cis is an abusive term

[Horridemma]

I don't want to be called a 'cis' nor referred to as 'cis' in any sort of patronising way. Not sure if I really understand but from the way it is bandied about it does not sound good.

I am a woman not a 'cis'

Surely TRA's can't actually get a law like that passed - that would turn society on it's head?!

Currently, every single political party in the country supports this, with the exception of UKIP.

Yep. That's right. Every. Single. One.

It's ok, Pip, we'll still be here when you've come round from your faint! It's true. It's happening.

Dreamy we're a long way from Kansas now, I have learned and I agree with your statement wholeheartedly.

I wouldn't say it was abusive, but it is nonsense. I don't accept there's any such thing as a 'cis woman'.

how can that be allowed?

Because anyone who objects is labelled a bigot and receives rape and death threats, their careers are ruined (yes! There was a MNer who was reported to her employer a couple of weeks ago) people are too scared to speak out and oppose this because the men (yes men) behind this movement are being stereotypical aggressive, violent bullying men. Because this benefits men and negatively impacts women And we all know women don’t win against men.

I'm starting to feel thick... I don't see the offence because we aren't trans people? Is this not just a fact?

I take offence at somebody deciding to re-label me to fit with their own ideals. I'm a woman, not cis woman.
Think about it.If you truly saw yourself as just a woman, surely we would all be women? Why the need to other/segregate us?
Is it because it's pointing out the fkn bleedin' obvious - YOU'RE NOT THE SAME as a biological woman if you still have a penis. You're still technically a man. Re-labelling women as cis to fit in there kind of means you (general you) must see it too otherwise we'd all just be women.

How can that be supported? How is this not recognised as completely mental??

You can't just decide to be a woman? You can't just decide to be part of a group who suffered for years, are STILL suffering to make things equal?!

Surely TRA's can't actually get a law like that passed - that would turn society on it's head?!

I hope you are wearing a head torch and a high viz jacket, because you are about to head down the rabbit hole.

A hole you think can't possibly exist. But it does.

Jeremy Corbyn has refused to say that transwomen are not women.

He has said that his all women shortlists are open to men identifying as women, as long as they have a gender recognition certificate which makes them legally women.

To get a gender recognition certificate, you have to be over 18, have a diagnosis of gender dysphoria and have lived as the opposite sex for two years.

Self ID dispenses with all three criteria.

At the moment very few, about 1%, have a GRC.

He has said that he considers himself 'ahead of the law', in terms of self ID. Because he wants men who do NOT have a GRC to be considered women.

The Labour Party then retracted that, because 'ahead of the law' actually meant breaking the law.

Nonetheless, he is wedded to the legislation happening.

A man who can identify the need for all women train carriages, and then support a law that will allow any man to enter them.

#translogic.

Elondon
The fact you were told you were trans after a hysterectomy is mind blowing and incredibly offensive
My mother's hysterectomy was a really awful experience for here and if someone would of said that to her I'm pretty sure she would of gone ballistic.

www.theguardian.com/society/2018/jan/27/marie-dean-trans-prisoner-male-prison-hunger-strike

Pipgirl, this was an article published in The Guardian about a trans woman going on hunger strike because he had been placed in a male prison. The article has been edited now after the journalist was hauled up on Twitter, but the original stated only that he was in for burglary. What he actually did was break into houses and wank off into teenage girls' underwear. One of his victims attempted suicide. No one in their right mind would think that this man -complete with penis- is a woman but if the self identification bill goes through, all he will have to do is say 'i'm a woman' and he'll be in a female prison, with all those women for him to prey on. It's a sex offender's wet dream.

PipGirl404

How can that be supported? How is this not recognised as completely mental??

Here,

You're going to need it.

(Wonders when to introduce AGP)

Her*
Here

HeartCurrent

Yep, it is. He even, sorry can't give this person the pronouns they think they deserve, said that his mother was trans too because she had had a hysterectomy.

Sickening. and on a major newspaper comment section which apparently is free

Datun Probably before the cotton ceiling

BeUpStanding

I think Pip might need a minute to process...

I will support to those with gender dysphoria who need to get 'corrected' in order to live, I will call them by their chosen identity, support them and help; but I'll be damned if TRAs take over their extreme psychological and physical need to change and then conflate that with women who have to have gynaecological surgery for cancer or severe conditions.

I have gone down a rabbit hole I cannot get out of.

My opinions have changed completely in the space of an hour, it's mind-blowing.

If I as a white person decided I was a black person and asserted that actual black people be referred to using a different word to identify them because “black” actually referred to me how would that go down? Would MNHQ be happy to let those posts using my chosen term for actual black people stand? I have a sneaking suspicion they wouldn’t. I’m so disappointed in MNHQ with their treatment of women on this issue.

pip

You might want to read the thread I posted. I'll post it again.

Take wine.

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3145470-Break-it-down-for-me

I agree that cis is horrifically offensive.

However I love this thread....because it's been so heartening watching someone else go through the "what the fuck?!" Peak Trans moment and having that dawning realization that this is actually completely fucking insane.
It gives me hope.

to PipGirl404

Welcome to the dark side sister.

I had the same moment of clarity as you.
I too am was a "live and let live" type.

Until it became clear that what TRAs want is for us to shut up, go away and deny our own biology and experience.

My whole life as a "gender non conforming biological woman" (ie "woman") apparently means I should trans.....cos I shave my head, ride motorbikes, wear only mens clothes.

Oh, and a young lesbian friend of mine telling me she'd had an aggressive TIM trying to coerce her to have sex because his penis was a lady penis and she was a bigot for not wanting to have sex with genitals she doesn't find sexually attractive.

I'd love to tell Piers Morgan that he is a cis man and that defines him as not a woman who identifies a man.

Pip Welcome to the club. We are 'gender critical' which means we think that sex is a biological reality, but gender is a social construct. Unbelievably this view is now considered bigoted and holding it can get you fired in certain workplaces (see the thread 'what's it like being gender critical at your workplace'). It's fucking insane.

This thread is how I imagine / hope the conversation will go once the debate busts open into the mainstream.

*as a man

I entered the rabbit hole a few days ago and have been fuming and ranting since then.

If anyone calls me 'cis' at work I fear the end result may include violence.

Staplers can do a lot of damage.

I'm glad I fell down the rabbit hole.

It's so easy to be a live and let live liberal type until you realise what that actually means for us, as women.

If anyone else has any articles I can read to open my eyes to this I'd massively appreciate the links to it!

I'm still horrified at everything I've learned/realised.

Lana - I can lend your friend a stapler for the next time that twat approaches her with his lady penis.