I will stop being a feminist when ...

[garlicnutcracker]

Thread prompted by one in AIBU ...

? Women's performance is always evaluated separately from their appearance.
? Women are proportionally represented at all levels in government.
? Half of all CEOs are women, matched equally with men by corporate worth and reward packages.
? Women are proportionally represented at all levels in the judiciary.
? Women carry equal weight in the military and law-enforcement services.
? Half of all wealth is owned by women.
? Women's fertility is not given as an excuse for their disenfrachisement.
? No woman is blamed for her own rape.
? Mainstream pornography does not promote violence against women.
? Mainstream media do not promote the sexualisation of women.
? No woman is expected to tolerate violence against her person.

That'll do for starters.

As a free extra: I will accept that men's rights movements have equal validity when ...

? All of the above.
? Men accept full responsibility, of all kinds, for all of their children, as automatically as women do.

misled*

you have given a fundamental part of parenthood over to another person...more fool you..

some brilliant sockies turning up now

this thread could make it to classics

Useful post, Boffyflow, thanks.

The reason half of all wealth is not owned by women is sexism. Women have no problem to accumulate and manage wealth; there are plenty of very rich women to prove it. I didn't mean women should be given half the wealth, if that's what you thought. The fact that half the wealth is no longer owned by women is an indication of women's disadvantaged opportunities.

You may hope the job goes to the most suitably qualified and able person but, more often than not, it goes to the most suitable man. There's plenty of evidence for that. As a feminist, I want to see your hope become reality.

I'm 56. Clearly age has little to do with feminist awareness.

I sort of agree with your sentiments about standing up for oneself, though the issues are more complex that you've admitted just now. I have short patience with whining passengers who won't learn to drive (metaphorically).

Men are NOT 'wired' to rape. I imagine your father, brother, partner, son, etc are not rapists. That proves men aren't driven by any uncontrollable urge to force sex on unwilling partners. Some men are driven by a strong urge to violently overpower women. This urge is a psychological and social problem. It is not, in any respect, caused by their victims.

Rape happens to women who are completely covered in burkha and never go out unattended. To me, that's conclusive proof of the above.

To answer your question - between 3% and 15% of rape allegations are false. That includes the ones the police themselves admit they decided to "treat as false" due to lack of time/evidence/resources. I have this from impeccable sources, researched for other threads.

I don't mind being catcalled because I call back. (Not that it happens much these days, but I did!) It's rude and patronising, however. You don't see many blokes telling each other to smile, show us yer legs, and the rest of it. In fact, you don't see many men yelling anything personal to strange men, do you?

"I don't agree with your points about rape. Again, it is about taking personal responsibility. Without going into too much analysis, men ARE 'wired up' differently - do you not understand that?
It also works both ways - how many women these days make false allegations of rape as a manipulation/revenge"

I hope you've never been raped and never are, but your comments are so deeply offensive to the utter extreme

How dare you ever apologise for a rapist because of the utter bullsh1t excuse he's wired differently

I suggest you start a new thread with your absurd assertions so as to not further fail this thread and maybe you might learn a thing or two.

The answer to rape is for men to stop raping. Simple. Then a woman can't 'cry rape'

I cannot believe in this day and age with the amount of education there is now available that anyone would ever come up with this cockamamie crap.

Maybe seeing you know how to access the Internet you could entertain yourself for the rest of the afternoon expanding your knowledge or simply go back to lurking

MJ - to your post at 00:46:

In an equal world where responsibilities, opportunities and rewards were equal, the work/home dilemma would be much less of a dilemma. You would both enjoy shared & equal opportunities to balance your money-earning activities with your family-based ones. All through my working life, I assumed that the advent of remote networking would make this an easy and natural development for families.

I am stupefied it hasn't happened.

'Rape happens to women who are completely covered in burkha and never go out unattended. To me, that's conclusive proof of the above.'

Sorry but WTF???...rape happens because of sick men who want 'power' over women and boys and other men if they get the chance...rape is never about what you wear...but about the power and control the perpetrator feels

AF - it does us good, from time to time, imo

but I feel I am wasting my breath.....

I'm not understanding your outrage at my remark, Mumcentre?

like talking to a turd...

WilsonFrickett
We have to take responsibility for our own safety. In an ideal world I would be able to walk skimpily dressed down one of the roughest areas in any city at whatever hour of day and night I choose, draped in expensive jewellery - but we all know that if I were to do this, I am highly likely to be robbed or attacked so, I wouldn't do it. I assess the risks. Similarly, if I were to go out half naked to a club, flirt outrageously with every man I see, get blind drunk, perhaps ask some men to buy me drinks all night, go back to a stranger's house - I am putting myself in an awful lot of danger. It's not a risk I would ever have taken. In short, don't make yourself a sitting target.

Having said that, I'm not denying that some women ARE raped without putting themselves in a risky situation - possibly randomly attacked whilst in a 'safe' area. Sorry, but I have no idea of the breakdown of figures for these cases.

read what I said...

boffy, you do know in the "breakdown" that most rapes against women are perpetrated by men that they know, or are already in some form of relationship with, yes ?

Add message | Report | Message poster Boffyflow Tue 27-Dec-11 01:09:48
WilsonFrickett
We have to take responsibility for our own safety.

Having said that, I'm not denying that some women ARE raped without putting themselves in a risky situation - possibly randomly attacked whilst in a 'safe' area. Sorry, but I have no idea of the breakdown of figures for these cases."

As you admit you have no idea of figures for these cases, how's about you go and get educated????

Rape has NOTHING to do with sex, sex is part of the abusive tool/weapon to have power over another person

So it doesn't matter if a woman is drunk, simply dressed or is a 95yo virgin in her own bed - its not about the sex. Please try to undstanding THAT.

if it was about sex, then women in burquas, nuns, grandmothers, drunk women and women with disabilities, to but name a little of the female demographic, wouldn't get raped

Rape is not contrary to poplar belief about what a person wears...what they say...how they act...its the fucked up and damaged behavior of a person...a person who wants to control and hurt another person...and mostly it's a person they know ...

Yes, it's something like 80%. I've been raped and sexually assaulted. The attacks were by people I had every reason to trust, in 'safe' situations. When it happens, you're very clearly aware it's not "personal". Unfortunately, the effects of the crime are personal and take quite some getting over.

"rape happens because of sick men..."

And the female rapists?

sock puppets are just such poor quality these days...

they used to be a better-educated class of woolly intruder

If I am your "turd", Mumcentreplus, you'll see that I made the burkha remark as further evidence to my previous paragraph, which was an argument that men aren't 'wired' to rape.

while I agree with you that no-one asks to be raped, this "if it was about sex, then women in burquas, nuns, grandmothers, drunk women and women with disabilities, to but name a little of the female demographic, wouldn't get raped" is offensive, is it a list of people who are considered not to be sexual??

AnyFucker

Yes, of course I know that. That is my point - women who have gone out to have a good time, got steaming drunk and flirted with someone they vaguely know.

The same applies to rape within a relationship, it is about assessing the risk. How often are women in a solid and happy relationship raped? Assess the risk - if your relationship is on dodgy ground it's time to boot the bastard out or remove yourself.

Sorry garlic..

Yeah, we started off quite well, AF, but it's all getting a bit same-old.

what about the female rapists looks promising, though. Which female rapists are you thinking of, Lackree?

GN going back to work/life, I think remote working is an excellent idea in principle, DH could in theory work from home a lot of the time, but then working from home with 2 under 4, without additional childcare is still almost impossible.

We try the best we can, if I have the opportunity to work additional hours, then DH is able to take some time in lieu rather than put in an overtime claim, but his job doesnt lend itself to family friendly hours or regular days off (not even weekends)