Gender reassignment surgery... Would you then be happy with them in female spaces?

[TurquoiseChevrotain]

I don't have an issue with transgender individuals, etc.

However, I know there are feminism issues. Jus curious if a biological male has his penis removed, do you still have an issue?

But I agree most of these things are post puberty, but a few are not.

TurquoiseChevrotain, This is a bit more what I was thinking of...

www.researchgate.net/publication/224914505_Physical_Fitness_Differences_Between_Prepubescent_Boys_and_Girls

(a cross-sectional study involving 312 children -10.8 ± 0.4 years).

"The boys presented higher values in all selected tests, except tests of balance and flexibility, in which girls scored better."

"... differences in the physical fitness were greatest in the explosive strength of upper (p ≤ 0.01, η(p)(2) = 0.09) and lower limbs (p ≤ 0.01, η(p)(2) = 0.08)"

"The physical activity in the girls, and the endomorphic and body fat in the boys, did not have a significant effect. These findings can help in the planning of activities that take into account the success and motivation of both boys and girls and thus increase levels of physical activity and physical fitness at school. However, in prepubescent children, one cannot neglect the influence of genetic determinism, observed from the morphoconstitutional point of view"

Physical Fitness Differences Between Prepubescent Boys and Girls (PDF Download Available). Available from: www.researchgate.net/publication/224914505_Physical_Fitness_Differences_Between_Prepubescent_Boys_and_Girls [accessed Sep 22, 2017].

This is the bit that gets me.

If we were not always required to prove that girls were just as good as boys maybe we would be interested in these differences.

Maybe we should be saying why can't boys read body language as easily as girls. Why do they lag behind in toilet training, etc.

Personally, I think comparisons are pointless. But why are some things valued over others? When whatever skills girls might develop sound bloody important to me.

Certainly of no less value.

Datun my only interest is really are these changes innate or are they things we as parents/society control.

The fact girls start puberty earlier seems innate (to me). It doesn't so much matter to me if boys start toilet training later if it is innate.

I have a dd and a ds, looking at ds at 7, his physic looks so much like a 'typical boy', male. It does seem innate. However my ds is a very typical 'boy' in interests and my dd was not a typical girl in interests, and these things are not innate and do not bother me one bit.

I just find this subject quite interesting.

I just find this subject quite interesting.

Me too. Despite being intensely aware of how it could disadvantage females.

I believe puberty, certainly in girls, is getting younger and younger.

Statistically is that innate? Something in the water?

I'm not sure how we could blame society?

Parental nutrition maybe?

Either way, it looks like these things might be on a hair trigger, and we can influence them in the blink of an eye.

I have heard girls with no father figure at home go through puberty earlier!

It seems to be decided by weight, hight, size, protein?

news.berkeley.edu/2010/09/17/puberty/

www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2009/mar/28/early-puberty-absent-fathers

Italiangreyhound

How extraordinary.

I'd love to see a similar study done on girls who become trans.

No

Datun I do wonder what other factors female trans kids and teens may have in common (beside being trans). This is not to say, whatever they have in common will be in common for all.

PS I ma taking a position, I am thinking about the 'issues.'

Italiangreyhound

Anorexia is overly represented amongst women who are trans.

The theory being that because they suffer from discrimination and hardship, they turn to anorexia as a means of control.

However.

Last year I was reading about the specific brain differences between people who are trans and people who aren't (not to be confused with the differences between men and women).

I'm not a scientist. But the link I was reading let me directly to a link where probing a certain part the brain helps with anorexia.

Perhaps it comes from the same place.

And autism is massively over represented in trans or vice versa, can never remember how these things work.

I wonder if being a target of violence or abuse is much more widely (proportionately) represented in the lives of trans men (females) than trans woman (males). I have no idea but it' a guess.

www.advocate.com/commentary/2015/07/14/op-ed-breaking-my-silence-trans-man-who-attempted-suicide?page=0,0

And may experience more violence once they 'have transitioned'/'are transitioning' (as trans men) although this seems to be rarely talked about in the media.

4thwavenow.com/2016/04/27/shrinking-to-survive-a-former-trans-man-reports-on-life-inside-queer-youth-culture/