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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

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Original poster

Length of school skirts

181 replies

KingTut · 03/06/2015 08:24

I and my teen daughters are new to feminism and I wondered if I could talk through something?

My daughter refuses to wear a skirt as she can't stand all the length monitoring by staff at school. Dd said she would rather sweat in trousers. Then dd made the interesting comment, it's like they are blaming the girls for the boys not being able to cope if a skirt is above a knee.

It then brought us to the attitude of the Duggar family. The school are not much different really. So why do parents, staff and students say nothing about this skirt length issue? Is there something we are missing?

OP posts:
Original poster
KingTut · 03/06/2015 19:09

What has leg spreading got to do with skirt length?

OP posts:
pieceofpurplesky · 03/06/2015 19:15

Girls tend to sit cross legged/ wide legged/ one leg tucked under and pull skirt down between legs. Longer skirt = less on display

BringBackCabinPressure · 03/06/2015 19:15

If it's a short skirt it will REALLY ride up when you spread your legs. I notice this especially when they are sat on lab stools in my lab. When I was a tool of the system of course Grin

cailindana · 03/06/2015 19:15

Why have a skirt as part of the uniform at all if it causes such problems?

WhirlpoolGalaxyM51 · 03/06/2015 19:15

If girls are coming to school with no knickers on or masturbating in class then personally I think that someone needs to be having a very careful talk with them. Concern about the shortness of their skirt would not be at the forefront of my mind.

And yes of course I am picking bits out because read as a whole the message I am getting here is utterly grotesque.

"It is inappropriate for young girls to wear too much make up - have you seen an 11 year old in full face with red lips, scouse brow, dressed in the shortest tightest skirt sat with legs akimbo under the desk with her knickers on display?"

She is 11 the way this describes this child is just awfully worded, I don't know if you know how it comes across. By all means talk to her about uniform policy being no makeup but the description there is not appropriate applied to a child FGS! Legs akimbo? WTF.

BringBackCabinPressure · 03/06/2015 19:16

I know, it's crazy.

BringBackCabinPressure · 03/06/2015 19:17

I've had boys masturbating in my lab. Very very difficult to deal with appropriately

Original poster
KingTut · 03/06/2015 19:24

Do you monitor trouser length of all boys in response to the mastrubating boys in your lab?

OP posts:
pieceofpurplesky · 03/06/2015 19:26

What's wrong with leg's akimbo? The word akimbo means spread widely. Personally I find akimbo more appropriate than saying a child spread her legs. And if you had read the thread rather than pick out bits to suit your outrage you would see that has already been brought up about speaking to a child and how as a female teacher it is easier than a male teacher having the same conversation. You may find this grotesque whirlpool but you are looking at it from completely the wrong angle. The thread was about length of skirts and many teachers have come in to say why they are uncomfortable about shorter length skirts, in response to parents (it's a forum FFS) they have also talked about boys pants on display and male masturbation in class. What you seem to be unable to grasp is that this happens.
Incidentally the two times in a long career where I have caught pupils masturbating (one male one female) were both reported. And sadly both were indications of much wider issues. I would imagine very teacher would report this as per their safeguarding training.

BringBackCabinPressure · 03/06/2015 19:27

No. They tend not to access their penis by putting a hand up the trouser leg.... Grin

I do however tell them to pull up trousers if flashing boxers. As I said up thread.
And tell girls to roll/pull down skirts if flashing knickers. What's wrong with that? Would prefer all wore trousers tbh

pieceofpurplesky · 03/06/2015 19:27

King see my comment above re masturbating boy

BringBackCabinPressure · 03/06/2015 19:29

And what Purple said about is being a safe guarding issue. Very difficult to deal with appropriately. As I've already saiid

almondcakes · 03/06/2015 19:34

I just think all of this is unrealistic.

I have never seen a school skirt that even reaches the knee. Where would you even buy one from?

BringBackCabinPressure · 03/06/2015 19:36

No idea but lots manage it so they must get them from somewhere?

pieceofpurplesky · 03/06/2015 19:36

Nobody is talking about below the knee - my school has the rule of no higher than 10cm above the knee. And yes there is a ruler!

WhirlpoolGalaxyM51 · 03/06/2015 19:44

pieceofpurple the children you talk about had stuff going on which meant they were behaving inappropriately at school. Yet you chose to use them as an example of why girls shouldn't wear short skirts. I didn't say it doesn't happen, I said I was amazed that your reaction was "wow that skirt is too short".

Given the other ways you have described female body parts on the thread though, I'm not that surprised. You word your posts in a way that makes me recoil.

WhirlpoolGalaxyM51 · 03/06/2015 19:46

"Personally I find akimbo more appropriate than saying a child spread her legs. "

You are talking about an eleven year old.

So what if she sits at her desk with her knees apart. Oh yes I forget you don't want to see her knickers, you don't want to see her "more intimate areas", if she wears shorts that is not good as well, and absolutely you don't want to see her "breasts flapping in the breeze". Oh yes and of course she is bringing sex into the school.

almondcakes · 03/06/2015 19:50

Well that's really creepy then.

Original poster
KingTut · 03/06/2015 19:52

I am sorry for using the term leg spreading. I was thinking of the term as used to describe people who take extra space on public transport. I am sorry for causing offence.

OP posts:
WhirlpoolGalaxyM51 · 03/06/2015 20:00

Even the language

Look that boy is sitting legs akimbo / with his legs spread = so what / maybe taking up space

Look that girl is sitting legs akimbo / with her legs spread = quite different reaction indeed.

Females are imbued with all this stuff to do with sex and sexuality from puberty aren't they, and policed accordingly. Like how most teenage girls are just dressing fashionably, trying to keep up with their peers, and a lot of observers will deem them to be "up for it" or "tarts" or whatever. All this nasty layering on of agency and intent onto children. Just does not happen with boys.

MoreBeta · 03/06/2015 20:03

I do wish mothers would explain the following to their daughters who wear short skirts at my childrens' school.

If you turn up to a job interview looking like you are on your way between night clubs the immediate reaction (i.e. within 5 seconds) of your interviewer will be that you are immature and not serious about the job.

They will not be looking at your lovely legs and if they are you definitely don't want a job there.

Orangeanddemons · 03/06/2015 20:10

I'm a secondary school teacher and a feminist. This is about appropriate wear for the environment you are in. I don't want to see too much female or male flesh on display when I'm teaching. I would be happy if they all wore skirts or trousers regardless of gender. But I don't want to see too much flesh/bumcracks or the rest of it. It isn't about gender it is about a dress code that makes everyone feel comfortable including adults and students of both genders

pieceofpurplesky · 03/06/2015 20:18

Whirlpool I give up as you are only seeing what you want to see and appear deliberately obtuse. I have no problem with a child sitting with her knees apart but that is not what I am talking about. I am talking about a child who sits with legs wide apart (akimbo is the correct term but obviously offends you). I am talking about the child whose skirt just lies below her posterior (as that may not offend you). You were
Actually the one that brought up the subject of masturbation meaning something more serious in the thread were you insinuated it was common place - I and other poster were answering you. In 16 years I have had two such instances. And as you accused in your faux amazement that you were surprised I wasn't more shocked so I replied that 'sadly' both instances has serious consequences.
In answer to you.
Almost daily I see the underwear of girls (not sure what is wrong with knickers). Only today I had the chat with a 13 year old girl about what could be seen. I suggested she wear shorts - not sure where you get the idea I said not to???? I also
Did not mention breasts or that a girl is bringing sex into the school.
So please don't accuse me things I have not said.
I have just said that skirts should be longer, uniforms adhered to and that way everyone is equal. Like many posters I think trousers should be worn. Stop
Making out I am inappropriate please whirlpool

Orangeanddemons · 03/06/2015 20:19

Also, clothing symbolises lots of different things. It is worn for protection, adornment, self expression or as a means of identifying. It can be worn for one or all of these reasons, but in a school it is worn for the purpose of identifying and not for self expression.

pieceofpurplesky · 03/06/2015 20:21

Don't say bumcracks orange you'll get told off!