Trans media watch are lobbying mnhq

[BeyondTheHarpy]

I know this has already been mentioned in the PL thread, but I thought it might be an idea to bring it to the attention of mners in a thread of its own.

After the PL debacle, there followed a thread in AIBU about toilet. On which this post appeared...
"I'm with you OP and I'm horrified by the transphobia on Mumsnet. I have done some work with Transmedia Watch who are trying to persuade MNHQ to treat transphobia as they would treat any other hate crime. I don't know what MNHQ have against the trans community or why they don't challenge the widespread belief that trans women are rapists in frocks who want to see fannies."

So, yeah, just letting you know that they are (allegedly) on the case with mnhq.

Is that muddying the waters?

Yup!

I can't disagree with not wanting him in my space but objections to trans can't be on an individual basis, unfortunately.

I can't disagree with not wanting him in my space but objections to trans can't be on an individual basis, unfortunately.

I think it has to be more nuanced than that. If I saw Buck in a toilet / changeroom I'd likely scream / run assuming they were male. And some transmen do present dangers to women (because they internalise misogyny or act it out in order to prove their masculinity).

Definitely. He looks like a thug. I'm talking at a legislative level.

It's hard enough, with everyone trying to redefine what it means to be a woman. There is no way you can go down the road of whether someone looks too masculine, or to feminine. It's too subjective. It's what gives the ideology grounds (however spurious) in the first place.

It's what gives the ideology grounds (however spurious) in the first place

Only if we are being defensive. And even then we'd have trouble explaining how we's 'know' that Buck was a woman if we met them in the toilets or in a bed next to us on a ward, etc. I'd not have picked it... And some transmen do harm women.

Maybe if we were to foreground women's safety we would approach the issue differently? I don't know how, but I am going to think about it. Sometimes narrowly legislative approaches can get us boxed in to places that we may not like.

Having said that, I bet Buck proudly uses the men's room so it is unlikely to be an issue.

You wouldn't know. But that's the point isn't it? You can't decide whether someone is a male predator, based on what they look like. It's about the biology and the fact that the 98% violent/sexual crime figure is committed by men. Not women who look butch.

Statistically, transmen on testosterone are actually slightly more violent than women. But nowhere near as much as transwomen and men (who are the same as each other).

"If I saw Buck in a toilet / changeroom I'd likely scream / run assuming they were male"

And if you saw Buck in a changing room you would scream & run even harder after seeing the huge PERVERT tattooed across his upper back.

I imagine people who pass for the opposite sex totally convincingly generally use facilities that match their presentation as it causes the least stir. There are far more FTTs who pass than MTTs though I've heard some people say they can spot transmen by their "hobbity" appearance: broad hips, narrow shoulders, beard and often very short for a man. Most transwomen don't even get close to passing, and for those who are AGP passing may not be important to them, particularly if humiliation is part of the scenario.

If I'd never found out about AGP, or read some of the nasty stuff on the net, I might be more open to the question of access if transwomen pass or have had surgery. But as surgery doesn't preclude AGP and passing is irrelevant, I'm not.

They wouldn't have to look or act in a predatory way either. Just standing there quietly washing their hands.

I honestly don't care if someone has a (harmless) fetish, knock yourself out. But I don't want to be an unwilling participant.

I am a trans widow & my children are now fatherless. This man emotionally abused me for years and disregarded our children's feelings in every way. I divorced him for 3 counts of adultery with other women and he recently "came out" as trans (with no prior warning or discussion with me) to our 7 year old daughter by taking her on a day out dressed as his idea of a woman (pantomime dame) with his new trans friends. She has refused to see him since. She and I are now told we are "transphobic which is a hate crime and will be reported."

I will support my children in their decision not to see their father because we are not obligated to associate with a narcissist or sociopath just because they belong to a protected class.