Using 'Mrs'

[Booboobedoo]

This is something I've been pondering for a while, and now I'm posting on here to garner opinion.

I'm sure I can't be the first to suggest this, but would it not be a logical step to start addressing women as 'Mrs' as soon as they are adults, in the same way that men become 'Mr'?

It would render 'Ms' unnecessary.

Ultimately I suppose I'd prefer all titles to be done away with altogether, but I'm not sure the world is ready 😁.

Any thoughts? Any obvious reason why not?

Anyone?

I use "Miss" because I was comfortable "owning" not being married before I was comfortable "owning" being feminist, and it stuck in my head. I don't really care whether other people call me "Miss" or "Ms", but I do correct them if they call me "Mrs". Quite sharply, usually, because if I'm not on first name terms with someone it's generally because they're being a twat so I'm being pissy with them. For that reason, I'd love to have a title- it'd be nice to be able to say "actually, it's Lady" to jumped up little oiks who need squashing.

I am a Ms here because I am asked in forms etc (not originally British, like Seneca, am also mystified by the importance attached to titles in this country).

Haven't had any problems with CRB checks, but my bank manager told me that I'd need to bring proof of divorce to change my title from Miss (which I accidentally chose when opening the account as I did not quite understand the question ) to Ms . He seemed pretty convinced! I just stared and said goodbye.

I live in German speaking place and am happy to be called Frau,so is my married neighbour and my unmarried neighbour. I hate the miss,ms,Mrs issue. My marital status is not something necessarily want to share. Ms just doesn't role offor the tongue well though does it. I vote for miss for all of us. ...

Latecomer to the chat and the thread ... I have an English-speaking background but live in Sweden, where we do not have titles (unless things like HRH or Professor and we still don't adress people by them, just use them as job titles really). I can recommend this system. ;) Go for it.

I tend to choose Ms when I have to choose anything (like when shopping online). Because principles. But I have to disagree with those who say it's not hard to pronounce. Mz is hard to say and I think people tend to want to insert an "invisible" letter i and make it Miz. (I idly started googling for phonetical explanations (you know, nasal sounds, fricatives, sibilants, that sort of thing) but I don't have time to study atm, sorry.) If the name after a z begins with a buzzy letter (like a d) it'll be easier to say, but if it's a non-buzzy letter, like a t, the English-speaking mouth will want to soften the z to an s instead. And then you get something very close to Miss.

Coincidentally, yesterday at work I saw a little book/pamphlet in our reception about phrases and expressions in English. I flipped through it and there was a little section on titles where they recommended Ms but specifically commented on the difficult pronunciation. Saying z is very difficult for a Swede, the sound doesn't exist in Swedish. And I can say z and say it with relish, but I still find Ms hard. It is an abbreviation that is not meant to be pronounced with just those letters but meant to be read as a longer word (we don't say mrs we say missus ;) ).

I was thinking about this yesterday that it is nice living in Germany where every adult woman is Frau X regardless of marital status.

I decided to keep Miss after I got married, Ms just seemed an unnecessary change. I wouldn't object to Mrs MaidenName, if that were the convention.

As it is most people assume I am not married, especially as wedding rings are worn on the right hand in Germany and I wear mineon the left, but that doesn't matter to me.

To be honest, I would prefer to cut to the chase and find a polite title that applied equally to men and women.

If it is irrelevant, when I am opening a bank account, whether or not I am married, surely what my genitalia look like is equally irrelevant?

(I know there is Mx, but do people really address each other as that in spoken language?)

Or banivani's idea could work - just drop titles altogether.

Mx - I mean, how are you supposed to say that? That's just letters.

Well, quite!

I do like it when German websites get translated into English - you get confronted with tickyboxes for Mr/Ms, then an extra drop-down to add any more titles you'd like (and end up as Ms Dr Not Citrus, though I'm tempted to pick a whole bunch of them!)

Given that honorifics don't actually correlate with politeness, I'd like to drop titles completely, but computers generally say no (eg the job site I just used this morning)

banivani but Mr, Mrs and Ms are just letters too. It's pronounced Mix btw.

I meant that Mr is an abbreviation of Mister and Mrs is an abbreviation of Mistress (which has been garbled into "missus/misses") so those words can be said, but if I read Mx I spontaneously, with my knowledge of the English language, can't say it. Unless I insert an I - which is my problem with Ms too. If I insert an I I'm not far off Miss, so then what's the point I feel.

No titles for the win!

I do like it when German websites get translated into English - you get confronted with tickyboxes for Mr/Ms

My experience of foreign websites (mainly Dutch ) is the option is Mr /Mrs not Mr/Ms.

I seem to have been Mevrouw or Mrv DelicateAir on many occasions.

Given that honorifics don't actually correlate with politeness

Not strictly true. I don't particularly want say the garage who did my MOT today calling me by my first name and calling me "first name and last name" sounds weird so Miss or Ms last name is appropriate.

I have said before that I like the Quaker forms. In formal settings, they either use both names without an honorific (agree it sounds odd to our ears) or Friend John, Friend Jane. I had a professor who was a Quaker and addressed us that way (Friend Jane). It's easy to get used to.

I think the Quaker philosophy goes back to the time before Mr and Mrs (and Miss) were used for everyone, where you genuinely were addressing a "Mistress" or a "Master", or claiming to be one. It set some people above others, which Quakers refuse to do, because we all equally contain "that of God".

I use ms and am married. Some places have changed me to Mrs without asking. I don't care enough to change it back. I'm still registered as miss at many places and haven't changed that either. I didn't change my name at all, which many people find odd. I refer to my husband, say his name, then say mine and they often ask again whether I'm married. It's a bit annoying. I'm hardly likely to have mixed up whether or not I'm married. It's the kind of thing you remember. Some women love that I haven't changed my name. It isn't something I think about and people reacting to it in any way is always a surprise to me.

But I do wear a wedding ring. I didn't even consider not doing that. That's probably a bit of a giveaway.

I'm the other way round - don't wear a wedding ring any more. It got a bit hard to take off (not sure why, my fingers dont look fat) and dug in when I was doing stuff like sailing so I just decided to leave it off. DH has never worn one - blokes in his family just didn't- so why should I if it was a nuisance. I'm not aware of anyone ever having noticed its absence.

I quite liked going from Miss to Mrs by marriage. It felt special to have something change to mark the commitment we made.

People should just use the title they want to use - I can't see many scenarios when it matters if an unmarried woman uses Mrs or what it matters whether anyone uses Miss, Ms or Mrs? I don't understand the grievance behind the issue. What you call yourself and why is no ones business but your own?

quite liked going from Miss to Mrs by marriage. It felt special to have something change to mark the commitment we made

What did your husband change to show the commitment he made? And to show that commitment to each and every person he met thereafter whether or not his marital status was of any concern or interest?

It matters because while it remains normal for women to change their name and title on marriage society expects us all to do it whether we want to or not. No such expectation exists for men, neither do they have to go through the "is that Miss or Mrs?" rigmarole every time they give their name.

neither do they have to go through the "is that Miss or Mrs?" rigmarole every time they give their name

Which is very irritating.

It's hardly a rigmoral to answer one question that's being asked to ascertain your preferred title - and if any judgement is purveyed on my response, then that's a problem for the other party, not me.

As long as no one is forcing me to use one title when I prefer another, I still do not really see why energy is being put into making an issue of it.

I changed to Mrs because I liked that it felt special to make the change on a personal level, I did however keep my own last name because I prefer to. if anyone had commented on this I wouldn't have felt like I needed to defend it, none of their business - it really doesn't affect my day to day life, and unlike many other issues where I am not directly affected by them but support them and think action and discussion are important, I do not believe using any given title will hold you back from anything. It's just a personal choice.

Why does my changing of my title to show the commitment I made need to be mirrored some way by my husband? I changed it for myself and my husband, not for anyone else. He signed the marriage certificate and said his vows the same as me, making the same commitment, we choose to show that commitment in indvidual ways. Some women may. It change anything and that's okay too, whatever is right for them.

Some unmarried may prefer Mrs to Miss or Ms and that's okay too.

Why does is matter if there are multiple titles for women - as long as they all remain available for everyone. It is JUST a personal preference.

One of the reasons that it's an issue is that people (and institutions) don't always respect the woman's preference, for whatever reason but none that I can see are good.

This is how it is done in French and German-you become Madame or Frau when you are an adult, not when you are married. I constantly get mis-translated as Mrs on documents. I like the use of Madame and Frau in this way, but still cringe when people call me Mrs...!
My son gets official post directed to Master badg3rson so I wouldn't necessarily agree with pp that it's obsolete.