What do men think feminists should be focusing their energies on?

[PetulaGordino]

It's pretty clear that there are many men with constructive criticism to offer feminists in terms of what feminist issues they should be focusing their energies, activism and outrage on.

This vital advice is at risk of being lost, spread as it is among myriad threads in this section. Perhaps it would be a good idea to collect it together into one thread, for ongoing reference when posters in this section consider their feminist activities and whether they are really focusing on the right issues.

Obviously it should be borne in mind that feminists are only able to focus strictly on one topic at a time in terms of activism and outrage, so don't overload us with too many issues at once!

Has any woman in the history of ever gone onto a male dominated forum to post about her BF being an honorary women? If so, what response did she get, I wonder?

I don't suppose it's worth explaining the concept of "appropriation" to Mephistopheles...

Basically it's the difference between a black rapper using the N-word and a white rapper using the N-word.

I can say "it's been my experience that some men regard me as an honorary man" - I am describing my experience. A man cannot say "you know, one of the things I love about you is that my mates treat you as an honorary man" without coming across as a bit of an arse.

I realise the thread has moved on somewhat, but I have something to say

A wok lid makes an ideal tin for a giant jaffa cake

isn't a Jaffa Cake actually a biscuit ?

let's not go there

I've been an honorary man! It's terribly exciting!

It goes thus:

"You know you're really great because you're just like a bloke you can drinks loads of pints and you're funny and stuff but then also, also you've got a really nice arse"

As per one of DH friends after a few snifters.

Also on the being a "cool girl" and man-pleasing.

The other way it goes it you look like you are the sort of person who is a cool girl and man-pleasing and then when you aren't - you don't react appropriately (by eg giggling at the right moment, or looking pleased when they eye you up a bit) the men get incredibly confused (and sometimes rather aggressive).

So that's fun.

Fucking gender roles.

sardine in which case you're 'uptight' or 'frigid'.

Should just point out that earlier in the thread I was referred to as a man by magnet who seems to have disappeared

I do not feel honoured

Never mind, love.

Did he call you pal rufus?

Are you quite flamboyant?

I pull the guys up in the office all the time when they use the term " like an old woman" to slate someone.

"Oi! That's sexist and offensive. WTC".

They are otherwise pretty rift on, but they are stillstuck on this. Which makes me think they don't really get IT at all. :(

Yes he did

And he called me Rudolph!!!!

I think there's a (probably wilful) perception that feminism needs to be all things to all women at all times in order to be legitimate and just doesn't suit every woman.

It doesn't suit the women who want to argue that stripping is feminist because they chose to do it regardless of the consequences for other women, for example. I'm perfectly comfortable with that. I often do things that I don't regard as particularly feminist and I don't expect them to be described as feminist because I choose them to some extent and am a feminist.

The problem with the cool girl things is, as has been exhaustively pointed out, not that some women don't like what the patriarchy tells us is girl stuff, but that their rejection of this girl stuff often comes with a rejection of women in general with a side order if contempt for women's company. Of course other women don't really respond to that - who would? And of course men do - why wouldn't they respond positively to a woman who endorses and backs up their scathing contempt for women?

Did anyone read glosswitch today, by the way? Another excellent article. I'll try to link.

glosswatch.com/2015/02/08/800-maternal-deaths-a-day-is-not-gender-neutral/

For anyone who wants to call us terfs, this is one example if why it doesn't work.

Great article, Apocalypse.

From jaffa-cakes.com:

"But critical to the controversial issue of Jaffa Cakes’ name, when a biscuit is covered in chocolate it becomes subject to the standard VAT rate of 17.5%"

"So what happened? Is a Jaffa Cake a cake?"

"... when biscuits go stale they go softer. But when cakes go stale they go harder. The test was done, and when Jaffa cakes are left exposed to the air they get harder. So Jaffa cakes are definitely cakes and not biscuits."

"During the court battle between Mcvities and Her Majesty’s Customs and Excise, Mcvities baked a giant Jaffa Cake to prove that Jaffa cakes were really cakes and not biscuits."

Interesting, no?

very

Couldn't give a fuck how Jaffa Cakes identify.

They just need to get themselves in my belly.

Hah puffin . You might not care, but it matters a great deal to Jaffa Cakes.

do they identify as male or female

too deep for ya ?

I think they identify as cakes, where they are clearly bloody biscuits.

And none of us come out of this thread well. I thought it was feminists who had no sense of humour?

In the confectionery world there are only cakes and biscuits. Jaffa Cakes have identified themselves as cakes. No fucking with that.

I demand to know where they stand on the trans-cake thing.

I thought somebody might say that. Look, I don't speak for Jaffa Cakes. I can only say that the Jaffa Cakes I know are all cakes, and they were are lovely.