Newnight report on brothels

[itshardthinkingofanickname]

Worth £16 billion in Germany. Legal to "make it safer".

Interview with 22 yr old Hannah. 6 men per night, earns 100 to 1000 euros per night,

Talking about should it be illegal in the UK and the fact that brothels are safer than the streets. They have super brothels in Germany.

What's the assumption, pepper?

The assumption that there may be a circumstance in which you were so desperate you would consider selling you orifices to others for money?

I think allowing us to work together is a start, legalising brothels and regulating the industry. And no I wouldn't be against the idea of cctv either, because when a prostitute says she's been raped or assaulted it's nigh on impossible to a) feel like you can report it and b) secure a conviction, I mean it's hard enough for 'normal' rape cases to go to court, let alone a punter/prostitute one.

In that case I change my opinion re cameras in brothel bedrooms.

This is where I have the problem, migsy. I want you, personally, to feel safe. But when it comes to legalisation, I have a problem, and that problem is the chain of events that leads from the legitimisation of a market where women can be bought and sold for sex.

It is known that trafficking of women increases in areas where prostitution is decriminalised/legalised. It is known that punters increase when their 'entitlement' for paid for sex is legitimised in law. This puts other women at risk.

I'd rather you were the nurse you always wanted to be, tbh

And with that, I'm off to bed. Night.

Yes, rather than making your conditions less vulnerable to assault and rape...getting you the fuck out of there and away from fucking creeps like pepper.

I think the whole "entitlement" argument is bollocks.

It is stigma (which criminalization causes) leads to increased risk.

Me too Sabrina

I'd love for you to be a nurse too migsy.

I will be a nurse one day, I don't know when that will be just yet though.

Do expand pepper. Are you saying that not lauding men for exploiting and using women makes them more likely to kick off?

Night!

Most prostitutes also want prostitution to be decriminalised.

btw punters and pimps don't kill. Murderers kill.

If a corner shop customer robbed and/or killed the owner of a corner shop would you blame all the customers of a corner shop for that? Or would the blame lie solely on the killer?

I wonder how many prostitutes are murdered/assaulted/robbed compared to the number of people killed in other jobs that involve services to the public including running a corner shop, taxi drivers, the police, bartenders etc

More than half of women in prostitution have been raped and or seriously assaulted and at least 75% have been physically assaulted at the hands of the pimps and punters. 74% of women in prostitution identify poverty, the need to pay household expenses and support their children, as primary motivators for being drawn into prostitution. [Home office (2004). Solutions and Strategies: Drug Problems and Street Sex Markets. London: UK Government]

A report in the British Medical Journal about client violence towards women in prostitution stated that of the 125 women in indoor prostitution contacted, 48% had experienced client violence. The types of violence experienced included: being slapped, punched, or kicked; robbery; attempted robbery; beaten; threatened with weapon; held against will; attempted rape; strangulation; kidnapped; attempted kidnap; forced to give client oral sex; vaginal rape and anal rape. [Church, S., Henderson, M., Barnard, M. and Hart, G. (2001). Violence by clients towards female prostitutes in different work settings: questionnaire survey. British Medical Journal, 322. 524-525.]

A report in the British Medical Journal about client violence towards women in prostitution stated that of the 125 women in indoor prostitution contacted, 48% had experienced client violence. The types of violence experienced included: being slapped, punched, or kicked; robbery; attempted robbery; beaten; threatened with weapon; held against will; attempted rape; strangulation; kidnapped; attempted kidnap; forced to give client oral sex; vaginal rape and anal rape. [Church, S., Henderson, M., Barnard, M. and Hart, G. (2001). Violence by clients towards female prostitutes in different work settings: questionnaire survey. British Medical Journal, 322. 524-525.]

Women in prostitution are 18 times more likely to be murdered than the general population. [New Philanthropy Capital (2007). Hard Knock Life. London: New Philanthropy Capital.]

Women in street prostitution are 12 times more likely to be murdered than the rate for all women in same age group in the UK [Salfati, C. G. (2009). Prostitute Homicide: An Overview of the Literature and Comparison to Sexual and Non-Sexual Female Victim Homicide, pp. 51-68. In D. Canter, M. Ioannou, & D. Youngs (Eds.) Safer Sex in the City: The Experience and Management of Street Prostitution. The Psychology, Crime and Law Series. Aldershot: Ashgate.]

These summaries are from:

www.avaproject.org.uk/our-resources/statistics/prostitution.aspx

www.avaproject.org.uk/our-resources/statistics/prostitution.aspx

The opinions and questions of an individual with zero empathy or sympathy. Or indeed an factual or statistical knowledge.

A true deluded entitled individual who just wants to justify using and abusing women for the sake of a fucking orgasm (and remaining the all powerful consumer).

In the words of Ygritte...'you know nothing'...

I wonder how many prostitutes are murdered/assaulted/robbed compared to the number of people killed in other jobs that involve services to the public including running a corner shop, taxi drivers, the police, bartenders etc

I agree with you on some of those points but when you start thinking about rape as just a hazard of the job, you know it's a bit more dangerous than most other public service jobs. I've lost count of the amount of times stuff has happened which I've said no to. I'm a lot smaller than the majority of the punters I see and don't fancy starting a physical fight with them.

I also can't think of a more vulnerable position than being in bed, naked with a strange man in a flat where there is no one else around. None of those jobs involve that.

My above post was obv to peps not Garth.

Garth, you're a star

Instead of wondering, why don't you find out?

I'm still interested in how the questions about peppercornn being a punter are loaded? If he had never been a punter they would not be loaded. They would only be loaded if the answer was associated with a negative associations that the punter would not accept. If the punter thinks he is a good punter who is only helping women pay their debts and he uses his magic power to determine that she is of age, not coerced, trafficked or vulnerable, he would not want to be associated with the truth of being named a punter and would consider it a loaded question. I can't think of any other way it's a loaded question.

@Flora
"A loaded question or complex question fallacy is a question which contains a controversial or unjustified assumption"

Any why do you refer to prostitutes as "pimp lobby"? Is migsy part of this "pimp lobby" you speak of?

And the fact I am not a punter (the unjustified assumption) is precisely what makes the Q loaded.

@migsy anything else you think would enable prostitutes to be safer or which might help prostitutes get convictions if they are assaulted/raped? Any other law changes you would like to see?

Do you think groups made up of prostitutes (eg Scot-Pep, IUSW, NSWP) should be given government funding to help advocate the rights of prostitutes (at the moment they receive zero funding from the government).

It's not complex so what are the assumptions in the following question:

Have you ever paid for sex, an escort, intimate massage, sexual services or for a woman's time where you had sex with the woman?

It's not difficult.

That one isn't loaded but all the other ones were.

To answer it, no.