Liliy Madigan

[dinosaursandtea]

She's taking a Twitter break for her mental health because of the level of abuse she's receiving. She's a teenage girl, FFS - and even if you think she's a teenage boy, in what world does a 19 year old deserve this amount of bullying?

I hope you're all fucking happy now.

Interesting, isn't it, that in a discussion about someone who should be representing women and getting their voices heard, this entire website is dismissed because 'it's just a load of mums'.

Yes.

Elendon, it's here www.mumsnet.com/Talk/_chat/3104694-ever-had-a-close-call

Katherina, I think there are lots of posters on MN and these threads who ARE far left. My statement above, sadly is part of some quarters on the far left though, who subscribe to authoritarian versions of far left thought. Its a way of discrediting people like you as much as anyone else to the right of you.

Thinking is deliberately not allowed because its not ideologically pure enough. You aren't a true believer or left enough if you challenge the narrative. You can not call yourself far left if you do not agree.

Its not about left v right. Its about liberal mindedness and authoritarianism. Its about trying to control you into not thinking for the sake of your identity and other goals as a leftie.

Its about shutting down rival voices on the left so that only one is the 'correct' one. Critical thinkers need not apply - rational thought is dangerous to 'the cause'.

Its fucked up. It is a force that is growing in strength though. That's why I say its about a wider force on the far left.

But there's nothing far left about the gender identity ideology! It's regressive and reactionary. Anything that prioritises the individual over a class analysis is the antithesis of leftism. Gender identity dogma is neoliberal individualism that helps capitalism by commodifying personality traits.

Some regressives (fundamental Christians, etc) thing humans should change their personalities to reflect patriarchal gender roles associated with biological sex. Other regressives (transactivists) think humans should change their bodies to reflect patriarchal gender roles associated with biological sex.

Actual progressives and leftists think that humans should be free to express their personalities without reference to patriarchal gender roles associated with biological sex.

This is one of the main things about it that drives me up the wall. Every single thing about it is the inverse of the truth.

Following this with interest.

Well said Catgirl

But there's nothing far left about the gender identity ideology! It's regressive and reactionary. Anything that prioritises the individual over a class analysis is the antithesis of leftism. Gender identity dogma is neoliberal individualism that helps capitalism by commodifying personality traits.

Bollocks. This wilful blindness to how the left isn't all good isn't helpful.

There are bad leftists, centrists and right wingers. The idea that only 'good people' are in one area of the political spectrum makes my mind boggle more - and just shows the point about how politics and identity are tied together in our sense of self.

The idea that people on the left won't try and exploit things for their own political gain is nonsense.

What was Stalin? A capitalist pig dog right winger?
He didn't have much love for 'thinkers' on the left or right.

Ultimately gender identity stuff is means to an end. It can creates personalities who can be martyred. It piggy backs off other leftist causes by trying to point out the similarities but it avoids talking about the darker stuff.

Its how you produce a cult, which once you are part of it, your identity and social circle make it difficult to raise questions even more because of the tie between identity and politics. You are either with us or against us.

The far left meets the far right at some point, in their authoritarian tendencies.

Another Vice article www.vice.com/en_uk/article/kzgwpv/lily-madigan-and-the-hunt-for-past-transgressions

Following media coverage, hordes of outraged transphobes began to attack Lily on social media. The level of vitriol and aggression is genuinely shocking to see, even if you’re used to the nastier corners of Twitter. It’s a grotesque spectacle: a vulnerable teenager being bullied and taunted by people – some of them powerful activists – who are old enough to be her parents

I'm not here to convince transphobic people that their ideas about gender are wrong. I’m under no illusions that I have any power to move someone who insists that trans women are men in dresses, or that trans men are just confused lesbians with eating disorders. I don’t know how to do that – I wish I did.

Bullying a vulnerable young person, using the full weight of the media and the vast hateful horizon of Twitter, is unacceptable. We have seen people bullied and shamed to death this way before, and will again.

Dearie me. I do find it interesting, the way many women feel full compassion/empathy towards trans people, but absolutely none towards other women: those other women are transphobes and very unsympathetic characters indeed.

I think I perhaps thought this way myself, once. (until they noplatformed Germaine Greer and I though HOLDONAMINUTE)

I guess anyone used to the nastiest corners of Twitter will be following the latest terf dox account.
I have yet to see the radfem version.

Lily Madigan wants our details. I want to know what Lily intends to do with the data. Just accessing it is a breach of data protection.

Following media coverage, hordes of outraged transphobes began to attack Lily on social media. The level of vitriol and aggression is genuinely shocking to see, even if you’re used to the nastier corners of Twitter. It’s a grotesque spectacle: a vulnerable teenager being bullied and taunted by people – some of them powerful activists – who are old enough to be her parents

I note that they don't provide examples, assuming that we'll take their word for it - well I've been on the feed, and I can see some angry women, and actually, yes, the occasional bit of vitriol, but it's all relevant, quoting lily's own actions and words - no 'DIAF' no wishing rape, no threats. A lot of questions and critique. TBH, not shocking at all.

What I do find shocking is tweets like the one congratulating Lily for 'bossing' the C4 interview and being a phenomenal women's officer - which certainly wasn't what I saw - I saw her being given a very gentle interview, giving very poor, cliche answers, and not representing the women a women's officer should be representing.

It's clear the people writing that either have an agenda, or haven't tried existing on the internet as a woman, because I've had more aggressive messages following reddit posts than Lily's getting on Twitter, and that me, on a small board, posting as a private citizen, not an elected representative.

Also, what's with Retweets/likes do not equal approval. in Lilly's twitter profile? What does 'like' mean if not bloody approval!

Well said 😊

What does 'like' mean if not bloody approval!

Like will mean whatever Lily wants it to mean, like all the other words. Today, like means 'a small German Shepherd called Toby', tomorrow it will be something very different.

I tell a lie. Shon Faye told someone to throw his phone and himself into the sea.

So yes, I see a death threat.... still not towards lily though.

I've also had worse and seen worse to friends. I have used an outwardly male appearing ID on social media in the past (though not for a long while now). The different reaction and amount of automatic respect you get, is incredible to witness.

I have somewhat retreated to MN as a place that I don't face this over the years.

I can speak freely on MN in a way I can not elsewhere. I think I am right in saying that this one of the reasons MN came about and why it enjoys the success it does - because other places don't allow that same freedom of expression that men take for granted.

Let's face it, the far left are just as good at the Fake News mentality as Donald is. Lily is universally made into a victim, when most of the actually threatening and abusive behavior goes the other way, articles questioning their narrative are labeled biased (like Donald's MSM slogan) and biased outlets (e.g. pinknews to Donald's breitbart or fox and friends) are hailed.

Since you're reading MN apparently Ms trans mum, read this: twitter.com/lisamarchiano/status/938426834412240896

And keep justify destroying lives with your agenda.

YY - and no sympathetic articles on Jack Monroe, who received multiple die terf cunts by tweeting something supportive but mildly critical of Lily, posted upthread

I really do have nothing against Lily in that she is a young(ish) person with some (apparently) dodgy ideas and access to social media. I have such an issue with the wider culture around this - the cries of transphobe, criticism framed as violence, men piling in on women who transgress , the Labour party's treatment of women etc etc

And I dunno how to fix the latter. It's hard to talk about the problems with the big picture without talking about the specific examples - and Lily taking a women's officer role is a specific example.

what's with Retweets/likes do not equal approval. in Lilly's twitter profile?

I take it to mean that Lily must never be held to account for what they do. After all, so far they've been able to disassociate themselves from other stuff they've done whenever it's proved to be an embarrassment.

In Lily's world every day can be year zero is they will it.

Sealed in a cave with no way out.

Abso-fucking-lutely.

And its also probably why Lily's family are 'unsupportive'. Not because they are horrible, but because they actually do care and are bloody concerned about what the future holds.

The sealed in a cave thing, is also why I don't challenge my family about it.

What would it achieve after the fact?

I could do even more damage to all of them.

I think the cave is also why there is a resistance to debate. Because if you are trans, and have even a sliver of doubt, if you are on the road, you know there is no way out - even if you've not had surgery. Its the social constraints as well as any physical consequences.

Why would you want to put yourself in a situation where you might question yourself and increase that tiny sliver of doubt?

I suspect that shutting down debate is an act of self protection for some.

Terrylene
Does anyone know what became of their police investigation into their abuse?

At around that time, Fox's video equating gay people with 'deviant' was removed from YouTube. Which was good because it was homophobic hate speech, and illegal.

nauticant
what's with Retweets/likes do not equal approval. in Lilly's twitter profile?
because Lily doesnt know the correct form is 'retweets do not equal endorsement.' Which has an entirely different meaning.

Thank you Saskia.

I've always thought retweets do not equal endorsement to be especially weaselly.

Interesting, isn't it, that in a discussion about someone who should be representing women and getting their voices heard, this entire website is dismissed because 'it's just a load of mums'.

Indeed. But real women can just shut up. The ladies with cocks are speaking now. Go on back to your kitchens and don't worry your pretty little heads

That Ribble Valley thing enraged me. I grew up there and to see that 'To Lily'
What is it about him that they felt the need to do that? Support for someone being bullied by meanies I suppose. What a mess of stupidness.

Ribble Valley, home to the youth of the Labour Party. Right on!

Getting down! Yeah!

There is no abuse, just a questioning of her (his) being qualified to be women's officer
He does know that TERF is a term of a abuse, because I was on a FB thread the other night (where he mentioned the pretty data) where he was told repeatedly that it was a term of abuse.
He was on Channel 4 news talking about how he was inspired to apply for the post because he disagreed with some other women's officers views on transgender. i.e. someone suggested a 19 year old boy with a penis isn't a woman and in return said petulant boy decided he would prove he was. After hounding said women's officer out of her post