Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. Child-safe in minutes.

Meet the Other Phone.
Child-safe in minutes.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Feminism: chat

Original poster

I WILL tell my daughter to moderate her behaviour...

156 replies

NotTakenUsername · 28/03/2018 18:07

Because this land does not protect her otherwise.
I will advise that she should not attend a party with multiple men who think nothing of referring to women as a group of sluts or texting a mate to ask if there is any chance of a threesome.
I will ask her to consider what she wears and the impression she might inadvertently give off. I will strongly advise that a VPL is far preferable to the things that could be insinuated if she chooses to go underwear free.
I will ask her to take the long walk home to avoid being alone in a dimly lit area. I will inconvenience myself daily to collect her if that is safer still.
I will warn her of the reputation she may find hard to shake, if she has too many sexual partners.
I will teach her that men lie to get what they want.
I don’t care if this makes me a shit feminist or worse still a chauvinist.
She is my daughter and I love her and I must protect her from this world that is so perversely weighted towards men at the expense of women.
I’m appalled, but not surprised.
I give up.

OP posts:
NKFell · 29/03/2018 14:10

I agree OP and I'll be doing the same with my daughter.

I have 3 sons as well and I feel teaching them properly will be easy but getting it to really sink in this society will be hard.

MorrisZapp · 29/03/2018 14:15

I agree op but I've always thought it sensible to take steps to protect yourself. I'd very much rather my daughter didn't get raped at all than that she got raped but understood that it wasn't her fault.

Original poster
NotTakenUsername · 29/03/2018 14:21

MorrisZapp I don’t think these precautions really protect her from male violence. They just might give her a fighting chance to pursue justice if she is unfortunate enough to fall victim to an entitled man.

OP posts:
Grassyass · 29/03/2018 14:41

Parent of boys here.
I've been mulling this over. Last week at an airport there was a girl of about 16/17 with her mother. The girl was wearing what I can only describe as a transparant flesh coloured body stocking. She had a thong underneath but essentially looked naked. Literally everyone around did a double take and yes, men and women.
I wanted her mother to have stopped her from wearing it but wondered whether I was wrong to judge.
I'm guessing the OP wouldn't have let her DD wear it.
I had DS19 with me and we had a long conversation about it.

futureforall · 29/03/2018 14:53

I have seen that the two accused have publicly set Instagram accounts.

You can see paddy with his family, going out drinking and so on.

There is the odd comment alleging he is a rapist but it doesn't look to me that he has had to lock anything downs.

Lots of pictures in the sun.

One picture with s girl and she is called ugly and a bitch by what looks like to be other rugby players - I am going to write to their club AngryAngry

Original poster
NotTakenUsername · 29/03/2018 15:17

Grassyass I’d be interested to know how that conversation went?

OP posts:
TerranceandPhilip · 29/03/2018 16:17

To stop rape culture terrence? Which is mainly perpetuated by men?

Ok, do you feel the need to "call out" other women for thieving? After all shoplifting is mainly committed by Women?

Of course you don't. It's nonsense to hold you responsible for what other members of your sex do. The same for this idea that males are responsible for "policing" other males behaviour. The only person responsible for a rapist's behaviour is the rapist himself

glenthebattleostrich · 29/03/2018 16:22

Actually yes Terrence I would call out other women if I saw them or knew they stole from a shop. Funnily enough the only person I've actually seen do that was a man. He's stuffed 2 joints of meat down his trousers and was trying to make a run for it.

I believe we are all responsible for calling out shitty attitudes and behaviours. I've done it to my brother's and his friends.

futureforall · 29/03/2018 16:26

I disagree.

Did you read the NomeansNoworldwide?

Did you see how men who received training on consent rape myths etc were able to step and stop women being raped or assaulted?

BertrandRussell · 29/03/2018 16:38

Terrence- I seem to remember a thread recently where someone else compared men committing violent crimes and women shoplifting. Not sure if that was you?

Original poster
NotTakenUsername · 29/03/2018 16:46

Ok, do you feel the need to "call out" other women for thieving? After all shoplifting is mainly committed by Women?

I have never witnessed women thieving (or planning to steal and discussing it with pride) but yes I would be happy to call that out.

I have witnessed casual misogyny on a regular basis. No, I’m ashamed to say I don’t always call it out - especially when it comes from the mouths of school friend mums (of boys and girls) at the park, or a person I am meant defer to somewhat and respect.

OP posts:
BertrandRussell · 29/03/2018 16:56

Also, I am not sure that a culture of shoplifting permeates women's sport, video games and films, and that shoplifting culture is directly damaging to men......

TheBrilliantMistake · 29/03/2018 18:27

Many men do want to change things, but it is like turning an oil tanker round.
Whatever happen from birth to say 14 or 15, perhaps younger is producing way too many boys with distorted views. That has to be at least in part down to parenting, even if we are sure we are teaching them to have respect for others and themselves. Are we getting it right?
And if we are getting it right, what other negative influences are superceding those good values?

I am sure most mothers and fathers believe their sons are well brought up and yet we see way too many groups of boys and young men behaving outrageously particularly in a sexual context.

It's probably fair to say the problem is predominantly boys, but arguably more accurate to say the problem is how boys are conditioned to think and act. We as a society, men and women alike have to change that.

It's taken thousands of years to get here, I expect it's going to take some time to put right, but I believe it can be done.

formerbabe · 29/03/2018 19:58

I'd imagine most people, regardless of sex, don't shoplift with a group of friends then have a good laugh about it.

BertrandRussell · 29/03/2018 20:02

Or go on about it not actually being theft because that nail varnish was asking for it........

Original poster
NotTakenUsername · 29/03/2018 20:05

“...but sure it was just sitting there on the shelf all shiney and tiny... what person wouldn’t take that to mean that I should just pop it in my bag...”

OP posts:
TerranceandPhilip · 29/03/2018 20:23

No, not your friends. Complete strangers (as expected of men)

BertrandRussell · 29/03/2018 20:31

What is expected of men with complete strangers?

MonsterSister · 29/03/2018 20:32

Well, somebody has to. And men are, on average, bigger than women. Why should a random woman step in, if it comes to that?

acename · 29/03/2018 21:20

What is expected to complete strangers ...

I will tell you a story.

When I was 13 and wearing a school uniform I used to wait for my father to finish his work in a large public library.

One day without me being aware a group of similarly aged School boys pointed out to me that they thought a man had been following me.

They had heckled him and spies on him and from what they could tell he was masturbating and had porn magazines but was following me around and I had no idea.

I completely utterly froze with fear.

The creep sweared when confronted and took off pretty sharply.

These boys stayed with me until I met my Dad.

I couldn't do a fucking thing - I couldn't tell the librarians and I couldn't even tell my father until I was all the way home.

I often think what the fuck would have happened if those boys around my age had not stepped in. I was overwhelmed and petrified.

If this predator had done something to me would I have been presented as someone who consented who submitted.

It really upset me as I always thought I would be strong in such a situation but instead I couldn't really protect myself.

I relied on others to do the decent thing.

Original poster
NotTakenUsername · 29/03/2018 22:56

acename That is a powerful story.

I considered what would have happened and how likely it would be that you would have been granted justice, had the worst happened.

The following thoughts I only share because that wasn’t the case, and do I hope it is ok to do so:

I can imagine the disgusting defence. The character assassination of you, your parents... where exactly was your mother!?
Your school records - bad grades or a naughty teen? Did you wear the uniform as instructed or was it modified to look more attractive? Did you wear make up? Was your hair ‘pretty’? Why didn’t you ask for help - there were respectable women present? There were boys your age you could have approached? Do you look 13... should it be expected that a 13year old would be alone in a library every afternoon...? Surely it is normal to consider a woman with such a routine would have to be older? Didn’t you look at him in a certain suggestive way? How could you not have known he was there? Of course you did, and you liked the attention, didn’t you!?

Etc etc etc.

Thank god for those boys. That is what we need to teach our sons.

OP posts:
SpringNowPlease2018 · 30/03/2018 12:50

Bertrand "What is expected of men with complete strangers?"

same as anyone. If you are standing at a bus stop and don't need to talk to anyone, then don't. if it's a stranger as in new colleague or something, be nice and polite.

it's not complicated.

BertrandRussell · 30/03/2018 13:10

For clarity, my "what is expected of men....." post was in response to this...
"Yesterday 20:23 TerranceandPhilip

No, not your friends. Complete strangers (as expected of men)"

ScruffbagsRUs · 31/03/2018 19:44

I know it sounds warped, but my son has, due to a number of girls making false rape accusations and getting a slap on the wrist ruining an innocent man's life, decided not to bother with females anymore. Not even talk to them unless absolutely necessary.

If a girl/woman was clearly being raped, I don't know if he would even step in and help her, as he wouldn't want to be accused of something he didn't do. His mantra is "Better to NOT risk helping, in case I'm accused of something I didn't do".

I can teach my DS as much as I can to help him become a decent adult, but I can't control what he ultimately does. If he decides not to help a girl/woman in distress, that's down to his own choice, not my raising him.

Original poster
NotTakenUsername · 31/03/2018 19:47

due to a number of girls making false rape accusations

Oh right, how did you know they were false?

OP posts:
Swipe left for the next trending thread