General Trans thread part 2

[ChiefClerkDrumknott]

Following on from this one General Trans thread
Because I'm not Elsa and can't let it go

Even a quick read of this thread suggest there is a lot of anger. ..
Some examples...

You don't need examples. I told you that we are angry

This "debate" between radical feminism and the trans community is being seen by mainstream as a particularly nasty fight with some issues, risks and fears (on both sides) being deliberately exaggerated.

And who do you think started the fight? I think you'll find some rad fem fears stem from being threatened with death and rape when they bring up objections to some of these 'issues' you glibly dismiss. Do you not think that's an understandable reaction? By the way, have you popped over to Twitter or Tumblr yet to plead with 'TERF' killers to be less aggressive?

As mentioned earlier, I may be completely wrong. Perhaps the best solution is to get even angrier, even more offensive and aggressive...

You know what, as I said we are angry and we are 'aggressive', if you term defending women's rights vocally and loudly and consistently aggressive

Smith has become a representation for those who identify as a non-binary gender (one that is not exclusively male or female)

See, stop right there. THAT is where the confusion starts. I'm going to rewrite that sentence, without conflating sex and gender;

Smith has become a representation for those that identify as a non binary gender (one that is not exclusively masculine or feminine)

The clothes you wear have absolutely no bearing or whether you are male or female

Yep. That response still misses so many points.

Cote

Have you seen the pic in that shoot where CJ is posing getting into a sports car? A few weeks after killing that woman? That's some degree of narcissistic behaviour (who can kill someone in a car and then do that?) and I can't believe anyone thought it was a good idea.

I think they might actually be serious. Albeit a serious deluded twit.

Bloggers like the author don't generally have much of a sense of humour from the ones I've read, and nor do their target readership. Nor do they have any self awareness or sense of irony or the absurd. I suspect it's entirely genuine.

I get gender fluid. I would totally support and be gender-fluid, if I was in to twatty labels and didn't think 'gender' was a crock of shit

But, I think basically, we are on the same page as these gender-fluid kids. I just don't see how it relates to being Trans

Gender fluidity is great. As far as I can tell it's kids basically telling themselves, us and their peers not to define them. Good for them. The twatty labels are just the same as me rolling my eyes when someone called me a hippy when I was clearly a Goth. Squares.

Hopefully these kids will redefine gender, get rid of inequality and sort the whole mess out.

The trans agenda (rather than most trans people) wants me to stay in the box marked 'woman' but add a 'cis' and 'privilege' label to my box. For some reason they get a box marked 'woman' without those labels.

I don't have any problem with people being gender fluid although as a label you apply to yourself I think it's a bit special snowflakey attention seeking. As long as it doesn't mean they can access female sex segregated spaces any time they want to if they have a penis.

Venus has nailed it.

And now it's all over my social media. Nice echo chamber they have there.

MrsTerryPratchett wrote - "The trans agenda (rather than most trans people) wants me to stay in the box marked 'woman' but add a 'cis' and 'privilege' label to my box. For some reason they get a box marked 'woman' without those labels.The trans agenda (rather than most trans people)"

I think most trans people would distance themselves from some of the extreme claims and dogma of certain transactivists, but it would not surprise me to find that most, possibly all, transwomen want the label woman for themselves and also believe that "cis" women have "cis privilege".

to clarify my last point of my previous post:

I would not be surprised to find that most, possibly all, transwomen believe that "cis" women have "cis privilege".

Thanks for the kind words, slugseatlettuce. For the rest, it's interesting, not to say salutary, to be reminded how one person's clarification is another's obfuscation. 'Twas ever thus I suppose, and I'm glad to be reminded of it.

It does seem the whole contemporary trans thing relies on conceptual errors, some particularly glaring, some perhaps not so much; and, we have to suspect, some wilfully entered into. Is it important to get clear about what these errors are, and their roots? I think so.

The way 'gender' plays out in contemporary 'transgender activism' looks alarmingly like patriarchal revenge for feminist clear-thinking on the subject; of course it can't be consciously so -- there's no controlling consciousness there iyswim. I find it depressing as well as alarming, though, to tell truth.

But perhaps I should bow out and leave you to it, as a terfa (appellation gratefully accepted).

Why bow out? Your contributions are as welcome as anyone else's.

Shortcut: "I get gender fluid. I would totally support and be gender-fluid, if I was in to twatty labels and didn't think 'gender' was a crock of shit."

Yes. A hundred times yes.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-hampshire-35265124

Who will be petitioning for this transgender mtf rapist (no hormones or surgery) to serve their time in a womens prison, i wonder?

I don't think they will in this case, Bombadier. You can tell 'Davina' is biologically male from outer space. It's not quite the same as seeing those soft focus pics of Tara Hudson.
Having said that, the article mentions that Davina has learning difficulties so I expect special provision will need to be made for 'her'.

I'd be surprised at nothing any more

Ugh.
He has a conviction for child images too.
Man rapes child and STILL it is reported as 'she' and 'ms' because well, courtesy and all that. God forbid we should misgender a convicted paedophile rapist.

I want this case publicised to the heavens. I want the same people who protested the indignity of TaraSevenInchSurprise being incarcerated along with other men to take up the banner for this transwoman too. Let them petition for this man to be in a woman's prison. The abhorrence of the idea might cause a few more people to hot peak trans.

• hit peak trans

I'm just about to have a bit of supper but this case definitely deserves it's own thread in chat, so I think I'll start one when i get back unless someone beats me to it.

Yes,there is nothing more abhorrent than misgendering a paedophile rapist.

This will be peak trams for many people.

Bit harsh flora - trams provide a useful public service