Meet the Other Phone. Protection built in.

Meet the Other Phone.
Protection built in.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

I am a transwoman, ask me anything.

408 replies

AriadneRose · 04/05/2018 10:08

I have been following what has been going on here and on twitter, and thought maybe it would be helpful to open a dialogue that is not reactionary or fueled by anger. So I am offering my own personal perspective as a transwoman, and am willing to answer any questions people might have, and I will try to answer them thoughtfully, respectfully and honestly.

Note: I did not create this thread to stir up trouble, I just feel open dialogue from both sides is necessary for us to move forward.

OP posts:
Bi11yOneMate · 04/05/2018 10:43

Here's something I don't get. Why can't transwomen be proud of being trans and openly accept that their experiences and biological/medical needs are different to natal women? Why the need to deny those differences, pretend they don't exist?
Is it the validation that's needed? The only times I need validation is when my mental health is shakeup - anxiety disorders, eating disorders. I crave validation then but openly acknowledge it is due to my mental health? Does this parallel your trans experience?

AriadneRose · 04/05/2018 10:43

@RedToothBrush

Honestly, I think it is fear on both sides. And the fears are legitimate, but they are being handled in a very reactionary manner. Trans people are afraid of losing rights and being murdered, which may sound very dramatic, but I am legitimately afraid to leave my house because I live in a rural area, and the only time local people discuss trans issues, are usually because a trans person has been harassed or beaten. And I think it is the same on the opposite side. Women are afraid that their voices are not being heard and are afraid of losing rights as well. Because women are also targeted for harassment solely because of their identity. I think both sides are dismissing each others fears, because they feel their worries are more valid. So instead of respecting each other and trying to compromise, it is becoming a battle where nobody is winning.

@StarfishSunrise

I can understand your worries and questions, being trans is usually confusing enough for the person experiencing it nevermind loved ones having to go through it. Puberty is one of the roughest times for a trans person, because that is when you body really starts to change, and for dysphoric people, it is cruel. There is a chance that your son has found some good online resources, and that is why they aren't really speaking about it much, and there is also the chance that your child is just exploring gender, as it is seen as more acceptable to do so now, I think you should just keep and eye on them, and as long as their behaviour doesn't turn destructive, let them keep exploring in healthy ways. They may decide not to go ahead with transition. But it heartens me to see you have an open mind.

@UpstartCrow

I have to admit, when I first heard about self ID, I was excited. The prospect of the financial and stressful process to currently gain a GRC weighs heavy on my mind, and I saw it as a way to ease that process for trans and non binary people. But I also think it is dangerous to go from one extreme to the other, I think it should be easier to gain a GRC, but it shouldn't be a free for all either. It is already hard enough to gain access to healthcare as a trans person, so self ID would take some of the strain off, but it is clearly an issue that effects more than just trans people.

@tiktok

The issue with trans healthcare is not so much lack of rights as it is lack of resources. I live in Northern Ireland where there is only one Gender Identity Clinic for the whole country, the waiting times are atrocious. But then again, that is an issue with most specialist treatments on the NHS. There are still countless institutions, such as doctors offices, banks etc etc that refuse to let trans people change their names, even when presented with a deed poll. So it is not so much that we need more rights, but that we need our current rights to be enforced throughout institutions.

@TinkletinkleLittlebat

I think education is needed on both sides. Transwomen especially need to realise that safe spaces exist for a reason. I had an experience last year (which was populated by only trans, nonbinary and intersex people) where we had a number of closed safe spaces. Where people who had experience with a certain issue or identity had access to. And it made me realise how important those spaces are. I do think transwomen should have access to certain safe spaces, but if the space is a closed safe space for women who were born women, then I think that should be respected too. I see myself as a woman, which I know is a controversial opinion, but I am also self aware enough to know I was raised with male privilege, and my experiences and perceptions of womanhood will never be the same as someone born into it.

OP posts:
JessicaJonesJacket · 04/05/2018 10:46

Are you concerned that the agenda being pushed by transactivists is going to leave transgender people without appropriate support?
ie the re-categorisation of dysphoria means there will be less MH support for people experiencing dysphoria.
And that the push towards self-id (where no medication or surgery is necessary) will mean less medical support/funding too.
The Conservatives aren't known for their compassion or progressiveness so I see their support of these issues as purely a push to cut funding and that concerns me because the transwomen I know in RL need support.

MissMoneyPlant · 04/05/2018 10:47

Step But then they don't want to change that body and make it totally female by castration and chopping their bits off.

Erm... a castrated male is not a female.

pigmcpigface · 04/05/2018 10:47

How does it make you feel when women can't see beyond their own victimhood, to understand that other groups have also suffered at the hands of dominant power structures? Do you think that there are any lessons that could be learned from Crenshaw's work on intersectionality when it comes to understanding the concept that there can be more than one oppressed group in society?

SilverDoe · 04/05/2018 10:47

I believe 100% transwomen are women

I would also be really interested to know if you, as a transwoman, share this view? Or do you acknowledge the biological difference? I hope this isn't offensive as I absolutely appreciate and support people to the right to identify, in an emotional sense, as whatever they wish.

But do you agree there should be a disconnect between acceptance and integration? I'm not sure integration is the right word... I guess I mean, do you think instead of everyone saying "trans women are 100% female", it would be more accurate to say, "I respect the fact that you identify as female and are therefore a trans woman". Is it absolutely imperative to most trans people to be fully accepted as biologically belonging to the opposite gender? Is that what you would view as the ultimate acceptance? Or is it enough to be treated with respect and dignity for who you are?

YimminiYoudar · 04/05/2018 10:48

Do you think that it should be OK for a group of lesbians who want to self-organise a singles night for the purpose of potentially finding new partners to be able to specify that this is an event that is solely for people who have female chromosomes and female bodies and who want to meet other people who have female chromosomes and female bodies? Is that transphobic in your view?

How prevalent do you think the "cotton ceiling" concept is among the trans community?

DontDribbleOnTheCarpet · 04/05/2018 10:48

What are your feelings towards natal women?
What do you think you need and how can it be provided without taking it away from natal women?

KitKat1985 · 04/05/2018 10:49

I not sure I have a question exactly so much as a statement. I am not transphobic and I nothing against members of the trans community, BUT I don't believe it is possible to change sex. Your genetic code will always be that of a man, and it will always be who you biologically are, regardless of surgery of drugs. That's not discrimination, but just a mater of basic biology, and I don't believe you can fundamentally change who you biologically are, anymore than you can change race, or eye colour.

Slitherout · 04/05/2018 10:49

Hi @AriadneRose, hope it's not offensive to ask this but I've never had a straight answer from someone transsexual - what is it that you couldn't do as a man (both biological and gender wise) that you now can as a woman?

I really struggle with this, being gender critical myself, I struggle to understand why there is a need to trans. I believe that any ways a man wants to be treated in the way only women currently are, fall into 2 distinct categories - 1) things that he should be supported by society to do as a man (men should be able to wear 'feminine' looks in dress and makeup, have a 'female sounding' name, gain parity or equality where needed, pursue typically 'feminine' interests etc without having to change either gender or sex) or 2) things that a biological male should never be entitled to do regardless of gender or sex change (eg, access a women's refuge, force agencies that rely on sex segregation for safety to change their rules etc).

Amalfimamma · 04/05/2018 10:49

I live in Northern Ireland where there is only one Gender Identity Clinic for the whole country
You do realise that in NI women are deprived of right too? Abortion is illegal, specialized care is oft lacking and under funded and that we may have a "woman" leader in the albeit defunct sock puppet government but she is as useful as tits on a bull and as misogynist as every other male leader who preceded her.

numberseven · 04/05/2018 10:49

But then they don't want to change that body and make it totally female by castration and chopping their bits off.

Woman is not the absence of balls & dick.

schrodingerstwat · 04/05/2018 10:50

To those asking me a question, I believe it is evidenced by recent science on gender. And I think, in the non-Mumsnet world, the streams are flowing in the right direction. But Mumsnet threads on Trans issues upset me quite a lot. The "I am Spartacus" one had me shaking with rage. So I'll stop here, as it is @Ariadne's IAMA, not mine, and she has said she is happy to explain things clearly and be asked any questions, whereas all i want to do it get off this page, stop shaking with rage, and read about the FIL and the wineglass.

SpareRibFem · 04/05/2018 10:50

Hi Ariadne,
Given Transwomen want support why do the activists think it's a good idea to abuse and intimidate women who were once supporters and are now sufficiently imformed to ask questions?

From what I've seen a large proportion of women posting on here were supporters then started to get more and more uneasy the more we learnt about TRA tactics and the shouting down of women's opinions.

Step · 04/05/2018 10:51

Miss Moneyplant

Sorry put that badly should have said make their body more feminine...

This thing is a bloody nightmare to express...

Bowlofbabelfish · 04/05/2018 10:51

Trans people are afraid of losing rights and being murdered, which may sound very dramatic

Your rights are enshrined in law and no one is proposing to remove rights you have. So may I ask where that fear comes from? And also point out that the proposed changes to the GRA WILL reduce rights that keep women and girls safe. So actually your rights are not under threat - but ours are, and from the TRA lobby.

There have I think been 8 transwomen murdered in the last decade. That of course is eight too many. At the same time two women a week are murdered by partners. . Statistically it’s safer to be a transwoman than a woman. So may I ask where that fear comes from? May I also point out that it is not women or feminists inciting or conducting this violent behaviour. if men are harming trans women then that is something that needs to be tackled, but it won’t be tackled by removing women’s rights, or attacking gender critical feminists.

BeyondParody · 04/05/2018 10:52

"recent science on gender"

Οxymoron

LangCleg · 04/05/2018 10:52

AriadneRose - how do you propose to avoid this thread becoming a victim of a very common dynamic - you making appeals to our female socialisation and the discussion becoming all about making room for trans rights and nobody considering women's rights?

Because your working assumption - as is so often the case - seems to be that feminists on Mumsnet are ignorant of the problems trans people face and if only some kind trans person would educate them, then all the problems would go away. This is not the case. Many of us have trans relatives and friends. We know the problems. We don't need to ask any questions about it - we already know it's tough to be trans.

The questions that we do need answering are about women and their rights, not about you and your rights.

So I'll ask again - what do you propose to do to help women protect and maintain their sex-based rights?

gendercritter · 04/05/2018 10:53

Can I ask if you've had surgery? If not is that on the horizon for you? If that's too personal you obviously don't need to answer.

Are you angry with TRA's for making life less safe for you and increasing general hostility towards people like you? I think a lot of the empathy many women will once have felt towards trans people has soured due to the aggression voiced by TRA's. Not all - I still very much feel for people with gender dysphoria who are just trying to get on with their lives. But my patience is wearing very thin.

FissionChips · 04/05/2018 10:54

Because women are also targeted for harassment solely because of their identity

I disagree with this, it’s not because females identify as female, it’s because we are female. Can you see how what you just said can be very offensive to women and girls?

AriadneRose · 04/05/2018 10:54

Wow, this is a lot of questions very quickly, so sorry for the slow responses. I have seen a few people ask similar questions so I will address them now.

'Is transgender a mental illness?'
That is a tricky one, because again I can't speak for other people, but for me? Yes. It negatively effects my emotional well being. I have described myself as feeling trapped in my body, but in a physical way. I feel physically disgusted by my body, I spent years trying to cut my way out of it ( through self harm) and it was a toxic time for me. When I started going to therapy for my gender issues, this feeling of being trapped eased, it hasn't went away, but I can look at myself in the mirror now.

'Are you a man?'
Biologically? Yes. Do I identify or wish to be identified as one? I would rather not.

'Are you transsexual?'
I have been 'living full time' (as my counsellor was wont to say) as a woman for over 8 years now. I am on hormones and plan to get surgery as soon as it is an available option to me (I am too heavy for the surgery, see above post about my favourite biscuit)

OP posts:
Bowlofbabelfish · 04/05/2018 10:55

To those asking me a question, I believe it is evidenced by recent science on gender

I am a scientist. There is no movement, opinion base or evidence in any way, shape or form that humans can change sex. They cannot. We have a pretty good handle on sex determination and the genetic mechanisms that kick a Male foetus down a male developmental path. This isn’t reversible or changeable.

I have however seen an awful lot of very odd ‘science word salad’ posts recently attempting to imply that science is somehow accepting of this. I’d just like to point out that it isn’t. Sex is immutable in humans, and it’s binary.

BeyondParody · 04/05/2018 10:55

As this is the feminism forum... if you were given the choice between an extra gender clinic in NI and repealing the eighth, which would you choose?

DontDribbleOnTheCarpet · 04/05/2018 10:55

Trans people are afraid of losing rights and being murdered, which may sound very dramatic, but I am legitimately afraid to leave my house

I'm genuinely not trying to minimise your fears, but surely you realise that women live with this fear every day and moderate their behaviour all the time because if they walk this way instead of that way home/use a car park in a poorly lit area they may be raped, beaten and murdered?

Obviously more needs to be done to protect both groups against (predominantly male) violence, but it does seem to be the case with some transwomen that they feel they are the only group to be victimised. Many women would be more supportive and sympathetic if we weren't so frequently dismissed as knowing nothing about how this feels.

MrPan · 04/05/2018 10:55

schrodinger - To those asking me a question, I believe it is evidenced by recent science on gender.

A nonsense answer, then runs away.