Trans friendly thread!

[100lbtolose]

Hi MNers!

Just first of all want to say this isn't going to be a goady thread or a place to slag anyone off of be abusive. Everyone can have an opinion and everyone's allowed to think that they like.

2nd, if your anti-trans or don't believe trans people should be alllwed to self ID or that they aren't the gender they say they are etc pls be respectful and don't post here. There are loads of threads about all kinds of discussions about being trans that you can post on and I think it would be fair if you didn't do that here. I Obviously can't prevent anyone but It would be nice for this space to be respected as trans friendly and not taken over for other reasons. If you don't agree just leave and post somewhere else instead of using this thread please!

That now said - I'm all for trans rights and I think trans men are men and transwomen are women. I don't know if many MNers feel the same but if you do say hi! Or if anyone is trans know that you have an ally in me this thread can be for a chat or support or (friendly!) discussion. Or maybe I'm the only one here lol and I can just talk to myself...

Thank you Lana
And you Datun

100lbs, battlecunt, anyone, please?
Who is perpetuating an anti trans sentiment?
Who is transphobic?
Who is hating transpeople?
At what point do we go from
"I have concerns about proposed law changes" to "you're all transphobic bigots who hate prostitutes!"

Where is your empathy for women Jon?

Ifit

'Hate' and 'anti trans' = anything that mentions actual facts and reality or that anyone else on the planet possibly exists and has needs or (legal ffs) rights too.

Bored now.

I'm seeing a lot of both love and ignorance on this thread....
Funnily enough the ignorance isn't from the "TERFs".
Interesting...

They should give them up. No one else needs rights or consideration and they shouldn't get them. Trans identified males are definitely the most oppressed people to have ever lived. That's all that matters.

I.e. men using trans as a way to get to women and be violent toward them in places where they should be safe.

Um. Do we really have to get raped before you take notice?

We have a 19-year-old boy occupying the space of labour's women's officer.

A 19-year-old boy who makes rape jokes, says biology is irrelevant and claims he can get pregnant. Who has allegedly been involved in a push to actually oust women from the Labour Party. Despite his remit being to include as many women as possible.

In terms of violence, it's seriously not about transwomen transitioning to rape women ffs.

It's about rapists and paedophiles filling out a form online to gain unfettered access to potential victims.

With no surgery, no diagnosis, and zero modification to their clothes or body. Just a fucking form.

I've skim read the thread, so have probably missed loads.

I am sick of being called a TERF and a bigot for not fully buying into trans ideology, a mindset that I find rigid and harmful to all but a few men who would benefit from self id and access all areas.

I will never advocate for the experimental medication of children and teenagers with untested, unlicensed drugs which may cause irreversible harm and infertility at times in life that are known for being confusing and dysphoric, that the child is likely to grow out of anyway without intervention.
I reserve the right to see the push of transing children as nothing short of child abuse.
That's not to say I don't agree with transing full stop, but unless the person in question is a fully informed, consenting adult it is abuse.

I will always centre feminism around women, those with vaginas and uteruses, with all the related mess, gore and complications that go alongside, and the resulting glass ceilings and oppression directly linked to being a female, and socialisation of females that starts at birth.

I will not be told that I'm not a trans ally because I don't fully agree with the current aggressive trans agenda, and to be frank, to be silenced and bullied with illogical non-arguments such as "transwomen are women" and #nodebate is so typically male in nature that I'm amazed and disappointed that any woman has bought so readily into this fictional ideology.

Women have never and will never have a penis.
Men will never have a vagina.
These are logical, scientific facts.
Believing science does not make anyone a TERF or bigot.

Trans people have just as many rights as any other group of people, and I will happily campaign for spaces - loos, changing rooms, hospital wards, prisons, AWSs - for trans people to feel safe in, to feel represented, if that's what's needed.
I will never accept that transwomen (and it is transwomen and not transmen) are happy to push women out of the way for their own gain without taking a second to try to understand what this means for women and girls who have had to fight for 100 years to even get a foot in the door.
For a group of people who swear blind they are women, they don't half act like a bunch of entitled men.

There are plenty of transwomen who I respect and admire, but they're not the ones making unreasonable demands and threatening women with violence, erasure and trying to push them out of their jobs.

‘When You’re Accustomed to Privilege, Equality Feels Like Oppression’

www.huffingtonpost.com/chris-boeskool/when-youre-accustomed-to-privilege_b_9460662.html

''Privilege is when you think something is not a problem because it doesnt affect you personally.''

“Equality can feel like oppression. But it’s not. What you’re feeling is just the discomfort of losing a little bit of your privilege.”

''They all basically boil down to people who have grown accustomed to walking straight at other folks, and expecting them to move''

What elephant?

Obviously when I mentioned AWSs I meant a trans equivalent

Datun, do you really mean over £3k?! shock
Surely I've misinterpreted that!

Haha! I dug deep, but not that deep!

Jon66
Who is being transphobic on here??
I'm sure some people throw out 'transphobic' if they are offended that someone's opinion does not align with theirs.

If we're going down the oppression route, How about you being a Racist?
As you support an ideology which will have a direct impact on our Muslim and Hasidic women who are not able to share spaces with men, and so impacting on their freedoms.

Surely it should be one of these.

This thread seems to consist of reasoned argument from gender critical feminists coupled with the occasional intervention from the pro trans contingent telling each other how much they like and agree with each other.
That’s sweet - daft people need friends too after all. But I wonder why they think it’s at all persuasive for the rest of us?

Swerfy - I too thought your post was fantastic, and will go and donate to Madre - it looks like a fantastic organisation.

We definitely have Canadian and Irish posters on here who have written about the problems self-ID has posed. (Irish maybe not so much, because Ireland hasn't actually gone down the self-ID route, it's just pretended to - so for example there are specific exclusions for biological males and women's prisons).

It is self-ID I have a particular problem with, because in the absence of any account of what is to count, legally, as a woman (if biology isn't it), then any piss-taker or predator can in principle self ID. And yet the pro-trans-activist lobby refuse to say what they mean by "woman" (I refuse to call them pro-trans, in deference to the many transwomen I've talked to who have said that self-ID will harm them, both directly by allowing male predators into women's spaces, and indirectly by stirring up a backlash).

From the OP.

That now said - I'm all for trans rights and I think trans men are men and transwomen are women

Can you point me towards the campaign to allow transmen to inherit a title and take their seat in the House of Lords?

Can you point me towards the campaign to address male violence directed at transmen?

Can you point me towards the campaign that is setting up rape refuges to specifically cater for women identifying as men?

Can you direct me to the campaign that supports transmen who are pressured into sex by transwomen?

You must have those your fingertips, and, of course, I will support it. Where do I donate?

Well I can't find the transphobic hatred so far. Just the usual well articulated discussion, explanation and questions from women protecting our rights and also seeing how trans people will also be harmed by proposed changes. The OP and her club of six or seven posters seem not to understand the issues or not care as it doesn't actually affect them at this point in time.

So everyone can think what they like but they can express their thoughts on your thread because you say so. Ok then have a nice evening.

I haven't actually read the whole thread nor have I commented on this previously but I have to at op "this is not a goady thread" posted under feminism! I suspect we have a troll whose sat at a laptop laughing his/hers head off. Possibly a teenager. Another clue pointing to a troll would be not answering to any of the questions, knowing this would get people frustrated. I don't know but this is what I suspect anyway.

IF there was an ounce of an actual debate to be had, it would have been had. On here, in politics, in services.
There is no argument to be debated. Just appeals to feels, and emotional protestations about transphobia and suicide.

Just leaving this here..

With no surgery, no diagnosis, and zero modification to their clothes or body. Just a fucking form.

I have said this before but I will say it again - why would anyone bother to fill in the form? You are NOT going to need to fill in the form because challenging a man in a women's space is going to be transphobia and literal violence.