How can we stop women being killed like this (very upsetting)?

[BitOfFun]

Henan Ahkter was only fourteen years old

What the fuck is going on that the world can stand by and allow this kind of thing to carry on?

lol i have noticed, but im not onna send off my whole laptop for a indeterminable period of time jst to fix the !!! :p

"the very shaky trust we have spent years building within these communities."

You mean the very shaky trust of half the communities - the male half.

It is horrific that the other half of the population do not have access to the protection of the law in the name of cultural relativism and community relations.

Whenever we talk about communities, we mean men in those communities don't we? Whatever community we're talking about.

but it wasnt just men who were involved in this atrocity? it was the wife of the rapist who initiated it all wasnt it? or did i misunderstand somethin?

Yes she's a handmaiden of the patriarchy naila.

The people who control everything, are men.

This woman couldn't have operated without their permission and instigation.

There we go. It didn't take long for someone to do exactly what sakura and I said.

HerBeX, I agree, it the trust of the men, not the women that is being courted. The women would not be available to work with if it weren't for the men allowing a little bit of access. Fuck em. And it is said that women are gatekeepers?

If a white English woman is being beaten daily there is nothing anyone can do about it unless she herself asks for help.

In the incidences where we have helped women leave abusive situations it is for physical abuse. it has taken us months to work with her enough to reach the point where she feels able to leave.

In most cases where i say we would be advising an English woman to leave imean emotional abuse, controlling behaviour and horrible living situations.
Unfortunatly in mosyt of these cases the women themselves do not recognise it as abuse. It is "just their way"

We slowly work with them and help them access education, we encourage links with the rest of the community. We try and give them the insight to know that how they are treated is not right and that they do not need to put up with it.

Yes you are right, that by building trust with the communities i do indeed mean the males of that community. Most of these minority groups are very patriachal.
We must tread very carefully around their ego's and be respectful of their culture, however my own opinions may disagree with it, in order to gain access to the women and help them.

It is a slow but steady process. Rome wasn't built in a day

I hate it and it is something that sticks in my throat but it took us months of meetings with the "elders" to be allowed to speak with the first few families we worked with.
Obviously those elders were all male.

We had to be very carefull of how we dressed, how we spoke, the things we said and the ways in which we suggested working with the families.
We had to make certain promises about what we would talk about and what we woudl advise upon. We had to agree to uphold certain cultural expectations.

But it is worth it to be able to walk into the homes of the families i work with knowing that the men no longer need to sit with the women whilst we visit. We are actually trusted now to enter these homes without elder supervision.

quite frankly SAF i don't care whether you buy it or not. I do this job day in and day out.
I work with these people and DO help these women rather than ponitificate about what should be done.

I cannot force an entire culture to change thousands of years of tradition and way of life by demanding that "our way is right"

If a law is broken we can act upon it. There is no law against being misogynist

you're a social worker aren't you Mamazon?

I believe there is pandering but I don't believe it's coming from social workers.... I am assuming that if Mamazon isn't allowed in by the men, she hasn't got the powers to make them. She would need a huge amount of back-up that she probably hasn't got, to be in a position to be hard-line about it.

Because without the permission of the "elders" the husbands would refuse access to the home. We wouldn't be allowed through the door without said permission.

It is not pandering, it is doing what is neccessary to be able to work with those most in need.

I do not work for social services no but yes i am a social worker.

Anyone can refuse access to their home, even to a statutory agency unless a court order is produced. to do so would require proof that the child is in danger.

Social services find it very difficult to engage positivly within these communities because they are not trusted. people do not inform on each other because everything is dealt with "in house"

It is very naive to think you can just turn up at someones door and demand they change generations worth of thinking. It takes time and a much softer approach.

I am sure you see my work as rather futile but i just need to think back to all those women that are now free from that life to know that i have indeed made a difference and that the tide is changing. maybe not this generation or the next, but slowly and surely.

"so if you thought i was at risk but my dad didn't approve of me coming and my husband who you suspected was abusing me wouldn't let you in the house that would be it? you'd say the men don't want us to see her so we can't?"

if you were an adult without any medical or psychological issues rendering you "vulnerable" then yes, that would be an end to it.

If we thought you were in immediate physical harm police could be called but other than that, nope, nothing to be done.

We cannot force abused women to leave. spend half an hour on the relationships board to work that out.

We can offer help and point them to the appropriate services but we cannot make someone leave.

And an adult has the opportunity to leave or seek help if they choose.

What would you like to see us do instead SAF?

Should we demand access to every home in Britain so that we can ensure that all women are treated well? Because it isn't only the minority families that are misogynisitc.

Mamazon, I don't think your work is futile. I do get enraged that it is so difficult, even more so than without these communities. But that's not anger at you

How much success do you have getting the women in the communities to take a lead in outreach-type work?

This story is appalling. I don't know what to do. I don't think there is anything to do expect get upset and angry.

I also didn't know that if people were suspected of abusing people in the home the authorities have nothing they can do about it.

It's what happened with Khyra (sp) - the girl who starved to death. The parents/s said SW couldn't see the girl and so they went away and that was that.