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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

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Original poster

Men bashing

512 replies

PirateQueenie · 01/05/2017 14:57

Hi all,

I don't have a real purpose to this thread other than to just voice my confusion and possibly hear some other opinions.

I would identify as feminist - although for want of a better word, I would rather say I'm an egalitarian. I enjoy reading these threads, and comment on some. But what really disheartens me is all the man-bashing Ive seen. I have a male partner who is my world ♥ wonderful male friends and family members, and when I read some of the things on here I can't help but feel very defensive of the men in my life.

Is this the new wave of feminism? Or am I missing something? When I was growing up (with my mum as an avid feminist), I never heard "men this" or "men that" it was always about how women can strengthen and empower themselves WITHOUT putting men down.

OP posts:
Prawnofthepatriarchy · 01/05/2017 15:42

I think you'd find if Muslims were responsible for 98% of sex crime there'd be quite a backlash, OP. Feminism exists because of woman bashing. Men, as a class, oppress women, as a class. The key word there being "class". Sure, there are umpteen individual men who are delightful. As a group, not so much.

Even those delightful men seldom do anything to redress the balance between the sexes. Women have had to fight every step of the way.

Sexism is like racism. The sex who rules the roost is unwilling to lose any of the privileges of masculinity.

It's not that women are man bashing. The exact opposite is true. Indeed, should men ever allow us true equality, there would be no longer any need for feminism.

WellErrr · 01/05/2017 15:44

Yeah, but ignoring male violence etc isn't 'empowering women' is it?

Despite what society tells us, we don't have to STFU. If men don't like that women feel uncomfortable being approached walking the streets at night, how about they stop raping?

LassWiTheDelicateAir · 01/05/2017 15:49

Ha ha Queenie you have posted a post of mine. I was quoting in the black highlights a post made by Cadnowylt - who is a man.

Original poster
PirateQueenie · 01/05/2017 15:51

Thanks Prawn - I just kind of wanted some explanation. Maybe I'm just a bit naive or lucky that I've not experienced a great deal of a struggle as a woman. But I do appreciate everyone's experiences and appreciate you replying without getting so angry at me! ☺

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HmmOkay · 01/05/2017 15:51

Lass, Grin

Original poster
PirateQueenie · 01/05/2017 15:53

Ha sorry Lass, I did block out the name as I didn't want to cause an argument. It wasn't your comment that I was talking about either, it was the one prior that you quoted about "Billy no mates"

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Original poster
PirateQueenie · 01/05/2017 15:54

I've also seen that same male poster get chastised on other posts, for having a male opinion!

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HmmOkay · 01/05/2017 15:55

Sorry Queenie. Not laughing at you. Just tickled at the fact that an example of man bashing came from a man. cadnowyllt made that comment and he is a man.

Best advice is to comment on the thread itself otherwise things can get a bit confused. As happened here.

OlennasWimple · 01/05/2017 15:55

OP, I agree with you on the specific example you gave upthread (and said so at the time on that thread)

But I don't see example after example of "man bashing", I see discussion of class analysis where men as a class abuse their privileged position over women as a class. And occasional discussion of feminism and intersectional feminism.

Many of us regular FWR posters have lots of wonderful men in our lives - we are not all embittered lesbian spinsters with 27 cats

But as a WellErrrr and others have said, women can self-empower all they want, but it won't change the fact that men have a physical, social, financial and cultural advantage over women in almost every sphere of life where it matters. Can't self-empower ourselves out of that

Original poster
PirateQueenie · 01/05/2017 15:56

Olennas - "we are not all embittered lesbian spinsters with 27 cats" 😂😂 hehe that made me chuckle!

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LassWiTheDelicateAir · 01/05/2017 15:59

OP, I agree with you on the specific example you gave upthread (and said so at the time on that thread)

In the context of that particular thread and the activities of that particular men's group I don't think Cadno ridiculing them was inappropriate.

LassWiTheDelicateAir · 01/05/2017 16:01

To be clear however punters are scum. I don't care in the slightest if that is man bashing.

PoochSmooch · 01/05/2017 16:01

OP, you've used as your example of "feminist man bashing" a post by an man who has little time for feminists, being responded to by someone who isn't a feminist Grin So I don't think you're proving what you think you're proving...

I'm also white, and though I myself am not racist, I can be sure that I've got racial biases that I'm not even wholly aware of, and that as a white person, I benefit from a racist society that disempowers BAME people. Same goes for men - I have a number of lovely men in my life and I don't man bash, but equally I'm not going to hold back from analysing the ways in which they benefit from a sexist society because I might hurt their feelings by pointing it out.

LonnyVonnyWilsonFrickett · 01/05/2017 16:03

Feminism isn't about making men and women the same though. It's about liberating women (as a class) from oppression. That's not a happy-clappy kind of objective - it means removing privilege from the oppressing class, which in this case is men.

When 2 women a week (in the UK, mind, not in the world) are killed from domestic violence it's OK to get a bit ragey about men as a class.

YetAnotherSpartacus · 01/05/2017 16:05

No that there is anything wrong with being a lesbian spinster with 27 cats, except that you'd need a really big house and ton of hired help...

But the 'male poster' who you are defending OP hopefully does not have a 'male perspective' (as if there was such a unitary thing) because he is often, if not usually, deliberately goady and sexist and (in my view) deserves the criticism he gets because he is provocative.

picklemepopcorn · 01/05/2017 16:05

I'm not an embittered lesbian spinster either, but I'd like 27 cats! Unfortunately, DH is allergic. I blame the menz for stopping me indulging my cat collecting. Bash bash.

alonsypot · 01/05/2017 16:07

I have a lovely dh, a great brother, and male friends. But I still fervently believe in the need for feminism and that we're nowhere near "there" yet. I'd bet that's the experience of many posters here.

If you have to make it "about" men to feel like you can support it, you could argue that men would benefit strongly from a less misogynistic society.

Meanwhile I think it's a very simplistic take on feminism to see it here as mostly "men-bashing", and also that one obscure example isn't proof that it's rife on Mumsnet!

NameChanger22 · 01/05/2017 16:08

There's nothing wrong with a bit of man bashing. The nice men know it doesn't relate to them. The horrible men probably don't read Mumsnet that often, if they do, it might do them good to hear why they're not as great as they think they are.

YetAnotherSpartacus · 01/05/2017 16:08

I'd quite like to be a lesbian spinster, but I don't know if I could handle 27 cats. I mean, I'd need an awfully big bed and can you imagine the litter boxes?

Original poster
PirateQueenie · 01/05/2017 16:08

Ah ok, I'm new to MN (1 week) so wasn't aware when Lass quoted that it was someone who had caused provocation before.

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PoochSmooch · 01/05/2017 16:09

To be clear however punters are scum. I don't care in the slightest if that is man bashing.

Amen to that. Or maybe A-women Grin I couldn't give the tiniest little toss if people think I'm mean about men who buy sex. They could stop buying sex and I'll be a lot nicer about them, as I am about other decent men.

LonnyVonnyWilsonFrickett · 01/05/2017 16:11

Although tbf if you are fairly new to these boards, as I was once, it's OK to be a bit WTAF about the way posters respond to male posters.

It does take a few months of regular reading to understand just how many (male) goady fuckers post here, with the sole intention of starting a bun fight. Regular posters are not patient with these people - nor should they be - but if a 'shut down a goady fecker' thread was the first, second or even tenth thread you'd read here, you would wonder what the hell you'd wandered into.

LassWiTheDelicateAir · 01/05/2017 16:12

OP, you've used as your example of "feminist man bashing" a post by an man who has little time for feminists, being responded to by someone who isn't a feminist

I know. Couldn't have picked 2 worse examples.

Given that men's group managed to shut down a women's group Cadnowylt's "Billie no- mates" jibe would hit home more effectively and deservedly than anything a woman could say to them.

YetAnotherSpartacus · 01/05/2017 16:13

It does take a few months of regular reading to understand just how many (male) goady fuckers post here, with the sole intention of starting a bun fight

Actually we haven't had one of these for a while. I've almost forgotten what they taste like whn bbq'd! Grin

Original poster
PirateQueenie · 01/05/2017 16:13

No I don't feel like I have to make it "about men" to get on board at all. And I wasn't suggesting that the majority of posts were men bashing either, just that I'd made a few observations. As I say, maybe I'd identify more as egalitarian, although labels in themselves annoy and I'd just like to think I'm a fair, kind person in general. Thanks for your comments :) and I can understand why some people are angry at men as a whole, especially with the statistics about violence and abuse. I think just coming from a predominantly male family I find it hard to talk about men on the whole (when all the men I know are so lovely), but I do appreciate that this isn't always the case.

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