern I am trying to build bridges with members of my family that were destroyed because of him not allowing me to contact my family as he controlled every part of my life but they are warey of trusting me again as this cretin is so manipulating and will not let me leave to live my own life and police will not help.