Number of trans people who are murderers is greater than the number of trans people who are murder victims in UK **Title amended by MNHQ**

[WombOfOnesOwn]

This year, the number of murderers who are transgender is higher in the UK than the number of murder victims.

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4156440/Transgender-woman-boyfriend-murdered-flatmate.html

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4997224/Father-two-stabbed-death-transgender-woman.html

And then there's attempted murders and current murderers declaring themselves trans while behind bars:

www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/jailed-killer-who-chopped-testicles-9882176

www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/transgender-murderer-moved-womens-prison-9770465

www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/transgender-woman-accused-trying-murder-9569383

www.thesun.co.uk/news/2193637/transgender-female-running-champ-to-be-detained-in-hospital-after-trying-to-murder-top-uk-athletics-official/

Does the fact that MTFs are victimizers in these obscenely violent criminal acts more frequently than they are victims change how lawmakers will see their claims of eternal victimhood? I doubt it. How many male murderers will have to be given elective surgery at taxpayer expense and housed with women (far less likely to be in prison for violent crime) before someone takes a long, hard look at the reality of the situation?

No, its males fault for commiting male violence and having no respect for females.

Just like your child does when he insists on using female spaces, and takes those away from us.

"Dear daughter of mine, you too are a boat!"

I really think our new friend should try that approach. Or maybe a fighter plane if that sounds cooler.

Feminist4

One schoolgirl per day is raped in school. 60% of school girls have either been sexually harassed or sexual assaulted. 25% of school girls will not speak up in class for fear that it draws attention to them.

Girls have every right to occasionally enjoy the sanctity of a female only space. Without the presence of male bodied people, and certainly with out having to validate them.

I'm quite sure you could support your child, and hold a genuinely feminist viewpoint at the same time. I understand why logic and rationality might disappear, in an effort to empathise with your child. But, in my opinion, it would be worth at least thinking about communicating a little differently.

AAK, how's this?

That’s because she’s your child and you have brainwashed her into thinking transgender women are bogeymen

Perhaps it's not that she thinks they're "bogeymen" but simply that she thinks they are males (males are not, by default, bogeymen) and for a wide range of reasons she doesn't want to get changed in front of one.

Annandale I agree about hormones. I once had the implant and for a week I was evil. I was physically violently angry (at things, not people) for the first time in my life.

It wore off, but I would never have it again, I truly wasnt in control. It baffles me hormones are given so freely with no idea of consequence, and if I recall correctly side effects have been used as an excuse for transwomen commiting violent crimes.

It’s up to individual transgender women to come to terms with their own gender. It takes a lot of courage to make the change in such a hostile world. No person would choose life long medication and surgery if it really were a choice. It’s much more deep rooted than that. We tried hard enough to persuade her it might be a phase or a mistake. It’s a horrible situation to feel trapped in the wrong body and know you face a lifetime of abuse. To still be prepared to go ahead with it rather than live a life of pretence is a difficult decision.

Needs more old timey clocks and pocket watches, Floral!

The main ‘crime’ is suicide. Very high in the transgender community.

Males commit suicide at greater rates than transwomen.

But anyway, yes theres a problem.

So how do you suggest helping males cope with these male issues without it affecting females?

Actually, many people choose life-long (or multi-decade medication) because it suits their purposes. Many transgender people do not choose surgery now either, which is where some of the issues begin arising.

Nobody disputes that transgender people face challenges around how they wish to physically present. What is disputed is whether their decision to make physical changes to a greater or lesser degree then gives them the right to access spaces previously reserved exclusively for people of the opposite sex.

Feminist4

Did your child mention the suicide statistics? Or did you find that out independently?

If it's the former, might I suggest you do some research of your own? Starting with Transgendertrend.

It has to be beneficial to get independent, balanced view point.

The main ‘crime’ is suicide. Very high in the transgender community.

Do you have some statistics around that? I have seen quite a bit of quoting of statistics about 'suicide attempts' and how much higher they are in the transgender community. But higher attempts do not necessarily correspond to a higher actual suicide rate, as we already know from female vs male suicide statistics.

So are there actual statistics for the rate of suicide is in the transgender community vs general population and other sub-populations?

The main point here, 4, is that other women are not willing to set ourselves on fire to keep your child warm. No matter how many times you call us Victorians/boats/etc.

Also, on the question of boats, I think I would like to be a catamaran (because fast).

I did the research. It is quite high. I don’t want to get side tracked into discussing that. My issue is that I see my daughter as female as does she. She does not identify at all with men. We should welcome more women into our community. She is facing the same kind of stigmatism that gay people went through 40 years ago. Transgender people are finally beginning to feel they can be themselves instead of living a sad and lonely lie for their whole lives. As a minority group who want to champion women - as she does- we should welcome them - not demonise them

Feminist4

It might reassure you to know that the Tavistock have only reported one teen suicide in ten years.

How is a woman setting hereself on fire by being welcoming to my daughter? It would be a privilege.

Or maybe a luxury yacht, but a small one because I'm a shortarse.

That is due to the Tavistock’s success. It is the people who are rejected by their families and friends and who struggle to find work in a world where few accept them. They are the ones that kill themselves.

My issue is that I see my daughter as female as does she.

And other people's issue is that although they would like your daughter to be treated with care and compassion, they don't accept that just because you and your daughter agree on her femaleness, that they must also agree, not only on your daughter's femaleness, but on the femaleness of all males who claim it.

Does that make your judgement about my daughter acceptable and morally right? I don’t think so. It is prejudiced and harmful beyond belief.

No male who forces his way into female spaces is an asset to women.

Any male that lies and then insists all women lie about who/what he is, is already a danger to women.

You can not and will not ever force people to participate in your beliefs

My issue is that I see my daughter as female as does she.
You can't force other people into your belief system.

She does not identify at all with men.
So? Woman isn't 'not feeling manly'
Identify with is meaningless, it doesn't change what is - and that isn't mean womens' fault.

We should welcome more women into our community.
What community are you talking about specifically, and who are these 'women'?
How do this minority group want to 'champion women' exactly? By ignoring our concerns, lived experiences and boundaries?

Look, I get that this is a personal and emotional issue for you. But the important questions won't disappear because they make you uncomfortable.

What makes you more right than the people going through this. It isn’t a mental illness. Your ‘care and compassion’ isn’t at all visible in the vitriol on these boards. What right have you to judge how female these women are? How would you know?