Munroe Bergdorf for Grazia "Women Are Getting Feminism Wrong.

[HelenaDove]

graziadaily.co.uk/life/opinion/munroe-bergdorf-women-getting-feminism-wrong/

Transgender advocates know perfectly well that "transwomen" are a subset of males. In order to create the illusion that trans identified males are a subset of females they need to argue that there are many subsets of females. They started comparing themselves to intersex but got so much push back from the intersex community that they switched to infertile women or women who have had hysterectomies being just like males who identify as women.
More recently they are arguing that trans identified males are just like Black women who are more like males than females. Are they ignorant of the racist history of that claim or do they just not care?

Basically they are doing the old con man razzle dazzle with the understanding that most people will not care enough about the issue of what they call themselves to argue with them. When someone does they are easily dismissed as discriminating against a marginalized class. White males.

This person is mixed race. So can speak about that. Being mixed race and racist hmmmmm.

I wasn't able to have children but that still didn't stop me getting paid less than my colleagues. Why? Because I'm a fucking woman and they were men. The ability of being able to bear children has been used throughout the centuries to subjugate women and this is just a twist on that argument.

Love the idea of transplaining and womanface

I had a gander at this guy's Twitter feed and my god, as well as being a misogynist, this guy is an idiot too! He criticised the suffragette movement for being racist, even though there was never a colour bar on voting in the UK and there were in fact several non-white women prominent in the suffragette movement - remarkable considering that there were relatively few non-white people in the UK at the time. Happily, he got roundly mocked for his ignorance.

It seems that this guy is opposed to any movement which a) doesn't centre his feelings and b) doesn't make him a victim.

*Jack Monroe does my nut in in the way that a teenage daughter does your nut in. She's clearly quite vulnerable, says she is unwell, then releases a diatribe on twitter re Monroe. And she is surprised and hurt that she gets responses. Or 'a dogpile' as she put it. It really wasn't either, it was many feminists saying FFS Jack, get a grip.

I seriously want to shake her.

Then make her some soup and send her to bed with a hot water bottle. grin*

Jack has just anounced she’s quitting Twitter for good (possibly best for her mental health) due to the abuse she received (constantly gets).

I don’t quite get it though- I watched the mess unfold yesterday. Jack started it off publicly attacking Hadley Freeman and opening her up for a pile of abuse. Most if the responses i saw to Jack were calm and imo reasonable. No hate, no abuse. Jack sends out really mixed messages but doesn’t seem to be in a great place at the moment. As frustrating as she can be she sounds vulnerable - hope she gets her head togther and finds some peace and quiet.

On a personal level, I really like Jack. She desperately needs a sense of perspective, though. I fear what makes her passionate also makes her vulnerable.

She courts controversy but she can't handle it. It isn't for everyone. It will be good for her to get off twitter.

he sounds like an idiot frankly.
obviously the suffragette movement in the UK was mostly white, so was the populace in those days.
Anyway he has obviously not heard of Sophia Duleep Singh..(although how she came to be a Brit is another story..)

broadly.vice.com/en_us/article/9kz54p/uk-suffrage-centenary-anniversary-women-color-queer-disabled-activists

At the end of the day, this is a man telling women what to do with their vaginas.

Even if I was respectful re pronouns, it's still someone restricting what we can think about our vaginas.

The pussy hats were in response to trump; symbolism only.

And the person whines about longing for the day when all women stand for trans women; likewise hun. Our war is still not won, or we wouldn't have to have metoo and the pussy hats, let alone having to accommodate yours as well.

Can you just imagine if a powerful person talked about twisting men by the nuts, would anyone tell men not to centre it on their biology?

It's beyond farce, that he can think like that and doesn't understand why we object.

I know, let's organise a march about safe spaces, and tell TIMs it isn't all about them, and they mustn't be such bigots.

Presumably we can't have the vagina monologues any more.

Wondering what LM will be talking about....

I don’t think talking out of your derrière counts.

Jack Monroe is always flouncing from twitter.

Monroe Bergdorf is an arse.

Maybe Monroe should come here and join the band of males who like to tell women how feminism should work, despite being comprehensively clueless on the most basic ideas. It keeps them off the streets, I suppose - if it kept Monroe out of politics, that'd be a result.

Maybe he is already here...

The pink pussy hat protestations are just ludicrous. My vulva isn't made of wool either, nor does it have ears, and yet somehow I'm still able to understand how the imagery applies to me.

She had this bizarre argument that feminists who centre the "vagina" somehow exclude women who had a hysterectomy (like her mum)

Does she think that a hysterectomy removes the vagina? Dear god that's stupid.

I am at risk of becoming repetitive on this topic, but it sends me into a white hot fury when women who've had hysterectomies are held up by trans activists as the "gotcha!" to argue against the biological basis for what a woman is.

It is an atrocious act of woman hating nonsense to suggest that a woman who has had a hysterectomy is less of a woman, and it taps into the deepest, darkest, most horrible thoughts that those women have about themselves, and if any of these stupid, selfish children bothered to talk to such women, they would fucking well know that AND NOT DO IT.

Ack.

A lot of the arguments I see are just bloody stupid, ill-informed and rather ignorant. Not much debate or discussion.

What are they teaching kids these days? Shouty wins every argument?

That and PCOS, Sophocles, both things that can only happen to you if you're female but which are somehow supposed to prove that men can be women if they feel like it, and both being proposed as proving that based on the idea that woman = sexually appealing to men.

The fact that women have hysterectomies, gynaecological problems, pcos, fertility problems etc is one of the reasons why biology is central to the experience of womanhood and why we need to be able to define and talk about it.

Ffs

We know who is a woman and who isn't.

Fekko
They are teaching them pomo nonsense that each individual's subjective reality/identity is sacrosanct and all that matters, most especially if that reality/identity makes them oppressed.

Ive posted this before but it was on a thread that went pouf. It's from a really interesting book called Kill All Normies by Angela Nagle

Sounds like a bunch of self centred moody teens! And we have to humour them all now?

I read the first few paragraphs and had to stop.

Badly written

Completely unresearched

Ignorant.

The "pussy hats" were because Donald Trump talked about grabbing women by the pussy. Something a "feminist" should know, understand, and acknowledge.

Bergdorf is clearly stupid and narcissistic. An airhead.

And the writing (even if it's ghost written) is awful. Teeth gratingly bad.

Presumably we can't have the vagina monologues any more.

Yep www.salon.com/2015/01/15/womens_college_will_no_longer_perform_vagina_monologues_because_it_isnt_inclusive/