Jewellery-British Royal Family.

[DaisyDooley]

This thread is for pictures and question on the JEWELLERY Of the British Royal Family, Past and Current pieces. There may be posts about other Family’s Royal Jewels too.
It is only for discussing Jewels.
No discussions of current members of the RF, no de railing by talking about tax or ownership of certain pieces.
Just lovely pretty Jewels.

Another story about the Girls of Great Britain and Ireland tiara that I love - when Queen Mary gave it to Elizabeth as a wedding gift in 1947 the base was separate to the top of the tiara and Elizabeth didn’t realise they went together. So for the first few years she had the tiara she wore it without the base. it was only after her grandmother died that she found out the two pieces were meant to together, and she had them permanently joined.

It looks stunning in the first photo

The Fringe Tiara was broken by the Queen’s hairdresser hours before her wedding and had to be taken across London for an emergency repair. I think you can see it in the photographs, it doesn’t look entirely symmetrical front on. Imagine the tantrums had the bride been of a different temperament.

It’s possible I’m talking about a different fringe tiara, I’m not knowledgeable about these things!

Anyone know about the protocol for who in the RF gets to wear which tiaras? I always feel the DoE gets short changed on this given the size of the collection and would love to see her being loaned something with a bit more….well just more….if you get my drift.

Also are there any tiaras the RF own but don’t wear anymore and why?

That was a different fringe tiara, the Queen Mary fringe tiara. You can see -if you look closely- that it’s a tiny bit ‘wonkey’ on the wedding day as it was hastily soldered together.
There’s far too many fringe tiaras floating around to list them all I’m aftraid but I’ll do a piece on the ones owned by the King.

There isn’t any ‘protocol’ per se.
There is a lot of confusion regarding the jewellry.
The Crown Jewels are kept in the Tower of London.
They are only worn on state occasions.
They belong to ‘the state -aka the people’.
They include Cullinan l & ll.
They cannot under any circumstances leave the United Kingdom.
During the war they were removed from the tower, well wrapped up, put in waterproof tins and buried under the dungeons at Windsor Castle.

Then we have the jewels that we see the Queen and Members of the royal family wear.
This is privately owned by the king, up to him what he does with it, who wears it etc. If he wanted to sell the lot he could.
Theres is no trust, no protocol, simply tradition.
For example, the Oriental circlet had only been worn by Queens. QV, Queen Alexandra. Queen Mary, Queen Elizabeth and Queen Elizabeth ll.
Then all of a sudden there it was onthe head of the Princess of Wales.
This is because there is no ‘protocol’. Whoever owns them decides who can wear what.
Catherine will likely never ‘own’ her own tiara. She wears/has worn the Cartier scroll tiara (on her wedding day), the Lotus Tiara, the Cambridge lovers knot tiara, and since the death of QEII she has worn the Strathmore Rose and the Oriental circlet.
Princess Anne, Sophie Edinburgh, Duchess of Gloucester , Duke of Kent all hve their own tiaras. There is a likelihood though that some of Anne’s tiaras are long term loan and would on the occasion of her death return to the Royal vault. I suspect this is the case with the Greek Meander Tiara. It was a piece that belonged to Prince Philip’s mother. When Anne dies l suspect Peter and Zara will have to hve an auction of ‘stuffs to pay the IHT. Gatcombe is a working farm-but who knows what the IHT will be on working farms? It may pass IHT free.
But I doubt Anne has enough liquid funds in her estate to pay the IHT on the estate as the jewellry alone will be worth millions purely because of its royal provenance.
I don’t think the RF will want to see pieces which have historical/sentimental value going to auction. So I believe the Greek tiara will meander its way back to the jewel room at BP. When Margaret’s children picked out what would be sold to cover her death duties they sold the Poltimore. I don’t blame them - they might never wear it, insurance would cost a fortune . But the other tiaras Margaret wore -the lotus, the Persian turquoise, the Cartier scroll and the Teck circlet tiara - they were not sold. So they went back to the vault and we know this as two of them hve been worn by Catherine.

Yes, there are lots of tiaras which don’t get worn.
Ten years ago we had never seen the Greville Emerald Tiara (The one Eugenie wore) and hadn’t seen the one Meghan wore for over 80 years. Ditto the Strathmore rose.
I’ll do a post soon of the tiaras in the ownership of the king.

Here -i have ringed the tiara where it snapped.
Once you see it you can’t unsee it.
Personally l would hve just used another one………

This is all so fascinating, thank you so much

I meant to say yesterday how much I like that outdoor portrait of the Queen in her Thistle robes.

Angela Kelly wrote about it in her book. She said it was raining on and off all day and they had to grab a short time when it wasn't raining to get it done.

I think the looming clouds make a much more dramatic and effective picture than clear blue skies would have done.

Before we go further I would like to explain to you about jewels which are designated ‘heirloom of the crown’. This causes much confusion so it’s best to clear it up before confusion starts.

When Queen Victoria ascended the throne there was a court case. For the first time in over a century the Kingdoms of Great Britain& Ireland, and Hanover were seperated and had different rulers. This was because women were not allowed to inherit the Hanoverian Throne (muchgood that did them!)
Anyway, the new king of Hanover felt a bit hard done by and wanted allof the jewels that King George l had brought to England from Hanover in 1714.
Queen Victoria said’ not on my Nelly ‘or words to that effect and so it went to court.
Victoria lost and had to hand over diamonds, pearls, gold and precious jewels which she had been wearing.
This left her box a bit empty but luckily she had an artistic husband who designed nd bought her new pieces.
It was common then to give your children pieces -and presumably Victoria had children who she liked better than others who may have got important pieces (this did happen . More of that later).
So, as she got old she designated certain pieces ‘Heirloom of the Crown’.
This meant that she wanted them passed directly to the next monarch - they were too important to leave the main line. Victoria knew how little was in the RF jewel box from the Hanoverians so wanted to ensure that pieces like the Coronation necklace stayed with the monarch.
Many people think this means they are Crown Jewels. They are not.
They are still privatly owned and -although it’s a bit of a grey area as the king cannot sell them or leave them to whom he wants - they are still his. Put it this way, if we became a republic tomorrow he would take them with him .

Im going to do a post on the piece which I consider the most interesting later today.
Sorry if I waffle a bit.

Catherine will likely never ‘own’ her own tiara. She wears/has worn the Cartier scroll tiara (on her wedding day), the Lotus Tiara, the Cambridge lovers knot tiara, and since the death of QEII she has worn the Strathmore Rose and the Oriental circlet.

Just a quick question - I thought the Lovers' Knot tiara that Catherine wears is Queen Mary's Lovers' Knot tiara, not the Cambridge one?

Yes it is Queen Mary’s lovers knot. It was modelled (as you probably know) on one which Queen Mary’s Grandmother owned (Princess Augusta of Hesse Augusta actually). QM ws very close to her and they had a great relationship. Mary had loved the tiara for a long time.
However the tiara alas was not left to Mary or her mother. It was left to her eldest daughter who died in 1916 .
Mary was close to her aunt but when it it became obvious Mary was not going to inherit the tiara she commissioned Garrards to make her one all of her own. It was very very similar to the original.
Interestingly -we don’t know what has happened to the original.
Because Queen Mary’s was worn by Princess Diana and now The Princess of Wales it’s become more famous than the original.
Lots of people do call it the Cambridge lovers knot in tribute to the original and because when Catherine started to wear it it was again a Cambridge who was wearing it.

Here is a piece of jewellry designated ‘Heirlooms of the crown’
It was presented to Queen Victoria by Prince Albert on the eve of their wedding. She loved it so muc - well, you would wouldn’t you-that she wore it pinned to her wedding dress the next day.
She wore it frequently.
It is thought that Victoria and Albert planned to give their five daughters matching pieces of jewellry when they married. This was one such piece.
We have no real idea if they had 5 more made -but we know about one.
And amazingly, after an unknown journey it is back on the family and has been for 50 years.
The Queen bought it privatly at auction and presented it to Princess Anne who has worn it for 50 years. In fact,they both wore them on the occasion of Princess Anne’s 50th birthday party at Windsor -the only time we saw the brooches together. It is likely the Queen knew from archival history that the brooch was of royal origin but perhaps the auction house didn’t know as much as the Queen.

The original is a 40ct Ceylon Sapphire surrounded by pretty hefty diamonds.
As with some older jewellry (remember, it’s nearly 200 yrs old. )the setting is a little crude by modern standards but the plainness of the setting simply shows how fabulous the stones are.
It really is a glorious piece and I’m so Pleased that Queen Camilla is not afraid to wear historically important pieces and pieces which are associated heavily with QEII.

I’ve just double checked and in the Leslie Field book ‘The Queens Jewels’ the lovers knot tiara is called The Cambridge Lovers Knot Tiara -even though Mary commissioned it and until Catherine it was never worn by a Cambridge.

Does anyone know why the tiaras worn by E and M at their weddings had not been in use for a long time prior to these occasions.

I thought they were both lovely and was surprised they were not in regular use before then.

Oh and I loved to see the POW wearing the Strathmore after it being in hiding for so long.

Oh and I read somewhere that the late HMQE did consider buying the Poltimore but was apparently advised against it given the optics (re: how vast the collection is already).

If true I think it was a mistake as it’s my third favourite (after the Fife and Girls of GB) and I think it’s sad that it’s now in a private collection (likely in a bank vault bought as an investment only rather than the goldsmiths art it is) and may never been seen in all its splendour again as designed to be worn at a grand occasion.

Sorry for all the “Oh’s” 😂

Queens Alexandra and Mary were Princess of Wales/Queens at the utter height of jewellry wearing. Consider, the Current Princess of Wales wears a tiara two of three times a year - When Mary was Princess of Wales (1901-1910] and Queen Consort (1910-1936) she wore one EVERY DAY.
Yes. Every day. Her husband liked to dress for dinner every night. Which meant family orders, long dress and tiara. So Mary had a nice collection of tiaras and had some made later in life (like the diamond bandeau which Meghan wore and a smallish diamond and sapphire one she bought from the estate of Empress Marie Feodrovna -Sister of Queen Alexandra) which were much smaller and more wearable for her.
Queen Elizabeth the Queen Mother only seemed to like two tiaras her whole life so she stuck with them even though she had the most valuable tiara in the collection -which was the emerald tiara Eugenie wore which had been part of the Greville inheritance. She never wore it in public.
I think QEII was similar and only wore -from let’s say 1980- half a dozen tiaras (The girls of GB &Ireland, The Vladimir, QAlexandras Kokoshnik, the Burmese Ruby, The Belgian Sapphire, The Brazilian Aquamarine and she wore the Oriental circlet once after her mothers death).
Ithink they would wear the ones that they found most comfortable and which suited them the best.

Theres also public opinion -“How many tiaras does one woman need”sort of opinion.

Regarding the Poltimore -she may have bought it, we don’t know but I don’t think so. The optics would have not been good.
There was no real need to. It wasn’t a ‘royal’ tiara really. No royal provenance apart from Margaret and bought for a wedding which ended in divorce. Maybe it wasn’t considered ‘lucky’.
Neither her daughter nor her daughter in law wore it for their weddings. It wasn’t very “Sarah” but it would have suited Serena - maybe Margaret didn’t offer it. We will never know,
It was more important that the loan tiaras went back to the vault.
QEII had already seen the sale of quite an important piece of jewellry that I think she probably regretted not buying . I think this determined her decision to loan to her daughters in law rather than gift fabulous parures which would be sold as two generations later the owners are just regular non Tiara wearing people.

Thank you @DaisyDooley

One piece of Wallis Simpson's (DoW) jewellery I would like is her charm bracelet with crosses. I don't know why , it isn't the sort of thing I would normally wear at all. But I think it's very pretty. I believe it is in private hands now ( or on a private wrist ) after the auction.

Here
https://www.sothebys.com/en/auctions/ecatalogue/2010/exceptional-jewels-and-precious-objects-formerly-in-the-collection-of-the-duchess-of-windsor-l10055/lot.17.html

That's so lovely. She had some fabulous jewellery. I would have her fantastic emerald engagement ring any day.

At the V&A Cartier exhibition, they had a lot of the Duchess of Windsor's jewellery, including a necklace that was so tiny I thought it was a bracelet at first. She was so tiny and thin.

I am loving these posts @DaisyDooley - imagine wearing a tiara EVERY DAY! That's my kind of woman. Interesting about the ownership and Hanover too, thanks for posting it.

That’s one of my favourite too. I just love it.

@Spacemountain
Here are the matching pieces (sold seperately) to ‘your’ necklace.
Thought you might like to see them.
Ive posted some pictures of some other pieces that belonged to The Duchess of Windsor including the bracelets matching necklace and another ‘charm’ necklace @BasiliskStare
Hope you like them!
The ‘animals’ are just fantastic. Cartier did some of their best work for the ex-king IMHO. I love the way his taste -and presumably that of Wallis - was completely different to that of the RF.
The flamingo is approx 4” long.