R4 Today programme have an item on later about children and gender dysphoria.

[Iris65]

Looking forward to hearing this.

Regarding the use of puberty blockers I am reminded of Jeff Goldblum's line in Jurassic Park, 'Just because we can, doesn't mean we should.'

jessica

I’ve read them describing their ‘female orgasms’. Straight out of the porn playbook. Thrashing around on the bed, being driven demented with ecstasy as multiple orgasms shudder through them.

In all fairness, some of the other posters were rather sceptical. But it’s just a different version of my cock’s longer than yours, isn’t it?

I think the mistake is to think that men who want to be women are viewing sex in the same way that women do.

I think they view "sex as a woman" in much the same way as very many other men view it - as being the object of penetration. It's consistent with the view that women who consent to sex with one man will have sex with another man (rape myth), that prostitution is an aspect of a woman's sexuality or that sex ends when a man has an orgasm etc.

"Gender realignment"? That sounds like old white woman talk.

Get with the program, "gender confirmation surgery" is far better and sounds positive and life-affirming.

I think they view "sex as a woman" in much the same way as very many other men view it - as being the object of penetration.

Exactly. It’s not about being a woman, it’s about fetishising their idea of the perfect woman they want to fuck.

Which is why the fetish relies on them subjugating themselves, being compliant, objectified, subordinated, etc.

Would anyparent consider supporting their DIIP child by going down such a highly medical, irreversible route?

I recently read an article about a child who transed at 14, then deteansitioned at 17, by which time his features had softened and his height was stunted. His mother genuinely felt she was doing the right thing, as she feared self harm/suicide. If I recall correctly, she was giving him her own prescribed medication, in the absence of a willing medical professional. I wonder who provided her with such 'advice'

There's another article , about a man who eventually travelled to Asia, to have his leg amputated. He says that he has now taken on the role of gatekeeper for his surgeon. His insistence they he' just knew' from the age of 4, that the leg wasn't meant to be there, and that he felt like an amputee trapped in the wrong (able bodied) body.
The script is so frighteningly familiar.
I'm struck by what looks to me to be almost one-upmanship among transgender youngsters/teens, like a fashion trend.

Could DIIP really be the next big thing?...

Would anyparent consider supporting their DIIP child by going down such a highly medical, irreversible route?

I recently read an article about a child who transed at 14, then deteansitioned at 17, by which time his features had softened and his height was stunted. His mother genuinely felt she was doing the right thing, as she feared self harm/suicide. If I recall correctly, she was giving him her own prescribed medication, in the absence of a willing medical professional. I wonder who provided her with such 'advice'

There's another article , about a man who eventually travelled to Asia, to have his leg amputated. He says that he has now taken on the role of gatekeeper for his surgeon. His insistence they he' just knew' from the age of 4, that the leg wasn't meant to be there, and that he felt like an amputee trapped in the wrong (able bodied) body.
The script is so frighteningly familiar.
I'm struck by what looks to me to be almost one-upmanship among transgender youngsters/teens, like a fashion trend.

Could DIIP really be the next big thing?...

www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/11/01/transgender-people-can-end-badly-damaged-says-lord-robert-winston/

Predictable backlash:

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5041267/Backlash-Lord-Winston-gender-operations-warning.html

It's a pity that The Telegraph repeated the Stonewall figures uncritically. They are unreliable for several reasons.

Good for Robert Winston speaking up about this issue with facts.

Can't believe the TRA response is that Robert Winston is not qualified to talk about it. He treats adults with fertility problems from cross sex hormones. He is a leading expert in fertility so probably understands how hormones work better than 99.9% of people. How much better qualifications do they want?

The comments are encouraging though. I particularly enjoyed:

"Renowned scientist is criticised by people who are not scientists for stating a scientifically and empirically provable fact. Magical."

Of course, most of the TRAs are later transitioning MtF, who quite possibly have children already, or at least had the opportunity to consider it as mature adults before transition (if they have undertaken medical/surgical transition at all). The fertility implications of the puberty blocker to cross sex hormone trajectory, or hormones purchased on the interest, are of no consequence to them.

I can’t believe the Daily Mail reported a transactivist saying that Robert Winston was unqualified and a ‘terrible cunt’.

That will get every single Daily Mail reader rushing to their silver framed photo of Winston in protective outrage.

What idiots trans transactivists are. I suspect they will start calling him old, outdated, underinformed and on the wrong side of history soon.

I hope they do. We need more people like Winston to talk about this.

Whilst this is being played out online, people are having to deal with pseudoscience, zealotry, narcissistic rage and the denial of biology and science.

All the ridiculous arguments about what constitutes biological sex, why we categorise based on sex and not hair colour, and why we’re not clown fish.

These arguments really need to be had in front of an audience of millions. Transactivism would disappear overnight.

How much better qualifications do they want?

A GRC, probably.

I really think that reddit thread should be required reading for parents of any child thinking about taking puberty blocking drugs (and the child too). The threat of suicide makes many parents want to do this but the hopeless situation that they end up in surely is going to make them more suicidal not less?

hipsterfun

How much better qualifications do they want?

A GRC, probably.

Flippant though that might sound, it absolutely nails it. You are profoundly right.

You’re not allowed to discuss trans matters unless you are trans. But you can represent women if you are a man. Breathtaking arrogance.

Thoughts of suicide are very high among teenagers. Particularly girls. And there needs to be a lot of unpicking about whether the depression and anxiety causes thoughts of transgenderism rather than the other way around. In earlier decades, girls became anorexia. Nowadays, they want to chop their breasts off. Anorexia is reversible but testosterone isn't.

The older AGPs don't care about the young people mutilating themselves and destroying their fertility. They are pure cannon fodder to prop up their own self-serving narrative. It's absolutely evil.

Jiggly you nailed it. While we're all off discussing trans issues we're not discussing why so many kids feel depressed and suicidal.

we're not discussing why so many kids feel depressed and suicidal

That's because TRAs convince people that young people are suicidal because people are being transphobic towards them.

One is not allowed to consider that perhaps the depression and suicidal thoughts are symptoms of mental illness which also leads to the belief they are transgender.

The suicide aspect is horrendous.

I was reading a thread where a mother was talking about her daughter. The daughter was constantly encouraged to transition online. She was depressed and isolated and was told that transitioning was the only answer.

After transitioning, she got steadily worse. She was still isolated and in a great deal of distress.

She was told by TRAs well of course you’re depressed. Everyone hates you now, because you’re trans, dur.

How atypical and surprising. A transwoman using cunt as an insult. twitter.com/BeffernieBlack/status/925744722806796289

But isn't that sort of insult banned from Twitter?

A Twitter satirist was banned for calling Gary Lineker a 'virtue-signalling cunt'.

thefenlandconversation.wordpress.com/2017/07/20/mentioning-gary-linekar-the-virtue-signalling-cunt-gets-you-banned-on-twitter/

Do the same rules apply if you are a 'Trans comedian'? Do you get carte blanche to refer to 77 year old doctors as 'cunts' for daring to state that cosmetic surgery operations have complications? Do you get to keep your Twitter account and your 'verified' status? Or are some people more equal than others?

i am not being flippant but it must be so confusing for children being told all this mis-information.

some will feel suicidal, no doubt. if you are told you dont meet the kardashian ideal of femininity then of course you are not female.

and when you find out (possibly in a biology lesson?) that this is all nonsense then you would be equally depressed.

the information is the perfect example of fake news.

Those TRA comments about Prof Winston are unbelievable!

How can anyone possibly listen to a renowned expert in fertility and reproductive surgery talk of his first-hand experience that 'what I have been seeing in a fertility clinic, are the long-term results, of often very unhappy people who now feel quite badly damaged' and decide that 'Robert Winston is in no f way qualified to talk about trans people, he is a fertility doctor.’!!

Yes, that's the point! An expert fertility doctor who is dealing directly with the aftermath of trans surgery and cross-sex hormones, and who has seen the outcome years down the line on his own examination table!

But no. To the TRAs, Prof Winston is 'a cunt' talking 'bullshit'.

They don't even want to acknowledge that there could be the teeniest, tiniest problem a few years down the line, do they? They don't want this information to get out. Why not?