Paris Lees article on toilets in Guardian today

[OlennasWimple]

Beware: reading this article may be bad for your blood pressure...

That blows my tiny mind.

But, I was also staggered when my friend told me that her lesbian book group told her she wasn't a real lesbian because she's had sex with a man. Lesbians who have never been penetrated by a penis are superior, apparently.

Suspect there are people in all walks of life who are desperate to put others into categories so they can feel superior.

But, I was also staggered when my friend told me that her lesbian book group told her she wasn't a real lesbian because she's had sex with a man. Lesbians who have never been penetrated by a penis are superior, apparently.

Gold star lesbian, I believe that is called. One who has never had sex with a man. I don't believe there is a similar putdown for gay men who have had sex with women prior to coming out.

These days lesbians are told they are bigots for NOT wanting to be penetrated by a penis. As a penis is not a penis on a transwoman...its a lady stick, or clitty, or something equally repulsive.

Its all a bit mental.

That was it, gold star lesbian.

I'd be happy with being a gold star human. I have some way to go on that, mainly on account of my inability to be kind to entitled idiots.

Tramswomen are speaking for trans and for women, yet women are not allowed to comment on trans (unless they parrot the transwomen) and we are increasingly not allowed to comment on women either (lest we offend transwomen)

Brilliantly put.

And I like the typo - do tramswomen self-identify as buses?

That's it exactly.

We're "all women together", until we're not.

So transwomen's fear of violence from men in bathrooms is legitimate, while women's fear is hysterical.

Biology isn't related to gender AT ALL, unless it's about some non-replicable neuro imaging study that totally shows the ladybrain.

Feminism must include transwomen, because we are all women, exactly the same, but we must not talk about issues like female genital mutilation, because that excludes transwomen.

A transwoman may comment on what it is like to be a woman, but a woman may not comment on what it is like to be a transwoman.

At least the comments aren't being deleted, a few months ago any comment that criticised this would have been deleted.

a few months ago any comment that criticised this would have been deleted

Though one reason for this might be that the militant TA agenda is now so mainstream that it doesn't need to fear challenge

You could be right shiny.

Most people have no idea though, not sure how the idea will float when people realise it will affect them and their daughters. I think the legislation will be in place by then though.

Take that all back, my comment has just been deleted :(

The gay equivalent to gold star lesbian is platinum gay. Double platinum gay is a man born by CS so he didn't even touch a vagina when he was born.

My comments are being premoderated because of my feminist views but I might try and post today.

My comments are being premoderated because of my feminist views

So what we have is the leading liberal UK paper censoring the views of a feminist for stating that people with a penis and XY chromosomes are not women.

Is that the clock striking thirteen?

My comments haven't been deleted, yay. Definitely improving, you can tell most of the btl commenters aren't impressed and someone posted a link to that awful piece Lees wrote about catcalling. It's good in a way that people are having their eyes opened.

Bit sick of all these regular MEN wandering in to the discussion though and saying they don't mind transwomen using the ladies. Well fuck off- it has nothing to do with you, and won't affect you in the slightest, why do you have to have an opinion?!

The gay equivalent to gold star lesbian is platinum gay. Double platinum gay is a man born by CS so he didn't even touch a vagina when he was born.

Ah I have heard this in passing before..thanks. WTF at the CS bit though

Caesarean section

Sorry- mis-read as WTF is CS

My comments stated that there are women all round the world who have to stay at home as they have no access to safe, sex based toilets and here we are giving away hard won female rights. I also said that we are moving towards self identification which will impact on women's rights as anyone who thinks they are a woman becomes a woman. Then I said that thousands of women are murdered across the globe each year, and that women have the right to sex segregated toilets. Deleted. Bastards

That's shocking Lumpy.

Doesn't shock me, Shins. I've had comments deleted for sentiments even milder than that. No dissention from the trans borg is permitted on the Guardian website.

I have been deleted before and complained, not that it got anywhere.

It makes me so angry as vile misogynist comments are allowed to stand but feminist comments are deleted. I shouldn't be shocked at how women and their opinions are belittled and ignored but it still smarts.

I do wonder how the religious communities will deal with this. I have a very religious colleague who won't be alone with a strange man, I wonder how she will feel about men being in women's toilets? I'm going to ask her on Monday.

twogoats I've often thought that the Muslim community getting up in arms about this may be our only hope.

Can you imagine leftie men tying themselves up in knots over that dilemma?

Oh, that would be something to witness, Hermione. I do hope that it happens and that I have a ringside seat.

I thought about that before, and came to the sad conclusion that it won't make a difference as its Muslim women who will be affected. All that will happen is they will be made to stay home more than ever before, as even a burkha or something won't be 'safe' in public as (and this may be only the person I know...maybe not widespread) ladies loos and such are where the women feel safe to take it off for a breather and readjust also.