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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

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Original poster

How are we supposed to do ALL of this?

333 replies

cakestop2016 · 19/03/2016 19:54

Modern society is completely screwed up for modern women as far as I'm concerned. Why are we expected to go to work AND juggle all of the housework AND take care of the children's needs? Why haven't men caught up in assisting us? My DP is slowly learning that he needs to do more but why am I having to write him to-do lists, why can't he think for himself? Why does he fail to notice the greasy finger marks on the kitchen cupboards when he 'cleans' the kitchen?
why is it like this? Why does all the meal planning get left to me? I'm now seriously contemplating leaving DP and taking our DD with me because I can not live like this anymore.
what's the answer for modern women?

OP posts:
QueenLaBeefah · 19/03/2016 23:02

I really don't think DIY (although I am far, far better at it than DH) and housework are comparable.

Housework is completely and utterly relentless, never ending and thankless. Seriously, how often do the radiators need bled? Once a year tops and it takes half an hour. Most rooms only need decorating once every couple of years. It only takes an hour (not even that) to put an ikea book case together. And after decorating the living room or putting the bookcase together you get a big massive pat on the back. Cleaning the bathroom twice a week, 52 weeks a year until the day you die just doesn't illicit the same grateful response from the other adult in the house.

StrawberryQuik · 19/03/2016 23:04

Thinking about it more I think I am being a bit of a twit Grin...Some DIY I definitely think it is just easier/safer for the taller/stronger person to do it but then again some bits are really fiddly and easier for the smaller handed person in the relationship so I shouldn't generalise.

On the other hand...isn't it a thing in that some things are designed more for women (buggies are often a bit low for men) and others more for men (the only example I can think of is that bus shelter seats are designed for someone 6 foot tall) and so it sort of perpetuates these uneven things...like a particularly tall DP may well rarely push the pram because he finds it uncomfortable....sorry that was a terrible explanation it's my bed time.

Childrenofthestones · 19/03/2016 23:05

Sorry but I really think that you end up with the partner you deserve. If you let them take advantage of you, many people, even the ones that love you, will.
I work 48 hrs a week but as it includes shiftwork and me being either off or at home (due to nights) 5 days in a row, I do all the shopping cooking cleaning and the vast majority of childcare. I'm not a saint I'm just not a head worker taking advantage of others.
Ill tell you who was a head worker though, my wife. The girl I fell in love with grew up in a house where she wasn't expected to pull her weight, then went to Uni where was a typical spoiled student and took advantage of her housemates as they were soft enough to let her.
When we got together she had a bit of a shock when I introduced her to reality.
She now works full time (35hrs) which means she is at work 5 days a week so I don't mind doing nearly all the domestics but if I only worked days like her I would certainly be kicking her up the arse to do half the work.

RudeElf · 19/03/2016 23:09

What on earth do you think single people do? If i hung around waiting for a stronger/taller/bigger handed person to do things i would get nothing done. Yeah it might be easier if there was a spare bigger person floating around but you make do with what you have. It would also be useful to have a very small person to climb down the back of the sofa for change or a giant person to get tennis balls out of the guttering but you just cant get the staff these days Wink

EllaHen · 19/03/2016 23:11

My Dad is in his late 60's and has always been capable of housework, nae wifework.

My dh was brought up by a single mother and just as much brings up our kids and runs the house as I do.

I realise we don't live in a vacuum and socialisation is very real but for fuck's sake, anyone with a few brain cells can tell what's fair.

WhenSheWasBadSheWasHorrid · 19/03/2016 23:16

I realise we don't live in a vacuum and socialisation is very real but for fuck's sake, anyone with a few brain cells can tell what's fair

I do agree with you - but I'm pretty sure there have been surveys (recent ones) showing on average women do a lot more housework than men.
I agree it should be even but for a lot of women it isn't.

Theydontknowweknowtheyknow · 19/03/2016 23:19

"Sorry but I really think that you end up with the partner you deserve"

Way too harsh. You don't necessarily know you're going to marry a manchild till it's too late.

And it's not as easy as simply not letting someone take advantage of you. If you want to make the marriage work and one or more of you has been brought up with the idea that to do the wife needs to take on more housework then you're fighting a fair but of cultural baggage there.

DIY is much easier than the boring everyday monotony of housework. Putting up shelves is fun. Wiping loos isn't .

ILeaveTheRoomForTwoMinutes · 19/03/2016 23:21

You chose to marry a man who's a twat I'm afraid. I wouldn't have. Too many women seem to settle for this behaviour.

I live with dh for years before we had a baby. In that time we didn't even discuss who does what. It just got done by either him or me.

If it had needed discussing then it would have been along the lines of do it or fuck off.
Yes I've dumbed guys asap if they've come out with some random supposedly funny sexest shit or joke and they then didn't like the way I reacted to it.

DIY is a joint effort. there have been too many times were one has had to walk away and leave the other to it. I think we agree we much prefer being on our own for diy!Grin

LassWiTheDelicateAir · 20/03/2016 03:21

They appear to have chosen the same problem. They have choice in who they live with.

Yay to all RudeElf's posts.

LumpySpacedPrincess · 20/03/2016 08:01

Seriously, just don't put up with this shit. There is only one way to clean, you clean until the job is done. I am sick of hearing that women are controlling because they expect a man to finish a job.

Lurkedforever1 · 20/03/2016 08:34

I'm not suggesting diy is as time consuming or necessary as cleaning or childcare, therefore the mans share is covered. I'm saying it's the common attitude that diy is men's work that helps perpetuate the myth cleaning is woman's work. If we as a gender want to be taken seriously when we say housework isn't a gender specific role, we can't as a majority live by the myth our female physical/ mental qualities are inferior when it comes to historically male jobs.

Eg if you metaphorically say 'sod that, we're equal, why do my genitals mean I should do the vacuuming?' You can't then say 'but could you fix the vacuum first because my genitals mean changing a plug and simple mechanics is beyond me'. It hardly adds credibility.

QueenLaBeefah · 20/03/2016 08:50

Hmm. But some women are in the situation of working full time, doing all the housework etc and should also fix the Hoover. And by doing this is their partner supposed to have a lightbulb moment and think "gosh, maybe now my wife has fixed the Hoover I should stop working her into an early grave by expecting her to do everything and get off my fat arse and wash the dishes".

I might be wrong but you seem to be blaming women for this instead of lazy men.

DIY = 0.5 hrs a week
Housework = 20+hrs.

Men who aren't pulling their weight aren't stupid, they do see mess and they know it is hard work but they truly believe that their or is is a get out of jail free card.

Elendon · 20/03/2016 09:01

My exh was great, everyone said he knows where the towels are kept, aren't you lucky? Except he was also a serial shagger of other women. He saw doing the housework meant I would have extra time to give him sexual favours in return. Such a put off, but the women he sought out found his helping in the house a sexual turn on, he told me this.

PetShopGirl · 20/03/2016 09:11

Skimming through this, it feels like a wider issue re modern society is that for some reason women are still choosing men who don't pull their weight domestically.

Lurkedforever1 · 20/03/2016 09:17

queen I'm not blaming lazy men on women. I'm just saying that acting inferior about some roles is enabling. Just like it would be enabling lazy men if a woman genuinely believed housework is womens work. The difference is few women believe the latter, but far too many do believe, or at least act as though they believe the former is true.

QueenLaBeefah · 20/03/2016 09:17

TBF it is easy to turn a blind eye to a man's laziness when you get together. But the disparity (and down right unfairness of it all) really kicks in when children arrive. Housework suddenly turns into an industrial operation and being in sole charge of the children (whether looking after them or organising someone else to) turns into a huge chore. Coupled with women often being a SAHM,going PT or shoved into the "mummy track" a lot of women find it financially difficult to leave a lazy arse.

QueenLaBeefah · 20/03/2016 09:19

Anyone really interested in this should read Wifework (teenage girls should especially read this).

LassWiTheDelicateAir · 20/03/2016 09:48

If we as a gender want to be taken seriously when we say housework isn't a gender specific role, we can't as a majority live by the myth our female physical/ mental qualities are inferior when it comes to historically male jobs

Absolutely. I find these sort of threads absurd. I would go further - if women want to be taken seriously don't martyr yourselves by doing all of this and whinge about having to do it.

ILeaveTheRoomForTwoMinutes · 20/03/2016 09:49

But I don't understand why women turn a blind eye to it, in the beginning.

I find it easier to iron out the crease's right at the early stages, when I'm less emotionally invested. Sort your shit out of fuck off.

LassWiTheDelicateAir · 20/03/2016 09:50

Anyone really interested in this should read Wifework (teenage girls should especially read this)

Or alternatively they could actually just behave as a grown-up autonomous, thinking person.

QueenLaBeefah · 20/03/2016 09:52

Do autonomous, thinking people never read books in stuff they are interested in?Confused

LassWiTheDelicateAir · 20/03/2016 09:55

But I don't understand why women turn a blind eye to it, in the beginning

Exactly. This whole "wife-work is inevitable" argument really irritates me. It's a self-fulfilling prophecy about how hard it is to be a woman.

QueenLaBeefah · 20/03/2016 09:58

But I don't think wife work is inevitable. Women need to know their boundaries and be ready to dump someone right at the beginning of the relationship if he shows any signs of being a lazy arsehole. It is incredibly difficult to change 10yrs down the line with 3 kids and limited funds.

A lot of women find themselves in this position. It is not inevitable but it is incredibly common.

LassWiTheDelicateAir · 20/03/2016 09:59

Do autonomous, thinking people never read books in stuff they are interested in?

Does anyone really have to read a book about this? Let me guess what it's content is - does it start from the premises that it's really, really unfair women are expected to do more of the house work than men? But the nasty old patriarchy makes it so.

Why not actually just deal with the situation?

QueenLaBeefah · 20/03/2016 10:02

Have you read the book?