Why are you not taking WLI?

[Pronkey]

First of all I do not look down on WLI. In fact I possibly regret not going on them as my weight loss has been very very slow (50 pounds in 18 months). With plenty of step backs after holidays, Christmas etc. I must have lost the same 7 pounds at least three times.

But I chose not to go on them as I have had horrific gallstones ever since my last pregnancy and just could not risk it after they finally went away.

My cravings have definitely reduced since I have made diet and lifestyle changes. Was living off and craving pasta before my weight loss journey. And now I can definitely take it or leave it.

Just curious to hear why you didn’t go down the WLI route?

I had an eating disorder and am now taking WLIs. I was honest about it. I have face to face contact with my doctor though and it was all discussed. I don't know if that made the difference.

Interesting! I was told by my GP absolutely not, on the grounds that reducing my food intake quickly and extremely would almost certainly trigger my previous bulimic bingeing when I stopped (if I couldn’t afford to taken them forever). Why did your GP think it would be okay?

I say good luck to anyone who has chosen WLI!

But for anyone who is currently about to start their health journey without them. I just want to let you know it is actually possible to have your body adjust to “normal” ways of eating.

I gained 4 stone over Covid. I became absolutely addicted to food. Honestly I would eat when not even hungry. Just wanted stimulation and something to do. I would wake up thinking what I should get off Deliveroo for my lunch break (wfh)!

I genuinely thought I would need psychological intervention to help with my food issues.

But it’s remarkable how the body does change! After a few months of controlled eating you REALLY do stop craving all that rubbish! I would have laughed at you if you told me one day you will crave roasted veg and tzatziki! It’s not easy getting through those first few weeks but genuinely there is hope at the other side. I’m not advocating for or against injections but as someone who formally had incredible food noise you can resolve it sans WLI. Obviously it takes time. But I was surprised how quickly my body adjusted.

And that’s coming from a former food addict. But good luck to all.

I was on them for a few months but they gave me quite bad side effects including eye sight being affected. I think the main worry for me is that people end up completely dependent on them and it's hard to stop them without piling the weight back on.

Ok so that’s don’t correct it then? It’s just a thread for jealous people who can’t afford them to post made up nonsense? If it was genuine then people would want misinformation corrected. I would.

being fat, knowing there is a medication that can help you. Obesity is the biggest killer in society, number one cause of cancer. Not taking it due to some made up shite you read on line, is something I’d want accurate info on.

but your message is clear, don’t correct it. Let us post made up shite, we are just jeakous and skint.

Eldest brother was put on the injection to help his diabetes long before they were recommended for loosing weight.
He didn't need to loose any weight but lost 3 stone and that caused other issues.
He was on the NHS trial and was monitored every week then every month.
Problems he developed were his eyesight and gallbladder which turned into cancer.

I have a lot more weight to loose but I'm scared to go on the injection.

We get it. You think they are great.

Newsflash: not everyone agrees with you and isn’t interested in what you have to say.

And it isn’t all made up shite as you so eloquently put it: the risks to eyesight, developing pancreatitis and other gastric issues and triggering eating disorders are very real.

Same.
Surely it’s good to consider different viewpoints then make your own decision.
Oh and try not to judge others 💛

I can’t have them due to contraindications.

I saw what they did to my sister. Plus whilst a little heavy (BMI 26.6 after xmas) I don't think I'd qualify.

But when sceptics dare to comment on threads on the WLI boards they get shot down. Why is it only a one-way street when it comes to sharing different viewpoints?

So now, as well as being irrational, indiscriminate users of social media, those of us who have no intention of taking them are also jealous because apparently we can’t afford them.

OK 😃

I would have far more time for those in favour of taking WLIs if they could assert their arguments without disparaging others.

The fact that they are resorting to this makes me even less convinced frankly.

Also, no one has given me any serious arguments responding to the articles posted below about not just weight regain but regain that is four times faster on average than that caused by other weight loss drugs. Especially given that weight cycling has very detrimental effects on the body, particularly the heart, especially I believe in women.

You see this is why some of the replies are completely illogical. Obesity is life threatening. No ifs or buts about it. No ‘unknown’ side effects. At BMI 30-34.9 the average 40 year old will have a life expectancy 4.8years shorter than their healthy BMI equivalent. At BMI 35 that rises to 5.9 years.
So whilst I totally get that if you have a problem pancreas or thyroid cancer in your family why would you put yourself in the pathway of a known risk ? But if you are ALREADY in a substantial known risk to life by being obese , why would you deny yourself the chance to reduce that because of a hypothetical risk despite many millions of people using these drugs for over 4 years for weight loss and many years before in clinical trials. It makes no sense.
In an extreme comparison, think about cancer. Not all cancers are immediately life threatening. However they will shorten your life over time. When diagnosed and offered the miracle drugs of chemotherapy, with their horrendous side effects, would you refuse ?

@Densehedgerow76

"weight regain that is four times faster on average than that caused by other weight loss drugs." - yes, this is obviously very worrying for those of use who are taking GLP1 medication and anyone who might be thinking of starting. No one wants anyone to regain the weight, I hope, after a big loss however that is achieved. Weight regain is a significant risk for all weight loss methods. If this is a big worry for anyone then clearly no one will make you take WLI and you don't have to risk the chance of significant regain. Perhaps if you are only slightly into the obese range then that might be a deciding factor, especially if you have not been obese for long and have managed to diet and maintain a significant weight loss in the past. However, for many people they have been obese or morbidly obese for a long time and never been very successful with weight loss. I would not want anyone to think that it isn't worth trying to use a tool that will produce weight loss for fear of not managing to maintain, if you decide or have to stop taking it. Of course, you can continue to take the medication if you want to, long term, which is a valid option and worth thinking about before starting. Similarly, I would like to see further research into different methods of maintaining - so does it make a difference if you reduce your dose slowly before stopping? In the clinical trials that were included in the meta-analysis, people either stopped immediately at the end of the trial, or were swapped unknowingly to a placebo. And of course, whether it makes a difference if you plan for maintaining and include plenty of lifestyle changes (diet, exercise, activity) alongside coming off the medication.

Especially given that weight cycling has very detrimental effects on the body, particularly the heart, especially I believe in women. - yes, of course. So people need to be aware of this and consider how to manage the entire process including when entering into the maintenance period. That might mean staying on medication for a period of time to stabilise, or restarting medication before weight gain becomes too high, or other behavioural approaches eg lifestyle changes etc etc.

If you are obese, especially if morbidly obese, you will still be reducing your overall set of health risks by losing weight with GLP1s compared to remaining obese. Of course if you are able to lose weight without using medication then that's great, it involves no risk of side effects and doesn't cost you the private prescription charges. But, the key point is that a tiny percentage of obese or morbidly obese people ever manage to lose significant weight via non-medicated routes. That's the reality, hence the increase in overweight and obese people over time.

I can't be bothered to read all that. Why can't users like you just accept that some people are not convinced by them?

Exactly. Any dissension is met with insults - "you must be jealous because you're too poor to afford them" being the current popular one.

I find it frustrating that users just cannot accept that some people don't want to use them or can't. They go nuts when anyone dares to state that on a pro-thread – why can't they just leave us alone to debate on this one?!

You see I agree with you.. the regain is real and I get quite pissed off with the evangelical nonsense about retraining yourself into healthy eating habits and all will be well.. that is complete bollocks ! MJ is not some magical drug .. that changes peoples habits . They need to look at the research and understand what it does ! It controls blood sugar. So if you are insulin resistant as most obese people are from years of yoyo dieting , the moment you stop you will regain. It’s an excellent drug but you need to be on it for life .. which I am happy to do as being 8st 11 at 5’5” is worth the cost rather than all the health detriment of being 19st ..

But the question was "Why don't you take WLIs" not "Do you think other people should take WLIs?". All drugs do have potential side effects and the risk v benefit profile is different for every individual.
Taking your statin analogy, I have a friend who has familial hypercholesterolaemia. He was one of the first people in the UK to start taking a statin in the 1980s - if I recall rightly he was part of a clinical trial in fact. He's also the first male in his family known to have lived beyond the age of 40. Of course he is going to take a statin for the rest of his life. The side effects are inconsequential as far as he is concerned. Compare with my relative who was found to have raised lipids in his mid 50s. He was advised to make dietary changes first and if that failed to start medication. A decade on, he's kept his lipid profile normal without drugs. He does have to be very careful what he eats but he sticks to the diet rigidly as he prefers to avoid taking life long medication. My relative has a choice about whether he takes statins, my friend doesn't.
I think it is much the same with WLIs. I would have qualified (privately) before I started dieting as my BMI was just over 30, Yes, I would probably have lost weight more quickly and I could afford it easily so I did seriously consider it. But I know why I've gained weight, I don't have an unmanageable amount to lose, I don't have any obesity related medical conditions and I am confident that I can lose what I need without medication. So for me the potential risks outweigh the benefits. If I had any condition which actually required me to take life long medication then I wouldn't hesitate to do so. But I don't believe I need WLIs and I don't want to take any type of medication, especially not for the rest of my life, if there is an effective drug free alternative. The risk of adverse effects may not be huge but it's not non existent and some people do have serious problems. I believe that the risk of adverse effects is higher than the risk of it taking me a few months longer to get to my target weight. Others have different needs or just make different choices - that's their business and it doesn't bother me what other people do. But right now, in my circumstances WLIs are not for me.

I’m a healthy weight but have been overweight in the past. 4.5 stone lost during lockdown by calorie counting and exercise. WLI weren’t widely available then or at least if they were, I didn’t know about them. I’m sure if they had been I would have considered them. I managed to do it without which I’m glad about and have maintained ever since.

I appreciate the serious replies from SilenceInside and Fishingboatbobbingnight

I do see the case for WLIs for morbidly obese people to either give them a jump start or to help them change their eating patterns. Perhaps those whose mobility is compromised too, Or when rapid weight loss is necessary to prepare for a life saving operation.

And I do take your points about the dangerous side effects of obesity, with heart disease now being the number one killer of women in the uk above breast cancer. That is a really worrying statistic. Women’s heart health is way down in the list of health priorities imho.

Also, many people suffer with serious eye issues from living with diabetes.

Obesity is also seriously implicated in certain cancers.

So I understand it is a balance of risks and if the stats say that an obese person’s health outcomes are improved on average overall by taking WLIs then I am certainly not going to argue with that.

(Of course if you are an individual who happens to be impacted by serious side effects than the overall benefits to the population of taking WLIs frankly becomes a secondary consideration.)

However with the regain of weight being so rapid, and the effects of the WLIs only lasting for as long as you take them, then all of the above benefits can best be described as temporary?

Also, patients may have caused serious damage to their natural metabolism and muscles in the mean time.

If the only solution to rapid weight regain atm amounts to staying on the injections or re-starting them, which is really the same thing, then I would be interested in the results of medical research twenty or thirty years from now when enough people have taken them over a long period of time to specifically treat obesity. I find the prospect of taking a drug that slows down the passage of food through the stomach and gut and erodes muscle for twenty or thirty years or more, rather worrying.

Especially now when we are beginning to understand the importance of muscle mass and the role (ironically) it plays in weight loss and longevity, and the dangers of weight cycling on the heart.

My second objection is that I am somewhat despairing of the alacrity with which doctors and patients alike have fallen upon these drugs; with much more enthusiasm say than the counselling model that the GP in Newcastle has used to reverse diabetes in his group clinics. A treatment like that of course takes more time and public engagement but he has a model ready to roll out to every go surgery in the UK. Why isn’t this being done? And yet we are more than willing to take on the cost of prescribing these expensive drugs when their effects are largely temporary?

The Newcastle GPs reversing diabetes group model and other public health measures, such as a tax on Highly Processed Foods, more favourable operating conditions for UK farmers, more regulation relating to supermarkets and fast food outlets would make much more sense to me than WLIs when their positive effects , in most cases. only last long as you take them.

@Densehedgerow76 I can’t afford for the sake of my health to wait for some kind of counselling model that proves effective to be implemented by the NHS. And currently no such model exists. I’ve lost 11st and am the healthiest I’ve been in decades. I don’t believe that I have lost significant muscle mass, perhaps I’m terribly mistaken about that and it will come back to harm me later. I certainly don’t feel or look like I have.

I don’t blame any obese or morbidly obese person that decides to give WLI a try given what we know about them and the relative risks compared to staying obese. I’d rather a chance of losing the weight and keeping it off than continuing to gain weight via the usual cycle of a little weight loss followed by significant regain that has been the hallmark of my entire life.

Sorry, I should also have said that I am not interested in persuading anyone who doesn’t want to take WLI to do so or even to consider them.

I totally respect your viewpoints SilenceInside

Genuinely pleased that they have worked for you and that these drugs are allowing you to enjoy a new lease of life! Everyone deserves that!

I am sure they do work very well for some people, in particular those who manage to keep the weight off after they stop the injections.

I think it was because my weight is so high (130 kg) and my body is falling apart. Last year he wanted me to work with the dietician but then breast cancer reared its ugly head and everything went to shit. Now the medical priority is getting my weight down. So the benefits outweigh the risks.