Trans friendly thread!

[100lbtolose]

Hi MNers!

Just first of all want to say this isn't going to be a goady thread or a place to slag anyone off of be abusive. Everyone can have an opinion and everyone's allowed to think that they like.

2nd, if your anti-trans or don't believe trans people should be alllwed to self ID or that they aren't the gender they say they are etc pls be respectful and don't post here. There are loads of threads about all kinds of discussions about being trans that you can post on and I think it would be fair if you didn't do that here. I Obviously can't prevent anyone but It would be nice for this space to be respected as trans friendly and not taken over for other reasons. If you don't agree just leave and post somewhere else instead of using this thread please!

That now said - I'm all for trans rights and I think trans men are men and transwomen are women. I don't know if many MNers feel the same but if you do say hi! Or if anyone is trans know that you have an ally in me this thread can be for a chat or support or (friendly!) discussion. Or maybe I'm the only one here lol and I can just talk to myself...

Again, I ask....why???

Why will you not engage with us?

How can you not see that shutting down peoples real concerns is the very opposite of liberal or progressive values?

Why.....if you are so convinced that you are right, will you not engage in debate??

No one here has been anything but polite....yet you refuse to answer even the most basic of questions.

Can't you see how anti freedom that is??

"It's brill that there are a few more pro-trans MNers that it seemed to me before"

Brill. Fab. How old are you?

LanaKanesLeftNippleTassle (I adore your name)
The only reason I can ever think of for refusal to debate, answer questions, share thoughts and experiences and hopefully move forward with a plan is that they are unable to debate. Whether that be because they are incapable due to their intelligence or because they have no points to argue (apart from "it just is, no debate" over and over) it's unfortunate, really.
It just means we'll be at a stale mate for a very, very long time.

I dont want violent men to harm trans women or women

Thats one of the main reasons why i find it impossible to agree with self ID

I don't understand why people like the OP do want violent men to have easy access

And i will never understand because the OP is acting like a pissed off three year old

'I cant see you...you cant see me'

I totally agree and feel very uncomfortable about some of the posters on mn who appear to have a very discriminatory attitude and not just about trans issues. For what it is worth, I cannot see how a trans woman, man, gender neutral or any other person being who they want to be will affect me adversely and I can't understand people objecting who will not be directly affected.

BattleCunt fighting the good fight? I don't see any fight at all - I just see the occasional remark which doesn't engage or further it at all.

That linked article - basically says that because transwoman and women have similar problems, women should fight transwomen's battles for them to my reading..

I also note that they compare transwomen to the general population, or race-based demographics - never to women - the suspicious reader in me wonders what the numbers would be like if they women and transwomen, rather than transwomen and everyone else.

I just bet you 'cant see colour' either. Thats the way to fix racism!

For what it is worth, I cannot see how a trans woman, man, gender neutral or any other person being who they want to be will affect me adversely

Go look at UK law. For every instance of the word woman, replace that with people and see if the laws still mean the same thing - that's the impact.

I mean....
When I am am sure (as I can be) that I am right, I will happily debate and discuss, put forward my points in what I hope is a polite and well reasoned way, and I am prepared to learn I am wrong.

I have had some fascinating debates online with people of opposing view points, and they generally have ended with both sides (however begrudgingly) giving some points to the other side.

I have literally (at one point at least) put my life on the line in the defence of others, my DP got literally beaten by the police for protecting people at a riot...so don't you dare paint us as bigots.

So....with all that in mind.....Why won't you debate??

For what it is worth, I cannot see how a trans woman, man, gender neutral or any other person being who they want to be will affect me adversely and I can't understand people objecting who will not be directly affected.

For what it is worth, I cannot see what rights trans people haven't already got that they are in dire need of.

can't understand people objecting who will not be directly affected.

FFS. We are directly affected. You might be ok with males in female spaces but I am not. Why can't you understand that? A poster earlier on mentions how she has to allocate university accommodation and if a trans identified male claims to be a female there is nothing she or the room mate can do. They have to share, even if they asked for a female room mate. When I went to university I had just emerged from a violently abusive controlling relationship. I could not have shared a bedroom with a man. It would have broken me. I would have had to drop out. Don't you get that? Where is your empathy?

It'll even move into really unexpected areas -- for example, clothes sizing, ergonomic testing of anything designed for one sex or the other - if they hired a transman instead of a man then the men's cycle seat is going to end up with a very different design isn't it.

We have swerfy on this thread.
A woman who has put herself in danger for more than 2 decades to free women from abuse and oppression.
She seems polite, kind and eloquent.

Yet the juvenile toddlerlike battlecunt who's best attempt at answering a question is "I need a bingo card" is fighting the good fight.
Alriiiiight then!

I will also donate to Madre Swerfy
Thank you thank you so much for your sacrifices. I hope you remain safe and well.

That linked article - basically says that because transwoman and women have similar problems, women should fight transwomen's battles for them to my reading..

I didn't read it but oh what an amazing surprise that is.

Drug testing will be interesting...

. . . and the other point is that in countries where the proposed scheme for the UK is already in place, they report no issues regarding the concerns by some posters on here. I.e. men using trans as a way to get to women and be violent toward them in places where they should be safe. The fact is that most men, and women, including trans men, and women are pretty ordinary and nice people.

I don't want to engage with people with homophobic, transphobic, racist, or discriminatory views of disabled people either. It isn't because I can't debate, its because I can't understand those views and have seen the results of them in my professional life . . . and those results are horrible, like the profligates who perpetrate them.

I'm quite disappointed, I put a lot of thought into my impact on trans people questions. Ah well, I'll c&p in case they were missed...

How do you imagine self-identifying working when it comes to access to hormonal therapy or surgery? Or any therapy around these things?
Do you want boots to start giving the drugs OTC?
Can a person just rock up at their local nhs hospital and demand to be put on waiting lists?
Or will it all go through GPs who are already overworked?
Or is the plan to do it through a gender specialist like now, except the difference is...what exactly?

Swerfy I suspect the lack of points to score really.

When asked to answer even the most basic of questions....there's...... then a joyous leaping on the few who agree with them...while ignoring everyone else.

No impetus to answer even the nicest questions, just ignore.

they report no issues

Really? you sure about that?

It isn't because I can't debate, its because I can't understand those views and have seen the results of them in my professional life

What rights do trans people want that they currently don't have? It's not a debate, it is a question.

There are threads here about those other countries. It is causing problems in Canada. The other countries have not allowed their gender recognition laws to trump sex segregation in most cases from what I've read. So it's not the same.

I'm forced to conclude that you can't debate. Sorry. Like all other trans allies.

For what it is worth, I cannot see how a trans woman, man, gender neutral or any other person being who they want to be will affect me adversely and I can't understand people objecting who will not be directly affected.

Have you read anything on these boards?

So I assume from your stance that you don't believe that spaces need to be segregated by sex? That men and women could share prisons and that would all be fine. That women and men could compete against each other in sport and that would be fine? That women could be made to share rape crisis centres with males and that would be fine?

You would really have no problem with any of the above?

Are you male or female, Jon?

MsGameandWatching raises a valid point - it would have been interesting if only people supporting the op had posted.

It seems to me that the op has mentioned every single person who have unquestioningly agreed (while seemingly not even noticing anyone else [baffled]). In doing so, the op has named seven posters.

So yes, the thread would have been a seriously empty (and lacking in facts or answers).