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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Feminism: chat

Original poster

These women have no idea what feminism is really about, do they?

273 replies

Cerseirys · 08/03/2016 10:27

I'm not sure why the Indy felt the need to go down this route for IWD. Some of these women sound like MRAs Angry

www.independent.co.uk/voices/international-women-s-day-2016-we-spoke-to-the-women-who-won-t-be-celebrating-a6917506.html

OP posts:
Helmetbymidnight · 08/03/2016 21:56

The one who annoyed me most was the woman who hates women who initiate divorce proceedings.

How very dare they!?

LilacSpunkMonkey · 08/03/2016 22:01

The one who annoyed me most was the woman who hates women who initiate divorce proceedings.

Yes. Surely women like that are the reason women who initiate divorce proceedings need feminists! Does she think women who've been abused, or cheated on or any number of other things, including, maybe, that they just don't want to be married anymore, shouldn't be allowed to initiate divorce?

quencher · 08/03/2016 22:21

I do think that international women's day is becoming a joke in the western world. However, I do think that in the third world and some countries around the world this day is needed more than ever. People seem to take freedom so lightly. I remember my grandmother celebrating women's day and mothers Union days and it meant so much to her.

One of the first women to teach me about feminism and the impotence of being independent as a woman was proud of international women's day. it gave her the chance to speak to young girls about how they can change their future by not relying on their husbands. Prioritising eduction as a means to getting out of poverty and setting a better life for their future family. She had activities round it and encouraged everyone to get involved. Talked about female issues that included rape, money, relationships and safe sex. It was never about being on the cover of Forbes magazine but everyday today life and how you change it for the better as a woman. Having confidence and being able to say no to being forced in arranged marriages and underage sex. Saying no to sugar daddies who were more than likely riddled with STIs preying on poor young girls.
My uk school didn't seem to care about the day or the importance of it or how they could have taken advantage by talking to young girls.

38GG · 09/03/2016 00:13

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DianaTrent · 09/03/2016 00:25

Seriously crap to run an article misrepresenting feminism on IWD. We have one who thinks feminism doesn't care about women in other countries, one who thinks it's about something other than equality, one who thinks it's wrong that women should be unable to leave unhappy relationships, one that doesn't understand the difference between the success of cases that actually get to court and how unlikely it is that your car will ever get near a court and one that not only doesn't know what feminism is but also doesn't know what humanism is. With the state of women's rights around the world these were the women's voices they thought were most important to feature on International Women's Day? Really?

DioneTheDiabolist · 09/03/2016 01:28

It's International Women's Day. Why shouldn't women who don't identify as feminists have their voices heard?Don't they count?

BertrandRussell · 09/03/2016 06:13

Is that the only section on IWD in the paper?

PalmerViolet · 09/03/2016 07:35

I suppose it depends Dione.

If it's part of a range of articles about different kinds of women then no, women attacking other women might be ok. If it's the only article about IWD, it just looks like the indy wanted to do a thing about why feminism is shit. Which is a bit shit of them.

RufusTheReindeer · 09/03/2016 08:23

If it was international feminism day then i would understand (i wouldnt...thats a lie) have "balance"

But its international womans day, that article was a way to have a pop again at an organisation which seeks to give women equal rights to men

DioneTheDiabolist · 09/03/2016 08:30

There are a fair few attacks on women on this thread. Feminism isn't an organisation, it's a political movement. Not being a feminist does not mean anti-woman.

BertrandRussell · 09/03/2016 08:35

"There are a fair few attacks on women on this thread" No there aren't.

Is the article quoted the only piece on IWD the Indy ran, or was it part of a wider section?

RufusTheReindeer · 09/03/2016 08:36

Who said it did?

Agree your point re political movement...i knew organisation was wrong, just couldnt figure out what the right one was so thank you for that...bet i forget it again

WomanWithAltitude · 09/03/2016 08:49

There were other articles. But they had slightly more merit and discussed women who had dome inspirational things etc.

Even so, I think getting some random women to talk about how they see no need for feminism on IWD doesn't add anything of value. At least one of those women was actively anti-woman imo.

itllallbefine · 09/03/2016 09:24

If it makes women realise that you don't need to identify with modern day feminism (whatever that means) in order to participate in IWD, then I would argue that is a good thing. The reaction here is evidence that many feminists regard an attack on their beliefs as an attack on women. Perhaps they thought it was useful to point out that IWD != International Feminism Day.

Original poster
Cerseirys · 09/03/2016 09:30

Quite frankly I think a few of the viewpoints in the article (the comments about rape statistics, the comments about women being responsible for divorce) were an attack on women.

My main beef with it was that they chose to run the article on IWD. I shudder to think what the Andy might produce for Black History Month. An op-ed piece by a member of the KKK?

OP posts:
itllallbefine · 09/03/2016 09:31

I think that comparing women who do not agree with feminism as equivalent to the KKK is ridiculous.

WomanWithAltitude · 09/03/2016 09:31

The comment about women initiating divorce and damaging their children was plain old fashioned misogyny imo.

WomanWithAltitude · 09/03/2016 09:33

What they were saying wasn't just "I'm pro woman but not a feminist". At least one of them made a comment that was misogynist. So the KKK comparison might be extreme, but it's not miles out. Maybe it's fairer to compare it to the Indy interviewing lots of people who start "I'm not a racist but..." for black history month?

Original poster
Cerseirys · 09/03/2016 09:33

I was being facetious with my comment on the KKK, but my point is that they would never run an article opposing Black History Month and asking why it's needed.

OP posts:
WomanWithAltitude · 09/03/2016 09:37

"Meet the black people who won't be celebrating black history month and who think civil rights has gone too far/isn't fair on white people"

Grin
WomanWithAltitude · 09/03/2016 09:39

Perhaps they thought it was useful to point out that IWD =/= International Feminism Day.

The premise of the article wasn't "these women aren't feminists, but they support IWD and here's why".

The premise of the article was "Meet the women who won't be celebrating IWD". It was anti IWD.

itllallbefine · 09/03/2016 09:44

The headline is "meet the women who wont be marching under the feminist banner this year" to me, this implies that although they may support IWD, they don't think you need to be a feminist to do so.

itllallbefine · 09/03/2016 10:08

The problem with the comparison to black people who think that civil rights have gone too far, is that there doesn't seem to be anyone who thinks this. On the other hand there appear to be plenty of women who think that feminism doesn't represent them. If it were the case that there were many black people who disagreed with the representations made on their behalf by the civil rights movement (or whatever you might think it's modern incarnation is), and who feel that a movement that they disagree with has co-opted their race, would it racist for them to say so ?

BertrandRussell · 09/03/2016 10:10

It should be clearly set out then so there is no need to infer. And I am surprised they couldn't find better examples of women who say they are not feminist but still support IWD. I would be quite cross at being represented by these three if I was a non feminist woman who still supported equality and women's rights......

WomanWithAltitude · 09/03/2016 11:14

Yes Bertrand. It makes non-feminists look quiet thick, if you base your opinion of them on that group.