I am Jazz. ***Trans content. Please do not open if you just want to post insults or whinge about another trans thread***

[CosmicPineapple]

I am Jazz is a reality show focusing on the journey of a teenage transgirl/woman whos parents supported transition from aged 5 and has been on TV since aged 6.
Now aged 16.

I don't watch the show as I strongly disagree with everything about it. However I briefly saw a clip of the next episode as the tv happened to be on the channel that airs I am Jazz I had been watching say yes to the dress and it was about dating.

Jazz goes to a sort of speed dating event where everyone is sat in the dark. Jazz wants a relationship, which is normal for a teenager however Jazz does not tell the boys/men that they are trans and in fact male.
As they are in darkness Jazz feels that if they get to know each other without the barrier of seeing each other/being trans it may lead to a relationship.

For me this is totally wrong.
Why should it be ok for Jazz or anyone to withold the truth about a very important aspect of who they are?
Plus I would imagine there to be some very upset and angry teenage boys when they find out they have been duped and lied to.

I remember a good few years ago where a man killed his partner after finding out on a TV show that they were trans. There have been a few similar murders over the years.
I am in no way condoning the murder or harm of another person I am just highlighting the danger that can come if you lie about the sex you are and it should not be encouraged as no relationship can survive on lies.

I just wondered what other peoples thoughts are on the subject of lying about your sex to the people you date?

hoping she gets her dream of a female body..
There are no ovaries and uterus at the end of this path for Jazz. There isn't even a real vagina (capable of stretching to ridiculous proportions and having the elasticity to go back, capable of self cleaning and keeping diseases out, capable of intense sexual pleasure, capable of passing out menstrual blood and human beings ) There is just a hole, that might smell bad, that will need lubricating and dilating so that it doesn't close back up and is capable of nothing but simply admitting a penis (without much pleasure for her). She cannot achieve her dream of a female body.

That is why it's such a tragedy, because it is a lie, she cannot have what she desperately wants, but her whole life she has been told that she can - and it is only now, when she is so far down the path, that she is beginning to understand that reality cannot be bent to her will. She has been sold a lie her whole life by the people she loves most in the world.

Eezer
Children don't stop taking blockers and go through natural puberty. 100% of children on blockers go on to take cross sex hormones. Social transition and hormone blockers absolutely guarantee that the child won't grow out of it and will definitely be trans.

missmoney puberty is an essential neurological developmental stage that transitions children to adulthood. Brain, body and hormonal changes all take place with the advent of puberty and combine to support normal adolescent development. Stagnating at age 11 is simply not healthy.

Ive started a thread about this on this board but am posting a link here because its loosely related.
This woman was referred to a transgender clinic after losing her clitoris was removed during an operation Shes had many ops due to silicone poisoning.

www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/its-like-something-out-horror-8903972

Pretzels..maybe that's enough for many trans people..why would you go throu all that if it was t something you desperately wanted...I don't know..I'm absolutely no expert,I just think ,you must be desperate to put yourself throu all the changes ,so maybe the vagina you describe is enough for her?

Apologies for what is probably a stupid question, but why wouldn't they still grow up? Surely they'd still have life experiences, be learning stuff in school and so on?

Yes they get older and continue to learn and experience things, but as other posters have said they don't develop. Their brain is that of a long lived child rather than a young adult IYSWIM? Everything they see and learn they experience it in the same way a child would, rather than the way an adolescent or an adult would; probably in much simpler, black and white terms and more accepting of what people tell them - not thinking to question if received wisdom comes from a place of authority.

How do you, er, clean a pretend vagina thoroughly after sex? Can't imagine that's a whole lot of fun either TBH.

I do understand some of points on here..that by feeding in to it at a young age they have reinforced her feelings of being female..that possibly may of gone away with time,

I guess just a bath would be ok

why would you go throu all that if it was t something you desperately wanted

But WHY does Jazz desperately want a neovagina? Why does Jazz not accept their male body? Why can't Jazz be a feminine gay boy with a working penis? Because Jazz has been groomed into this from age 6.

Neovaginas have to be douched regularly (even if not having sex) to remove build up of tissue that accrues. This is unpleasant and time consuming. They also have to be dilated with penis sized objects daily for months, then regularly for the rest of their lives. Neovaginas can and do grow over if not dilated. This is painful, especially during healing.
There is NO WAY that a real, functioning vagina can ever be created. There are multiple issues with neovaginas and the type that Jazz will be forced to have (made from colon or thigh flesh) is even more problematic. The parents have condemned their child to a lifetime of medicalisation, pain and degradation. They should be ashamed. They should be prosecuted.

We don't really know what the consequences are for psychological maturity because nobody has ever done any research.
I still find it utterly mind boggling that when the ethics of treating children are normally so carefully thought through, doctors are allowed to basically experiment on Jazz and similar children in a way that risks having catastrophic consequences.
It might make some sense if there was actually some evidence for the claim that otherwise they would commit suicide, but there isn't. It's just something people say.

Eezergoode

Maybe it is enough for her, but its a position that she has been encouraged and groomed into since before she was old enough to understand. If an adult man with sex dismorphia desperately needs to remove his penis and have a 'vagina' built to aid his mental health then i wouldn't argue with him. It's his body and his choice. But jazz is still far too young to make this kind of drastic decision, and it's a choice that has, in essence, been made for her, years ago by her parents, doctors and the producers of 'I am Jazz'. This isn't a free choice that she has come to over time and with experience, and it isn't a choice that she is making with knowledge of all the facts - how can it be when she is told she's a girl, same as any other, since she was tiny?

Someone up thread posted about Jazz asking her dad how much of the vagina does a man see during sex. She comes across as incredibly naive and without much understanding of, well, anything. How can she be in a position to honestly and irrevocably decide that a hole made of colon is going to be enough?

why would you go throu all that if it was t something you desperately wanted.

Because having a hole for a man to put his dick in is what makes you a women/female??
Because if you no longer have a penis than you are a women?
Because maybe then hetro men will want to be in a relationship with you?

None of the above should be a reason because none of them are true but I suspect that is the belief of some

Oh gosh.im getting confused..I don't know to any of it..

I've done a little digging. Mark Cummings is a transman, now detransitioned. He is scathing about the trans ideology. Although he is saying things that, to be honest, I have heard many times.

He had occasion to have some contact with Jazz Jennings' mother because he was originally instrumental in some of the dealings with her.

Apparently, this is part of the communication he had with her mother.

ngequality.blogspot.co.uk/2015/06/coming-soon-i-am-jazz-another-reality.html?m=1

Sorry, perhaps I should be saying she, now, not he.

Eezer I think confusion is a very reasonable response to the utter lunacy of all this.
Poor Jazz.

Bear in mind that this woman will be on high alert about ever writing anything that could be construed coercive. Yes does.

"Everything they see and learn they experience it in the same way a child would, rather than the way an adolescent or an adult would; probably in much simpler, black and white terms and more accepting of what people tell them - not thinking to question if received wisdom comes from a place of authority."

A perfect under/ servant class.

I've watched a little bit of this program out of curiosity and totally agree with the PPs here saying it is a form of abuse to allow this to happen to a child. The mother was getting weirdly excited when they went to the hospital to check Jazz's hormone levels, it's clear that she loves the attention and did put me in mind of munchausen by proxy.

I'm also puzzled how Jazz "fancies" boys as she's not started puberty, it strikes me that she is desperate to date because it's what the other girls are doing and she just wants to join in so much and prove how much of a girl she is. It's hard not to feel sorry for the poor kid.

If you said to anyone, especially an 11-year-old child, yes you can be regarded as a woman, but you will never have babies, never have sex properly, struggle to find a partner, you will have no libido, spend rest of your life dilating your sexual organs and be on medication, untested for the duration - how many people are going to say great!

According to Eezer, this has come as a complete shock to Jazz.

Especially as there is little evidence of gender dysphoria. She was diagnosed, yes, but the narrative describes it as liking things of the opposite sex. Jazz, to all appearances, was a very happy kid.

To put it another way only 20% of male ADULTS choose bottom surgery. They transition entirely without puberty blockers. And even then they often only have hormones to soften their features, or give them boobs, but they don't have genital surgery.

I'm not blaming you Eezer, but you are illustrating my point about how this program has marketed something experimental, horrifying, and unpredictable, as good. The spin is brainwashing by another name.

What ever you think of Jazz's or her parent's motivation, what she has ended up with cannot possibly considered something that will provide her with a positive life.

That email from Jazz's mother made for interesting reading. Both in the way that she wants to be included in the questions (attention seeker) and in the way she wants to lead Jazz into giving the 'right' answers (controlling, with a dash of rewriting history). And its clear, even from that little excerpt, how much pressure Jazz is feeling to perform this role of transgender advocate, and how its taking its toll.

If her mother really valued jazz's well being and happiness above the publicity and money then surely she would stop pushing her into public speaking when she is feeling lots of pressure and 'hasn't been herself'. Jazz needs privacy, and probably therapy, not to be centre ring of her mother's trans/media circus.

Icantreachthepretzels

Exactly. I completely agree.

Even if Jazz is mis-remembering things, she is now coming at it from an entirely different perspective. That of an adult, or adolescent, whose priorities are completely different to those of an 11-year-old child.

Children rely on adults seeing into the future. It's part of being an adult with the responsibility of raising kids!

Affirmation and acceptance of what an 11-year-old wants, has a limit. Ffs.

Furthermore, Jazz has no choice now. She is not, nor ever will be a woman. In fact, her parents have made absolutely certain that jazz is, and will forever be, known as a transgender person. She will never have a chance of going stealth, ever.

Her choice is to retain the genitalia of an 11-year-old boy, or go for a neovagina with the result of being capable of being fucked by someone where she will have no enjoyment.

Dear God.

Anyone who doesn't see the misogyny underlying in this is blind.