Follow on thread to - Feeling sad and weary that feminists and trans-women are constantly pitted against one another.

[Datun]

Thread came to an end. But I wanted to reply to Debbie.

Debbie6666

Your transman in the cowboy hat?

It really it really is the height of enough to actually leverage the damage that the trans ideology does to try and get women to capitulate to it.

We are telling you how detrimental this is to women, including transmen, and you’re actually using it as a ner ner moment?

It’s beyond parody. And very deceitful.

And as I mentioned earlier in the thread, that makes you a TERF. Happy christmas.

SpartonDregs if I'm a TERF then you are Truscum. Happy Christmas to you too!

if I'm a TERF then you are Truscum.

If that means not sterilising children and leaving them in a pre-pubescent state for paedophiles then happy to be so.

I don't mind the GRA as it is now.

But I do want single sex exemptions extended and strengthened and, above all, for it to be culturally acceptable and desirable for them to be invoked.

I don't think any male-bodied person should ever be in a women's prison; I don't think any male-bodied person should be staying or working in a women's refuge; I don't think male-bodied teenagers should be sharing accommodation with female-bodied teenagers during school/guide trips; I don't think any male-bodied person should be representing women in elected positions; I don't think any male-bodied person should be eligible for places for affirmative action programmes designed to reduce sex-based inequities. Etc.

I suggest this compromise becoming the feminist manifesto rather than all the 'trans women are scary men in dresses out to get us' stuff.

I have not seen this feminist manifesto. Nor have I ever heard a feminist say transwomen are scary men in dresses out to get us.

Doesn't truscum mean transsexual person? Ie. Someone who actually has sex dysphoria? Its apparently a Very Bad Thing to have sex dysphoria these days. Sex dysphoria is not necessary to be trans. Though quite what 'trans' means if not someone with dysphoria, I do not know

Lang the honour system covers all that. Now we've had the breakthrough the specifics can be thrashed out on another thread.

Oddly enough, I find feminists and transsexual people actually have a lot more in common (with wants and aims) that transactivists do with transsexuals..

YY.

Nor have I ever heard a feminist say transwomen are scary men in dresses out to get us.

Because it doesn't happen. What feminists do say is that men will and have taken advantage of the agenda in order to facilitate their access to potential victims, that there are a myriad instances of this having happened and that it is damaging to women, children and trans women to further enable this to happen.

No doubt this is simply going to be interpreted as "oooh look! You think that trans women are men in dresses" but the lack of critical thinking ability of some TRAs isn't my problem.

An honours system only works if it is based on the rights of women. The honours part means there is no entitlement. Just courtesy extended by women and on their terms.

It doesn’t mean you must let me in if I promise not to do anything wrong.

It's not really a breakthrough perfectly, surely? The common ground was clear pages ago when you posted your suggestions for moving forward

BatShite indeed it does. Some of the trans activist terminology is quite frankly batshit. It's a shame they are ruining it for the majority of regular, harmonious trans people.

It's a shame they are ruining it for the majority of regular, harmonious trans people.

Indeed. They are detrimental to transsexual people for sure. Issue is, trans people cannot really speak up about it as they are subjected to the same death/rape threats as women get for discussing the issue. The abuse Miranda Yardley receives is absolutely insane.

Transactivists I cannot help seeing the same as MRAs. Aims identical, breaking down womens rights systematically, while turning people against 'those nasty feminists'.

Datun of course! So if God forbid Jazz Jennings was beaten up or sexually assaulted she would not automatically be kicked out of a women's refuge or rape crisis centre for not being biologically male... as she poses no threat to women. If a dodgy guy claimed to be a women specifically to access these centres it would be refused. Each case to be assessed on its own merit.

Each case to be assessed on its own merit.

Which is why legislation cannot be involve din this. We cannot create laws that assess each case individually. This is why it simply HAS to be an honour system, rather than something people are forced into. Its worked fine for the past however many years. No reason it cannot continue to work fine. Transactivists will not be happy of course, but their aim was never to help transsexual people anyway, itys always been about themselves and the breaking down of the rights of female people.

I am intrigued perfectly, are you going to write to your MP about this self-ID law? Given you seem to be against self-ID now?

I trans peak is achieved in TRAs on the children debate, this should be the main focus in future.

*If

BatShite I support self ID as it empowers trans women to access female spaces under the present honour system.

"If a dodgy guy claimed to be a women specifically to access these centres it would be refused."

This is not true and it has happened.

I trans peak is achieved in TRAs on the children debate, this should be the main focus in future.

Transing kids is my primary concern anyway. I find it so irresponsible how many adults are advocating for untested drugs longterm on young bodies. And all for aesthetic reasons! Its bonkers. Utterly bonkers.

BatShite I support self ID as it empowers trans women to access female spaces under the present honour system.

That makes no sense?

Also transsexual people can get a GRC anyway, under the present system. You just said that you think the GRC process should stay as it is. Which would eman you are against changing it yes?

I am not trying to be awkward. I just really do not understand where you are coming from on that at all. How can it 'empower' trans women to access female spaces under the current honour system? If anything, it further disadvantages transwomen! As if literally anyone can get a GRC, GRCs become utterly meaningless.

christopher hambrook piece says he attacked 4 vulnerable females between the ages of 5 and 53.

This is standard violence of the type committed in the vast majority by our bepenised friends in society.

The vast majority of women have experienced unwanted sexual behaviour including illegal behaviour from men, most of us more than once. The fact that we are being told to ignore this over and over and over from many different directions not just this one is very frustrating.