To all those people who have an issue with trans people - please read this

[enimmead]

This is from a transwoman who has been jailed for 41 months. A black transwoman in the USA. I don't know if she is guilty or not. She was at a bar when a bunch of thugs started harassing her. The fact that they had Neo Nazi links was inadmissable in court. A glass got broken and a fight broke out. Ce Ce has been found guilty of stabbing someone and killing him - 41 months in jail (don't worry, it's a male jail).

This is from her blog:

supportcece.wordpress.com/2011/11/20/as-long-as-we-live-in-fear-we-live-in-ignorance/

To the many of us who have struggled, being of the GLBTQ community, this is for you. To those who have triumphed over the idea of conforming to this fascist, hateful society, this is for you. But most importantly, this is for all of our loved ones who have become victims of hate crimes and domestic violence being of the GLBTQ community, specifically Trans men and women, who are singled out and have the highest percentage of victims of hate crimes and domestic violence. My love and prayers go out to the families and loved ones of those who have lost a friend, a brother or sister, a mother or father, an auntie, uncle or cousin, or a partner or spouse to this epidemic. To all those unfortunate cases, this is for you.

In the memories of those who we have lost, it is our duty to put an effort to make a change. We should not have to sit back in the fear of our own lives and well being, or the lives and well being of those we love and care for due to the hate that exist and threatens our safety. We should not have to mourn for the lives of the people we love and have lost due to hate and careless acts. We have to stand up against those who put us down and try to oppress us. We have to enlighten the neophobics of this world and to help them realize the vast and diverse world we live in. because as long as [we] live in fear, [we] live in ignorance.

I thank the lord everyday for keeping me here and giving me such a profound mouth and mind to share my experiences and the trials and tribulations I?ve overcame, because honestly, I never thought I would make it past my 16th birthday. To grow up and have that thought at a young age is unsettling. The thought or feeling of knowing or expecting that today could be my last day on earth, only because someone hates me for being the person I felt would make my life happiest, or for being in an abusive and controlling relationship with someone who has no regards or remorse as to how they treat their partner is an unsettling thought. But it?s more unsettling to know that this is our reality, and that these are the issues we have to face on a day-to-day basis. And even with all that we choose to live our lives, and to continue living them proudly with gumption, bravery, and love in our minds and hearts. I know I still have faith in people, and am willing to make a change if they are willing as well.

We all grow up in different communities, with different social categorizations, but when it comes to being GLBTQ, sometimes we?re excluded and put into a category of it?s own, that is demeaning and belittling, and that no matter where you are we are singled out. I grew up in a community that was predominately African-American people. And with the fact of me just being a minority in this society was bad, being African American and trans is an ultimate challenge. I can remember having loaded guns being put to my head and being beat until bloody. Or walking downs the street and being yelled ? a faggot?. I thought because of their ignorance I decided to change my surroundings. So I moved to a suburban community, which were predominately white people. Then, I remember people grabbing their purses and children, like I was a thief and was going to steal their money and kids, and to still be yelled ?queer? or ?faggot?, which made me feel upset and that my efforts of leaving one community to another, went without victory. Also being a victim of domestic violence was also an issue that I had to deal with in my early teenage years. And fortunately I got out of that situation.

The point I was trying to make was that no matter where you go, or community you live in, people will continue to discriminate. And as long as we do not stand up for our equality, we allow them to have the upper hand against us. We allow for them to feel that?s its okay to verbally and physically attack us. And I feel that it is our duty to give these people the awareness and education about whom we truly are, and not whom they assume we are. We have to make sure that we won?t lose any more of our loved ones due to hate crimes and domestic violence. These problems are often over-looked when it comes to GLBTQ people because people feel that it isn?t as important if it happened to a straight person. Which is ironic because these problems affect us disproportionately. I feel that it is our duty to change the minds of those neophobics, because as long as [we] live in fear, [we] live in ignorance.

We have to be the matriarchs of this society. To start teaching our younger generations about hate, and why it?s so important not to hate. We have to end the bullying and harassment in our school systems. To organize more community actions and awareness about hate crimes and how to stop them from happening. We need to be leaders and role models for all to learn from. And from that we would be able to help and comfort someone who is unsure about his or her own sexual identity and preference. We will be able to eliminate people?s fears of being victims of hate crimes and domestic violence. To help someone to accept and be comfortable as whomever they choose to be, with no judgments or stereotypic labels attached.

And to all my brothers and sisters of the GLBTQ community, this is for us all. This is for those who are still here, and for those who have passed. With love and determination we can be the leaders. We can make a change. Because, see, what people fail to realize is that, even through their hate, bigotry, conforming, and biased views and actions that are enforced upon us,? love is inevitable and overcomes any and all things. And as long as love is in our mind and hearts, it can show us, even in fear, how to be leaders and role models, to be the leaders to show how to overcome the hate and oppression. Love is powerful enough to change the hearts of the neophobics in this world. Because as long as [we] live in fear, [we] live in ignorance."

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There has been so much hatred and ignorance spouted on this forum and i think some people forget trans people are people who deserve our humanity and support, not our ill informed bile and bigotry. I have been shocked at the level of anger on this thread. I have friends who are trans and they just want to exist and be accepted as people. There are a minority of activists who affect what everyone else does.

You may not accept what they believe. You may not accept the terminology. But accept they are people who are just trying to survive in a very difficult world.

I take it the self hatred is what causes the high numbers of suicidal depression and substance abuse in trans people ?

It's actually really sad , and heartbreaking on that issue alone.

Got it in one, droves.

But that does not excuse your husband's behaviour one bit.

Dittany , it didn't even register at the time ... Sort of very very delayed reaction to that , suppose it was the pregnancy that did it.

Hell broke loose 2 weeks later after my son was born.

Yeah , but was it because he was just an arsehole ?

It's disingenuous to suggest that complete gender reassignment surgery is what all trans people want.

It's also a very good point that EatsBrains raises.

'I have read stuff about young butch dykes saying they haved been pressured to think about whether they are really Trans and pushed to think of transitioning'

To me that seems to be about wanting people to conform to gender stereotypes - to fit people into boxes marked man or woman, defining them by whether they identify as masculine or feminine. That is as far from feminism as you can get.

And you'll find the idea of hormones for kids has a wide range of views within the trans community as well.

Fundamentalists - I wish that could have been me. They need it. They will pass perfectly and have the life I never had. They definitely know.

Others - how do they know? Shouldn't we wait? It could be a phase.

droves - You know it is very very common who have been in abusive relationships to feel sorry for their husbands/partners as they have had a hard life, a poor start in life, etc. Its actually part of the wearing down of women that happens in abusive relationships so that you end up feeling sorry for them.

And I think you have had it worse than your partner.

enim - I know there are a wide range of views about hormones for kids within the Trans community. But sadly kids are starting to get given hormones and I do fear this will become more common. Parents rightly just want to do what is right for their kids and because of the stereotypical presentation of a trans person such as the documentaries you talked about, I can see why some parents think this is the best for their kids.

Very scary

Eats , I understand what your saying but I really don't . I only had 10 years of it to deal with ...I didn't find out about the trans stuff until the last 3 years . ( ok that was difficult) . But he had a lifetime of being abused by his own family ...I never understood why his brother was so full of hatred toward him , why his mother was the same , until Adele appeared . Then the jigsaw fell into place.

I think I was married by him to proove his " normality" . He still lives in that hell , I don't . He does have it worse.

The dv was all he had ever known , I think so it didn't register as wrong to him.
I hate what he did , but I sort of understand why .

droves,

I think you might ask questions. The trouble is, i fear you might never get the opportunity to do so to the person you need the answers from.

I think its a subject that sadly, you can never find the answers you need most.

Fair point droves, you know the reality better than any of us obviously do. Just don't let your sympathy for him stop you keeping yourself and your kids safe. You have a right to a good life

My children need to be reassured about their other parent . It's a disgrace that there is not services to provide support for the families of trans people .
And whilst I have sympathy and would hope that everyone has the peace of mind of being comfortable in their own skin , I think that whilst the gender realignments and laws are changing ,no one thinks about the families of these people .

Do you realise that whilst a person who is transgender gets abuse for their choice of life , that their family is also abused ? Where is the support and help for them ?

What's to stop transgendered pushing their loved ones away by whatever means to stop this ? .

Alcoholics and drug addict families can access help but there's no trans family help that I've ever seen that's suitable for little children or teens ?

It's a valid point that hasn't been raised . WHY ?

And I've killed the thread .

I agree there is a real lack of help. I know this doesn't help you at the moment, but every other service to support families such as those for families of alcoholics and drug addicts, has been hard fought for by those families. It is rare for people to just get given services. Usually groups of those people have to fight for them. Not fair I know.

And I agree that laws have been changed without thinking through the implications for loads of people including families

Don't take the thread killing personally. I hope you and your children are getting yourself sorted.

Trans threads seem like London buses. None for ages and then 3 turn up :)

Take care

XX

And I would totally agree about groups for families of trans people. AFAIK, any website seems to be very biaised towards the trans person and does not take into account families who are struggling to cope.

Doves - I know someone else in a similar position to you. They just came out like that in the middle of their child's exams. Just changed name on Facebook, started to wear a dress. Her son could not cope.

Selfish is a word I would use to describe that. I am sure people can think of more suitable adjectives.

droves - I think others have left to get on with real life, not that you have killed the thread. I am only still here because I am ill so not doing the stuff I had planned to do.

Hope your situation works out okay in the end for all of you. It doesn't sound easy for any of you.
xxx

Droves, you didn't kill the thread :)

Selfish doesn't cover it.

In middle of the exams . Poor kid .

I think the laws need tweaking a bit to include protection of children .

I've got to laugh at how bad the CSa is , can you imagine what a mess it would get in if they started calling some parents by a differnt name due to sex changes?

Still would like to know if a sex-changed father would legally be considered a 2nd mother or still a father ? . Would you get female fathers ( and male mothers ) ?
What's the laws on that one . Or has no one considered that there may be children involved ?.

I think many MTFs and FTMs struggle with that. I think that the children are (in many cases) are at the front of their thoughts.

The law has no say.

Sadly, many children lose contact with their parent (often due to the reaction of the OH) and never have a chance to decide what to call them.

But still trans people go through the process despite all this.

I just asked oldest dd ( nearly 17 ,knows about her dad ) what she would call him if he changed .

She quite sensibly laughed and told me not to be stupid she would still call her dad dad , mainly because calling him by his other name ,just feels stupid .

I asked her if she thought it would make him another mum..again she's laughing and says don't be stupid he's on my birth certificate as my father so he's not getting off the hook , even if he does wear a dress to tescos !

EatsBrainsAndLeaves Tue 05-Jun-12 14:04:54
droves - I think others have left to get on with real life

Yep. Just went to do a couple of things. You didn't kill thread. You raised some very important points. Thank you.

I think the children losing contact with parents issue is an interesting one, obviously not confined to the situation of a trans parent, nor always the responsibility of the other parent. Older children in particular can be very unforgiving if they think they have been lied to or deceived in some way, so lose trust in the person they perceive to have deceived them. I think the younger children are when their 'normality' is radically changed then the easier it is to adapt (so long as the adults around them allow them to adapt of course).

As in the other trans thread(s) I have learned a huge amount in this one, particular thanks to those who refused to be goaded and carried on stating their understanding clearly and coherently. I am still not a radfem but feel I have a much better understanding now of what the issues are - even if I don't, yet, feel I personally have come to a conclusion about the rights and wrongs of all this.

No idea what the law is, but I know several people whose mtf biological father is now their second mother (still in the relationship and living in the household). The Beaumont society is a good place and has a family support forum. They would know the legal side and be able to advise.