Pornstar Sasha Grey reads to primary school children.

[weddy]

You just can't make this shit up!! I wonder how the school introduced her to the children. link: www.laweekly.com/informer/2011/11/11/sasha-grey-reads-to-compton-kids-failing-school-district-embarrasses-itself-again

The worlds gone mad - and porn is very much mainstream.

Or perhaps you would like the child entertainer who had a particular love for children.

Perhaps the footballer who was arrested for assault, robbery, and using a deadly weapon & possibly killed 2 people.

The Dr who killed his patients.

Or the musician that raped his fan's babies.

Or the Drs/politicians/judges who ran a ring of paedophilia and may still be at it.

The movie producer who drugged & raped a young teen

Ok, so she had sex. Lots of sex. Lots of hardcore sex. How do you know your kids teacher isn't into BDSM etc?

Is that REALLY the worst thing that someone can do?

Ew porn objectifies women. But I'm going to objectify a woman by deeming her useless and unable to function in society because of her past choices.

What about the footballer offering his date to his footballer friend, who then raped her?

How about the guy who filmed it?

Or the record producer who killed an actress?

Or the actor who killed his wife?

Why condemn her for a past job? How do you know their teacher never used to be an exotic dancer in university? I really dislike porn, however I do not see any reason why she should not be reading to children! They won't know she's an ex porn star!

The argument from people's private lives is fallacious. Because the problem with Sasha Grey's gangbangs is not that she had them but that they are, by her choice, hugely notorious, and they are violent and appalling, and not all nine year olds are supervised online (less likely in a deprived area like Compton) - and yes, beccajoh, it is utterly normal for 9 year olds to look up innocuous details of their day to day life online, they do it all the time.

The other arguments, from bad deeds, different, is totally confused - because YOU are now implicitly equating Sasha Grey's porn career with being a rapist, or a murderer. I'm not. I don't think what she did was immoral, and it wasn't criminal. I simply think it is massively inappropriate for pre pubescent children and I have no inclination to help them to confront it.

Anyway even taking the argument at face value:

What about the footballer offering his date to his footballer friend, who then raped her?

How about the guy who filmed it?

Or the record producer who killed an actress?

Or the actor who killed his wife?

No, I wouldn't want to explain any of that to a nine year old either.

The objection to Sasha Grey is not that she used to be a porn performer in a previous private life. She currently promotes herself as a former porn performer and talks positively about her "achievements" in porn. She has published a book of photographs of herself taken on porn shoots as well as an erotic novel. She talks about her extreme (and it is very extreme) porn in mainstream interviews such as Elle magazine. This is all easily accessible to children.

If a teacher stared giving interviews about how great and empowering her experience was as a stripper, I don't think that's compatible with being a teacher. Neither would it be for a teacher to become an outspoken proponent of BDSM or to bring this aspect of their lives into the classroom in any way.

It's easier just to wave away any feminist critique of who our kids' role models should be as pearl clutching though, isn't it?

Flora I'd tell them she was an actress. Is it really that complicated?

Your children would have to be monumentally uncurious not to want to know what films she has been in and whether they could watch something she had been in.

I guess it's not complicated if you're okay with filmed sexual violence against women being normalised in your kids' school.

Really? Do you know the backgrounds and criminal records of some of the people that children hold up as role models?? Actresses, actors, politicians, sports figures... LOTS of them have bad shit in their past... If we weeded out everyone that has done something illegal, stupid, or sexist... well, there'd be precious few left.

Look up some of the other celebrities that do work for charities or schools - I'll bet you can find dirt on them as well. Does that automatically exclude them? Or is your pearl clutching strictly reserved for women that have "fallen from grace".

There are lots of actors that are in films that I wouldn't let my kids watch, as they are 5 and 8. You've heard of film ratings, I presume. Loads of 12+ movies and such that they cannot watch. They wouldn't think it was a huge deal at all if I said "yes, she is an actress but she is in films for grown ups and you cannot watch them."

Do you know the backgrounds and criminal records of some of the people that children hold up as role models?? Actresses, actors, politicians, sports figures... LOTS of them have bad shit in their past... If we weeded out everyone that has done something illegal, stupid, or sexist... well, there'd be precious few left.

Look up some of the other celebrities that do work for charities or schools - I'll bet you can find dirt on them as well. Does that automatically exclude them? Or is your pearl clutching strictly reserved for women that have "fallen from grace".

sorry, bit of an overlap there as my screen gave me an error message, so I added an answer to the recent post and reposted my answer that I didn't think went through. Ah, the joys of the internet.

Moving on, I googled Sasha Grey and on her wikipedia page it says she was Penthouse's 'Pet of the Year'. I hadn't heard of that before and the concept makes me unhappy.

Women and Men get into porn and prostitution often for complex reasons OP. I don't think SG should be punished forever for once being involved in porn.

It's not like she's a convicted murderer or something. Maybe her motivation is atonement for a past she's ashamed of, I don't know. But even so, what she's doing here is clearly a good thing.

rootypig I am not equating her past to being a rapist at all. Someone suggested why can they not have a sports person or politician or someone that when they ask who this person is what do they do they have someone that may be aspirational

I was asking (while pointing out that the people she suggested have carried out far worse deeds in their past) who she would prefer to have reading to her children...

If you're going to bring Playboy into the Mix, then you'll pretty much have to not let your kids see ANYTHING... this is just a partial list of some stars that have posed for Playboy...

Shannen Doherty
Lindsay Lohen
Drew Barrymore
Farrah Fawcett
Madonna
Daryl Hannah
Charisma Carpenter
Barbara Carrera
Kelly Brook
Ursula Andress
Tia Carrere
Raquel Welch
Kim Basinger
Jayne Mansfield

Are you going to restrict them from seeing Charmed? ET? Bond films??

Alice It's almost like you're trying very hard not to get this in your desperation to be cool with this. I don't see how I could be clearer that it's not "dirt" or things she may have done in the past that is the problem. It is that she currently promotes herself as a former porn performer and talks positively in mainstream interviews of her experiences in violent extreme porn.

Elle magazine had an interview with her last year which included a quote from one of her films: "Rip my fucking holes open".

Her wikipedia page says "Grey quickly made a name for herself in the business after she asked Siffredi to punch her in the stomach; however, she later stated that she was improvising and it was taken out of context."

It also says that A. O. Scott of The New York Times described her pornographic career as "distinguished both by the extremity of what she is willing to do and an unusual degree of intellectual seriousness about doing it."

She also said the film "Crack Whore Confessions" was "hilarious".

I would not want Howard Marks to read in my kids' school nor a former gang member who is mainly known for talking positively about his experiences in the Hells' Angels.

Feminist critique of filmed prostitution / violence against women is often dismissed as pearl clutching. Nothing original there. I know a number of women previously in prostitution so your attempt at prude-shaming won't land.

desperation to be cool with this?

Seriously, what part are you not getting? I'm FINE with it. What I don't get is why you're so determined to mark her for life on this.

I know a number of women previously in prostitution so your attempt at prude-shaming won't land.

Gotta love it. The old "some of my best friends are... "

I'm determined to mark her for life? Yes, I'd better get back to editing her wiki page, her own website or her imdb bio. Maybe just after I've set up another interview with a women's magazine where she can talk about how empowering extreme porn is if women don't see themselves as victims. Then I can gather up a bunch of pictures of her on the set of violent porn and publish them in a book. After that I can make her play herself on a top rated TV show.

You asked if I reserve my pearl clutching for women who have "fallen from grace" - your words. I answered, no. And they're not "some of my best friends", they are friends but not my best friends, family members and activists I know. Easier just to fall back on lazy tropes to dismiss other viewpoints though, isn't it?

I wouldn't be happy with this (I probably am a bit pearl clutching, though ). And I think it's pretty disingenuous to pretend that she was reading as a member of the community. She was there because she was a celebrity. And she's a celebrity because of her involvement in porn.

I certainly refused to let my dd take a glittery pink book about horses out of the library, despite tolerating rainbow magic books, because it was ghost authored by Katie Price, and I didn't want my dd to see Katie Price as any kind of a role model.

Your children would have to be monumentally uncurious not to want to know what films she has been in and whether they could watch something she had been in.

Really? Maybe an 'actress' would excite curiosity from children in the middle of eg rural Suffolk but this is LA where every other person is in the entertainment industry.

I agree with everything Alice has said on this thread. I think it's appalling that other women would exclude women from participating in public service because of their past.

Would you have any qualms about your kids reading ex-go-go dancer & prostitute Maya Angelou or former porn mag centrefold Germaine Greer?

I think it's appalling that other women would exclude women from participating in public service because of their past.

Or their present, I wanted to add.

It was Compton, not Beverly Hills. Anyway I've lived in several celebrity infested neighbourhoods and my DCs and the kids in their schools are very curious about "famous" people they encounter.

Equating Maya Angelou to Sasha Grey is repulsive. If you've read her books you'll know how she talks of the circumstances that lead her into the sex industry (including poverty, racism, sexism and childhood abuse). Did she become the poster girl for how wonderful and empowering it all is so long as you don't see yourself as a victim?

Flora I do see where you're coming from, totally.

From my perspective if she was introduced as sacha who's come to read to you as she's a member of the community then that's fine.

I agree that introducing her as an actress is going to lead to googling and while it's probably nothing that children of, what, 9 or so haven't been exposed to before unfortunately, her presence in the schoolroom would clearly been seen as approving her choices.

I just think that there's an awful lot of people I wouldn't want in classrooms TBH - I wasn't joking earlier about Gove! So that's the perspective I'm coming from.

Also I don't know much about this woman, maybe my POV would change if I did.

Certainly when people are saying "oh well if you're going to exclude x y and z then there'll hardly be anyone left" then that's fine by me Children don't actually need famous people reading to them. They just need people reading to them and better Bob from the shop down the road than any number of slebs. Of course Bob from down the road might have made dubious chioces in his past and have all sorts of weird views BUT the children aren't going to find out about them via google the way they will with almost anyone famous.

Yes, I am comparing them in the sense of 'this woman has worked in the sex industry and so has this woman. If either of them came to my child's school and read an age appropriate book to them, while making no mention of the sex industry, then it would not bother me.' (though, were it possible, I would prefer Maya Angelou)

I am not comparing them in the sense that I think Sasha Grey is an iconic civils rights advocate, brilliant memoirist and slightly over-rated poet who should definitely attend the next presidential inauguration.

Sorry you said 'equating' them.

No clearly I'm not 'equating' them but I don't agree with respectability politics. Sasha Grey is just as much a victim of sexism and patriarchy and while we may strongly disagree with her - I also think putting a scarlet letter on her and excluding her from community participation is wrong.