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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Transgender Trend's new resource pack for schools

274 replies

Betti936 · 12/02/2018 23:40

www.transgendertrend.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/02/Transgender-Trend-Resource-Pack-for-Schools.pdf

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DodoPatrol · 13/02/2018 09:45

I said rather flippantly above that I would never have considered myself transgender, but that Stonewall's definition would.

But my parents would chucklingly mention friends who hadn't realised that their 'middle' one was a girl (unisex nickname). It probably goes without saying that I was one of those androgynous, scruffy, shaggy-haired, STEM-loving 70s/80s children.

If surrounded by trusted adults concerned that my adamant refusal of dresses, long hair, 'prettiness' and fashion-talk meant I might actually be a boy - who knows what I could have come to think?

stoneagefertilitydoll · 13/02/2018 09:46

whether there is a link between genetics and brain chemistry to gendered behaviour. The research on this is ongoing. If there is, and it has neither been proved nor disproved, there is a scientific basis to being trans. If not, it does all fall apart.

But that's not how science works. If a link is found between genetics and brain chemistry to produce a behaviour, why does that mean that people with genetics X who exhibit a behaviour more commonly found in Y are therefore of gender Y - why aren't they of gender X and that trait is both a trait of X and Y?

Isn't it a bit arse about tit to say that 'Most men like football, we have found a link to 95% certainty that those with a Y chromosome enjoy football, therefore if this woman likes football, she must be a man, despite her X chromosome' vs. 'we've found that there are people with both chromosomes who like football, although it's more commonly found in those with a Y chromosome'

DodoPatrol · 13/02/2018 09:47

Larry, you can look for scientific explanations for why some males act in more feminine ways and females in more masculine ones all you wish. Their inner identity is not the point when separating the sexes.

larrygrylls · 13/02/2018 09:52

Stoneage,

Fine if the female liking football is happy to be a female liking football. It becomes an issue if she feels uncomfortable being a female and this can be linked to brain chemistry.

To me we are living in an increasingly Luddite age where people prefer to assert than to investigate. This is an area crying out for funding to find out if there is anything begind the ‘transgender trend’ other than fashion.

jellyfrizz · 13/02/2018 09:57

It becomes an issue if she feels uncomfortable being a female and this can be linked to brain chemistry.

But, whatever the cause, nothing can be done to stop her being female.

drspouse · 13/02/2018 10:18

Can anyone tell me WHY this would be meat for the self-id argument?

Also if anyone has sent this to their DC's school - what was the response?

I am slightly "that parent" and wonder if the HT will think "oh no not them again". But we haven't had any discussion over sex/gender.

SuburbanRhonda · 13/02/2018 11:24

I will be sending our HT a link to this resource (I work in a school but not on the teaching staff).

I’ve already been told by the PSHE consulatants for the LA that if asked the question “so is x a girl now”, it would not be permitted to say “no”, so I’m pleased to see there are suggestions for answering that (very likely) question without having a pretend changing sex is possible.

rowdywoman1 · 13/02/2018 11:25

The current advice to schools comes from transgender activist groups. They have no specialist knowledge or interest in children and adolescence - but they are political pressure groups trying to change society for the benefit of their 'members' and seemingly very keen to ensure that their adult decisions are validated by the inclusion of children below the age of consent.

Schools have unwittingly allowed these groups access and, rather than focussing on a legitimate concerns about bullying etc these groups introduce and enforce changes to language, new school systems of mixed sex changing rooms and toilets, promoting drug use, breast binding and surgery as positive options, use false statistics about mental health and suicide alongside advice that breaches safeguarding guidelines. All of this is presented with an all encompassing definition of transphobia that silences all questions and dissent. "If you don't allow teenage boys to access girls changing rooms and toilets the moment they self ID then this is a transphobic school".

Children are their cannon fodder as they enforce these massive changes in schools without any discussion - especially with parents.

The Transgender Trend guidelines centre the child, their long term needs as well as the competing needs of the whole school community. They don't centre this totalitarian political ideology and so they will be disliked by trans activists.

drspouse · 13/02/2018 11:35

I've just been looking at DS' school's SRE policy.
No mention of any transgender stuff (and it says it's inappropriate for them to promote sexual orientation/relationships - we have quite a few religious families, mainly but not all Muslim).
I'm a bit nervous about sending it TBH.
They are quite hot on a) girls and boys can do/wear what they want and b) "girly" is not an insult.

HairyBallTheorem · 13/02/2018 11:40

Larry I can see what you're trying to say about underlying biological causes of being trans, but it still wouldn't show that trans-identifying males were women. Suppose (after correcting for other factors such as sexual orientation and autism and the like) researchers found a region of the brain, or aspect of brain chemistry in the brains of TIMs which was more similar on average to the median of the female population than the male population (remembering that the distributions are likely to have enormous overlap). This would not show that the TIMs were women, simply that they had certain characteristics which could explain why they felt they ought to have been born women .

It's a bit like the so-called "god region" of the brain which hit the news a few years back. A region of the brain which seemed much more active in believers than in non-believers when examined in MRI scans (and furthermore, which, when stimulated externally, produced sensations which the person then said "felt like" religious experiences). The researcher was at great pains to explain that this had nothing whatsoever to do with the question of the existence of god. A theist might come along and interpret these results as "we've found the 'sense organ' (to use the 18th century term) which enables us to experience the divine", while an atheist would say "we've found the region of the brain which explains why some people have a delusional belief in the existence of god."

My hunch is that the actual explanation of "trans" is multi-factor: there may well be some brain chemistry aspect to it, but also a huge social/cultural aspect, which makes the difference between saying "I'm a man who in some respects has a brain which is more typically female, but that just makes me an atypical man" (gender atheist if you will) and saying "I'm a woman trapped in a man's body" (gender theist).

But since most women's rights are ultimately to do with our needs and vulnerabilities as a sex due to our sexed bodies and reproductive biology, no matter what a man feels inside, he doesn't get women's rights because he is not actually biologically female. However, I'll back trans rights, properly understood as distinct from women's rights (in the sense of freedom from harassment and the threat of violence) all the way.

larrygrylls · 13/02/2018 12:10

Hairy,

That makes a lot of sense.

As ever, where there are competing rights, some compromises will have to be found but these have to start with protecting basic women’s rights from harm.

drspouse · 13/02/2018 12:22

Note also the "use it or lose it" aspect of brain development.

Like doing sports/aiming and throwing = get better at them = bigger brain areas associated with those.
Like doing quiet sitting down playing with dollies/crafts = get better at sitting quietly and paying attention to things = more attention-associated brain connections.

Destinysdaughter · 13/02/2018 13:23

4thwavenow.com/2018/02/02/freed-from-the-girl-pen-another-mom-and-desister-teen-tell-their-stories/amp/?__twitter_impression=true
This article is a very powerful testimony as to why young people who are insisting they are Trans should be treated with caution. The young girl writes this:

"transgender” has become a coping mechanism for sufferers of abuse, trauma, emotional neglect, and mental illness. It’s not that big of a coincidence that many of the transgender people I’ve met have some kind of chronic physical or mental illness or come from a childhood where they were emotionally or sexually abused, or suffered neglect or abandonment. They need some way to cope and gain the attention and sense of control that they always craved and never received.

I used to feel incredibly dysphoric over certain parts of my body that a lot of transgender people also feel dysphoric over, such as my chest, my legs, my hips, etc. It is not exactly something I can explain but I have always felt very off about myself. I also struggle with quite a few mental illnesses that can make my mind not the most stable. I unfortunately mistook overall body dysphoria and the emotional results of trauma for gender dysphoria and came close to ruining/mutilating my body in an attempt to fix it.

I was the most dysphoric when I thought I was trans, I never wanted to leave the house. I was heavier and my boobs were larger and I was very obviously female. I had a binder for part of that time but it was uncomfortable and gave me breathing problems. My ribs were in severe pain from wearing it for hours a day. I almost fainted multiple times at an anime convention.

The dysphoria grew when I thought I may be a boy. I always wanted to come across as more masculine rather than feminine. I never wanted to be a tomboy, I wanted to be a real boy. When I thought I was trans, all I wanted was to have gender reassignment surgery but now, I’d never consider it, even though I prefer coming across androgynous. Part of the reason I would never consider surgery or hormones now is because I feel better about my body. I eat better now and exercise a lot. While you can’t control dysphoria, you can learn ways to get used to the feelings and those feelings get better over time as puberty ends. That’s how puberty works, it messes with you. When you first hit puberty, dysphoria spikes because there are all these changes you can’t control and in my case, didn’t like.

Somersetter · 13/02/2018 14:25

While I agree with much of that document, I don't like the mention of "Tom boys" and almost equating them with lesbians.

Tomboys not allowed - the erasure of young lesbians in schools
Only a few years ago young girls were allowed to be ‘tomboys’ – have short hair, wear trousers, and undertake games and activities which traditionally have been considered the domain of boys, without being told that they had to change their sex. Many of these young girls defined as lesbians when they reached adolescence. This is no longer allowed. Transgender training given to schools is telling teachers that these girls are experiencing ‘gender confusion’ and should be assisted or supported to self‑identify as boys.

Is it really true that many tom boys become lesbians? Surely this is just more stereotyping, and sexuality isn't automatically linked to clothes any more than gender / gender identity?

Sunkisses · 13/02/2018 14:31

I've read this cover to cover and it is superb, arguing that we should be teaching kids that it is OK to not conform to stereotypes. I shall be printing this off and giving it to my kids' head teachers. This guidance is so desperately needed, to counter the propaganda of trans organisations that have had millions of taxpayers money to promote an unscientific and harmful ideology in schools that has got everyone tiptoeing on eggshells .

hackmum · 13/02/2018 14:42

larrygrylls: "Fine if the female liking football is happy to be a female liking football. It becomes an issue if she feels uncomfortable being a female and this can be linked to brain chemistry."

Someone mentioned recently that when transgender teen Jazz Jennings was a child, one of the reasons his mum knew he was "really" a girl was that he liked soccer - which is a sport for girls in the US.

This stuff is cultural.

stoneagefertilitydoll · 13/02/2018 15:04

Fine if the female liking football is happy to be a female liking football. It becomes an issue if she feels uncomfortable being a female and this can be linked to brain chemistry

But why would it make her male, and not a female uncomfortable with herself, with a female brain, just like the other females who like football - basically, the logic just doesn't follow through.

Men like football != people who like football are men

And yes, I was definitely Tomboy, and not lesbian - yet again it's this thing people do where they label women, and forget they're individuals with rich inner lives.

UnCafecito · 13/02/2018 16:48

Great post HairyBallTheorem

mummybear701 · 13/02/2018 17:03

Part 2 is basically what I have been saying all along. I think the majority of the transgender explosion is a backlash against rigid gender roles which we ALL have responsibility for eradicating.

I thought schools already used 3rd space toilets and changing, typically the 'disabled' toilet. Thats what happened with one at DDs school, and they took 'disabled' off the door.

WeAreGerbil · 13/02/2018 18:09

Interesting - a post came up on my FB wall this afternoon about transphobic groups sending info to schools, and schools should only take notice of certain organisations such as GIRES and Mermaids. I wondered what it was about - I guess this pack.

shedalight · 13/02/2018 18:19

WeAreGerbil
The transactivists are desperate to stop schools and parents looking at this. It's thoughtful, encourages schools to have confidence in their tried and tested systems and to look at the 'whole child', not just aspects of gender dysphoria and then to work with parents and the child.
It's so important that schools get to look at this. If they don't like it, they won't use it.
But guess what - it yet again sheds light on the gaslighting and propaganda that are being fed to children and that's what organisations hate - the oxygen of publicity highlighting the techniques they are using.

Freshlylaidterf · 13/02/2018 18:34

Its really good I think. I wish I had seen it before I wrote to my mp snd the equalities and human rights comittee about the schools guide that LBGT youth produced
and which was endorsed by the Scottish Goverment. All other ' guidance' I have seen from various local authorities seems to be based on the LBGT youth publication. Its dreadful.

Datun · 13/02/2018 18:57

I think a couple of people are missing the point.

It's not the school's responsibility to judge, or even have an opinion about transgenderism.

Which is where the current propaganda shows itself up.

They spend an awful lot of time explaining their version of what it means to be trans and leading you, like a bull with a ring through its nose, to the conclusion they want you to have.

Which is to place the trans persons rights above those of all the other children. Or be called transphobic.

This guide sets out quite clearly what safeguarding measures are currently insisted on. The welfare of all the children.

There is no scientific consensus for transgenderism. There is an abundance of evidence about social contagion, and gender nonconformity being translated into pseudoscience. And schools are having to deal with 2, 3, 4 children all coming out simultaneously.

The school's obligation is to protect the trans child from bullying, accommodate them as much as they can, but NOT at the expense of the other children.

It is also a direct conflict with safeguarding regulations, to suggest parents are not informed if a child comes out at school. The school is not qualified to determine whether the child has any other mental health issues.

Current propaganda makes a nightmare of safeguarding issues.

This booklet gives schools the information about the equality act that allows them to consider the protection of all the children as paramount.

Schools do not have to tell children that it is possible to change sex.

Good Lord. You can't be teaching biology 101 at 10am, and tell a child that a boy has now become a girl at 11am. And schools should not be accused of transphobia for breathing a massive sigh of relief that they don't have to.

And if anyone is in any doubt, whatsoever, that the current material being sent to schools is based on misinformation, and horribly biased, see my screenshot.

It's utter nonsense, of course. But shows far they will go to shut you up.

Transgender Trend's new resource pack for schools
Datun · 13/02/2018 18:59

My advice, to any parent, is to give this to the headteacher of your child's school. Before the brainwashing begins.

Juzza12 · 13/02/2018 19:00

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