Was Bristol Palin raped?

[darleneoconnor]

according to this bristol palin was so drunk when she conceived her son that she doesn't remember having sex.

Sounds like rape to me.

Then she was basically 'forced' to marry her rapist? WTF! Sometimes America sounds more like the middle east!

Quite a few forums are discussing this, with some

disgusting rape myths on this forum

What Hully said.

excellent post floyjoy what I was trying to say but not as articulate.

I agree with Floyjoy that it might have been better to have a more general discussion of how the awful 'abstinence' culture contributes to both rape and the dismissal of rape victims' complaints. (This does not mean that boys and men rape because women refuse sex, it means that the abstinence culture is so misogynistic that it encourages rape by peddling the myth that women are either pure or fuckable no matter what they say or what they actually want).

Whether she was raped or not I don't think her experience is unusual, sadly.

Agree with Dittany that it might be more constructive to discuss Levi rather than Bristol.

Yes, let's talk about Levi, a teenage boy brought up in a fucked up culture that suggests that sex is something women trade and that a Man's job is to get the 'best deal' which is to fuck a woman without marrying her, whereas a woman's job is not to allow fucking until marriage. It certainly sounds as though he behaved stupidly, selfishly and insensitivley towards Bristol but in the case of a teenager rather than a sexually experienced adult, being brought up in a woman-hating culture that pushed such a twisted and disgusting view of sexual behaviour on him, there is some explanation for his behaviour.

Why is it ok to make derogatory statements about Levi based on guesswork around what little we know, but not ok to do so for Bristol?

Three guesses.

no, one.

Women sometimes do go on to have relationships with guys who have raped them during dates etc, because of denial, of shock, wanting to turn it round in their minds, not wanting to believe this guy they like would really do that, wanting to minimise it and because of rape myths that always bring it back to being the woman's fault somehow. We're immersed in this culture. It doesn't mean they weren't raped. That Bristol went on with her relationship with Levi doesn't mean all the sex they ever had was consensual.

If she enters this debate in the book (was I raped?) it would be an interesting read. Hopefully someone in the media will ask her this question, so we can hear her thoughts on the matter.

I imagine the rest of book is crap. And was in all likelihood ghost written by one of her mother's 'people'.

One of the big, big problems with the abstinence cult is their obsession with PIV and 'virginity'. The more prevalent the abstinence cult, the more young people engage in anal intercourse, in some cases against their will, because it 'doesn't count'. And the abstinence cult sets up women and girls to fail and be harmed and to have difficulty articulating what happened to them. Whatever happened to Bristol Palin, she was brought up in an environment that would have made it horribly difficult for her to discuss how she really felt about sexual behaviour - whether she at the time wanted to find out what PIV was like, whether she was passed out drunk and unconsenting, whether she was raped but felt she had to put up with it because He Was Her Fiance... we don't know. She hasn't said she was raped. It's not helpful to insist on labelling another woman's experience with a different label to the one she chooses to give it.

So what we have so far is:

Bristol Palin is probably lying because of her upbringing

And men cannot be held responsible if they don't know whether a drunk woman has consented or not.

Men should be taught not to have sex i.e rape women who are too drunk to consent.

Hi sakura - how's things in Japan?

I'm slightly gobsmacked that people are talking in such terms about a girl.

Yes, a girl, a child.

Who found herself in a position that no child should have to face, pregnant by an arse, in the full glare of the worlds spotlight, with condemnation, judgements etc raining down on her.

Regardless of what I think of her mother, or the wisdom of conducting a slanging match with the father of your child in public, I feel that Bristol has generally behaved with more dignity and maturity than I think I would have done at her age.

All part of the message: don't drink kids, because "good girls" don't have sex and if you're drunk you might have sex and get pregnant.

I imagine Sarah Palin is going to launch an anti-teen-drinking campaign pretty soon.

We are questioning how much Bristol might have fudged the facts (or even altered her own memory) for the same reason we should look critically at everything that is said in the media. Because people don't always tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth, especially when they are teenagers in highly pressurised situations.

Oh god yes - when Palin and Clinton were in the Presidential race, the misogyny was vile and so open. And I found the stuff against Palin particularly disturbing as it came from the left, the side I'd naturally lean to. Argh.

When I was about 15, I got very drunk one night and a friend of mine took me outside to get some air and help sober me up. While we were outside, he sexually assaulted me. I lied and told everyone that I didn't remember what had happened, when actually I did, and I remember clearly asking him to stop.

So yes, teenage girls lie, but often to protect their rapists rather than because they said "yes" and then changed their minds.