White women- it's all your fault

[WeldMeDaphne]

I will preface this by saying that I am indeed a white woman. And I realise this affords me a lot of privilege.
Among a lot of the rhetoric around the Events unfolding in the US (mostly Charlottesville), I've seen a number of open letters to white women about our complicity in the neo-nazi and white supremacist movement in the US and elsewhere. Clearly those women marching last week on the nazi side were white, but there was a lot of suggestion that those white women not marching but associated with men marching (wives girlfriends etc) were just as culpable as the men wielding torches and assault rifles. I guess I would like some help understanding how this is a white woman issue rather than the white men being responsible for their own actions? I get that one of those pieces said those men are going home to pie cooked by their doting wives but I just feel as though a man who holds those views and has no issue with demonstrating them publically is unlikely to be a caring loving husband?
I am fully prepared to listen to all view points and I totally understand that the people on these marches are white, but they're mostly men, right? Sonhow is this women's fault?

One crime connects mass shooters and terror suspects: domestic violence

Academics at Northeastern University have been studying the common traits of terrorists and mass-murderers

A trait shared with May's allies, domestic violence perpetrators like Trump and Bannon, who both have documented violence against women 'previous'.

www.independent.co.uk/news/link-between-domestic-violence-terror-mass-shootings-crime-a7901971.html

One person I was arguing with said it was white women's fault because we don't report/leave our men* when they are violent.

Equally I have been on twitter threads where women in the UK, terming themselves radfems where saying Muslim women should be put down so they can stop bringing up peadophile men.

*Clearly white women only date white neo Nazi males

There are fake accounts on social media purporting to be white women. This is an attempt to divide feminists and women generally. Don't fall for it.

White women are being blamed for the collapse of western civ..

Not just sm though, @streetvoiceuk was telling me he'd seen white radfems say similar in RL. I've seen alot of mysogyny in feminism so im inclined to believe him.

Blaming women for male violence doesn't look like radical feminism to me.
If there actually are women who claim to be radfems and say such things, they're blatantly lying.

But, Gone', if a man tells you he saw "white radfems" do something, then take that with a grain of salt. Everyone who knows about basic biology is called a radical feminist (or more often a terf) these days, so unless that person herself identifies as radfem, that means nothing.

Well certainly the gfs and wifes of these men even if they didn't attend, are just as much to blame.

But saying that this is white women's fault is somewhat of a leap.

I've known him for along time online, he's allways been honest and open with me and believe it or not I can make that judgement for myself. Like I said they did id as radfems which I why I found it vile, unfortunately not unusual though as I grew up with a radfem mother who was highly abusive and mysogynistic as were many of the radfems she had as friends. Mysogyny is everywhere including in those who claim to be above it.

If a woman chooses to be with a white supremacist she is endorsing that and is as bad

Well certainly the gfs and wifes of these men even if they didn't attend, are just as much to blame

I'm sorry, I don't agree.

Of course tacitly (or otherwise) endorsing the vile hatred that these people spew is unacceptable. There are many people who create the environment where others feel able to say and do this stuff without fear of being called out, socially shamed, arrested or opposed. Notably, of course, Trump himself.

But endorsing something is a long way short of actually doing something, and it's really important to maintain this distinction.

I can't help but see parallels between this and rape culture. I've seen it written a thousand times that we demand men challenge offending behaviour and that, to not do so, is to be complicit.

By this token, white women are complicit in a culture and system that oppresses poc. Those that belong to the class that subjugates poc really shouldn't be saying "what's that got to do with me". Least of all on this forum, where individual situations are apparently secondary to one's class.

This, for example:

"what the fuck have neo-nazi's in Charlottesville have to do with me?"

Obviously, white women who are not themselves white supremacists but date/marry them are not directly to blame. Having said that, yes, the are complicit and, depending on the exact circumstances (which may obviously vary from case to case) may very well be enablers. And as such, they are not entirely free of guilt.

It's not doing women any favours to deny our agency and our capacity for having an agenda beyond 'standing by our man'. Most of these women are free to choose not to be involved with these men!

If I've managed a lifetime of refusing to date Tories, surely out-and-proud neo-nazis shouldn't be too hard to achieve.

The title of you post says it all really, you have already made up your mind and are not willing to accept any other perspective. I have never heard a Black woman say what the title of your post says and I say that as Black women.

However a number of Black women including myself do not identify themselves as a feminist due to attitudes like your post.

White women love to talk about White men amc their privilege and white man racism. Completely ignoring that white Women have historically been complicit in racism towards women of colour. Including during periods of slavery. White feminists also regularly ignore the specific struggles that women of colour experience. I could write teams about this but what's the point

A lot of White feminists also like to portray themselves as innocent and bystanders in relation to racism. A recent example is the huge number of white Women who voted for Trump. In addition look at the issue of the gender pay gap. The reality is that white men are paid more than white women. However white Women benegit from being paid more and are promoted quicker than women of colour, but again this is conveniently ignored. Apparently we are all in this together .

Who is giving birth to and helping to raise these people . Please let's not ignore the women who are willing and openly part of these groups as they are there and have always been there.

In addition what about some of these women falsely reporting sexual assaults by Black men, leading them to spending years I prison

Ok, muchomo, I take your point that I should have thought about the title of my post better. I apologise for that, and if MN had an edit function I would gladly alter. I am going to re-read your posts and have a think about your points as well.

muchomo

Possibly a bit harsh. Some feminists get it. I think the problem is with a 'one-size-fits-all' doctrine.

Harsh perhaps, I probably deserved it for the title of the post, though I was angry at the time reading multiple posts about women's responsibility for men's behaviour.

MotherPeresaA possibly I was, but very frustrating to see that title and the subsequent posts with the lack of ownership or acknowledgement.

I think women need to take responsibility for their behaviour as well expecially when it comes to racism. These people are not just passive bystanders. Historically White Women have been involved and complicit in racism towards Black women, these dates back to slavery it's time to own it.

Weldmedaphne

#NotAllWhitePeople and it made you angry? Ok.

@freeblackgirl (evette Dione) is claiming so on twitter. So are alot of her followers (although can't be sure they are who they claim to be)

no, the accusation that women are automatically responsible for men's actions made me angry. Given that these are unlikely to be men who are particularly pleasant in any part of their life it seems a little much to be expecting them to make sure their menfolk aren't upto any kind of shenanigans, hey?

That was meant as reply to much sorry!