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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

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Disgusted by all the transphobia here

1000 replies

MikePeterson · 04/02/2018 16:12

A very good friend of mine and a long time poster here has spent most of her day crying because this fresh wave of transphobia in a community she thought she was welcome in has finally broken her spirits. After obtaining her permission, I am posting this because it needs to be said.

She is a woman with a penis and has identified as such since she was old enough to understand the concept of gender. Being female is part of her identity but so is her body, such as it is and untouched by surgery and artificial hormones. She is a beautiful individual and, to my eye, presents a much more feminine image than, ironically, Linda Bellos and several of her fellow bigots.

Arguing that, because of potential past trauma involving males, causing seeing a penis or even an individual likely to be in possession of a penis to be triggering is justification for segregation is as absurd as it is offensive. Would it be acceptable for a woman who was the victim of a violent crime commuted by a particular ethnic minority to demand that all members of that race be segregated in changing rooms and domestic violence shelters? Of course not.

Equally ludicrous is the claim that transgender women somehow had the privilege of living as a man. Cisgendered women are light years ahead of transgender women in terms of privilege and if you wish to continue denying this, you are no better than the most vile male misogynists.

Finally, think about how disrespectful you are being to all women, you are reducing all the wonderful differences between the genders to what someone has between their legs. The same feminist ancestors who fought for your right to vote, to be regarded as more than domestic servants and baby machines would spit on you for your intolerance.

OP posts:
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13
ladyballs · 04/02/2018 17:58

Just for you Mike.

Disgusted by all the transphobia here
misscockerspaniel · 04/02/2018 18:01

MountainsofMars Yes, you are right. Person born with a uterus and person born without a uterus is definitely better.

AnyFucker · 04/02/2018 18:01

Oh mike, do you want us to tell you are not homosexual ?

Ok, you are not homosexual. There...feel better now ?

Collidascope · 04/02/2018 18:01

So in this brave new world where women are renamed as people without penises, given that the people with penises commit massively more violent and sexual crime, can we segregate bathrooms, refuges and jails according to the presence of a penis? Or will it still be women and men?

NewYearNiki · 04/02/2018 18:02

Words have set meanings for a reason. You have a penis, balls, need to shave, capable of getting a woman pregnant then you're a fucking man.

It's called false syllogism.

Just because you call a man a woman, it doesn't make them a woman.

Whowhatwhy · 04/02/2018 18:03

I'm not convinced that your friend is transgender to be honest. He has a penis and has not taken any hormones. Surely that makes him just a man in a dress which is usually referred to as transvestite.

HarveyKietelRabbit · 04/02/2018 18:07

In this 'brave new world' I had a transman (still with a vagina) tell me he was raped by a transwoman (still with a penis) but didn't want to report it to the Police because of the effect it would have on the 'trans community'.

So....

Beansonapost · 04/02/2018 18:08

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brownandorange · 04/02/2018 18:08

OP I don't appreciate your references to "feminine image" but in general I totally agree with you.

I am baffled by the almost obsessive focus on this issue on MN (which I have not once heard talked about in RL) and the views expressed on this thread make me very sad.

FWIW I have no problem whatsoever with your friend identifying as a woman, or with the term "cis".

misscockerspaniel · 04/02/2018 18:08

...can we segregate bathrooms, refuges and jails according to the presence of a penis?

No, segregation would be on the basis of whether someone was born with a uterus or a penis. Or in other words, we would revert to what happened before trans became the latest stick with which to beat women.

NewYearNiki · 04/02/2018 18:09

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DullAndOld · 04/02/2018 18:10

" in general I totally agree with you. "

sorry but in that case you must be seriously thick.

tbh Mumsnet is one of the few places where women can express themselves freely on this topic.

I tried once on fb but called a 'disgusting cockroach' by some fucked up penis owner for simply mentioning women's spaces..

ftmtb · 04/02/2018 18:11

Why would someone with genuine gender dysmorphia continue to live life with male genitalia?

GENDERS ARE NOT 'MADE UP SOCIAL CONSTRUCTS'
GENDER IS SCIENCE.

Do all these people creating these new genders think they know better than scientists who have spent their lives dedicated to human biology and evolution?

I have huge respect for people who have genuine gender dysmorphia and who struggle with it and have a hard time.

People like your friend just take the piss out of that.

RatRolyPoly · 04/02/2018 18:11

I have no problem with someone who has a GRC and is legally a woman. I have no problem with someone on that road. They won't have a penis at the end of that road.

Wrong. Sorry.

SophoclesTheFox · 04/02/2018 18:12

Huge hugs to whambars and hygge.

So sorry.

Collidascope · 04/02/2018 18:12

"No, segregation would be on the basis of whether someone was born with a uterus or a penis."

Yes, miss, that's what I mean. So segregation would still be on the basis of biology. TRAs wouldn't be happy with it though. There'd be redefining of what penises and uteruses are, and grasping at straws about women who have had hysterectomies. Whatever way we try to redefine stuff, it will be taken and warped by misogynistic little men.

RatRolyPoly · 04/02/2018 18:14

Why would someone with genuine gender dysmorphia continue to live life with male genitalia?

Because surgery is a massive fucking deal that is not right for everyone, and you literally cannot oblige someone to have it just to fit you idea of what their "condition" may or may not require. You have a chronic pain condition but don't want to have invasive surgery to correct it? Not real pain then. Want me to believe you're in pain? I'll strap you to the table, shall I?

brownandorange · 04/02/2018 18:15

@DullAndOld But women cannot express themselves freely on this topic on MN. They can freely express views which match yours or they can express alternative views and be called "seriously thick" by random strangers.

Or have I misunderstood, and that is actually just freedom of speech?

SophoclesTheFox · 04/02/2018 18:17

rat the problem is with the definition of what is a transphobe?

95% of the women right here on this thread are transphobes by virtue of believing that a penis is a male sexual organ.

I didn't see the thread you refer to, so I don't know the context, but I can see myself, in exasperation after the umpteenth SJW has told me, a women who has had a hysterectomy that this means I am the same as a man, and to believe otherwise is transphobic, to give up and in exasperation say "FINE! I'm a transphobe then".

TellsEveryoneRealFacts · 04/02/2018 18:17

Rat I take it you support wholeheartedly Andi Dier? If not why not?

DullAndOld · 04/02/2018 18:17

if you are a woman and you agree with OP, yes I stand by my previous statement. You must be thick.
That is my freedom of speech, you are also welcome to yours.

misscockerspaniel · 04/02/2018 18:19

Collidascope yes, on the basis on biology. Grin

Op our feminist ancestors wouldn't be spitting on us. But I wouldn't be surprised if they were turning in their graves at the trans movement.

StylishMummy · 04/02/2018 18:19

If your friend has a penis, your friend is a man and Jas the potential to rape me, therefore your friend should not have access to spaces where women are changing, going to the toilet or other 'safe' women's spaces.

OvaHere · 04/02/2018 18:20

Because surgery is a massive fucking deal that is not right for everyone, and you literally cannot oblige someone to have it just to fit you idea of what their "condition" may or may not require. You have a chronic pain condition but don't want to have invasive surgery to correct it? Not real pain then. Want me to believe you're in pain? I'll strap you to the table, shall I?

I agree you cannot force surgery and there is some evidence that it is not a cure all for dysphoria anyway but a person who doesn't want surgery should be acknowledged and sympathised with as a man who has bodily dysphoria not as a woman.

SophoclesTheFox · 04/02/2018 18:24
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