Prince Harry's Wreath

[Profhilodisaster]

So apparently Prince Harry has asked someone to lay a wreath on his behalf to honour the 80th anniversary of VJ Day.
I know the military meant a lot to him but he's being called out on it as he mentions his grandfather. I'd like to think he did this with the best intentions but the cynic in me wonders if he did it as a dig at William for only posting a message on social media.

I don’t see this a media bias for William but a sad lack of interest in VJ day and the war in the Far East in general.

A bit different I feel. RS attended part and then sloped off, while all the other premiers stayed. William isn’t a HoS.

I just hope that Catherine is ok .

He is the Heir. Apart from the King, he is the most important person within the Royal Family and the country and will be Head of the Armed forces in the not very distant future.

His absence is poor and he was conspicuous by his absence

So was the actual Head of State there? Why, would W need to be there? When he's Head of State, he'll attend, because that will his job then. But until then, I believe it an unwarranted expectation.

(But then, I would rather we heard and saw a lot less of tje RF, rather than more. If a recycling centre in the Midlands needs a ceremonial opening, I'd rather a local hero did it. And all these bloody church services to commemmorate this-that-and-the-other can, as far as I'm concerned, get in the bin.)

Typo updates

In your opinion ...

I 100% agree with your take.

How many of the Great British public took time off to go to a dreary church service to commemmorate VJ? Not many, I'll bet.

VJ was 80 years ago. These commemmorations are losing relevance.

When I read Ghormengast 40-odd years ago, I saw the parallels between the poor Earl, having to enact rituals, day after day, whose meaning was lost in time.

I hope W calls time on a whole bunch of these archaic annual rituals (while keeping the more relevant and celebratory ones).

I find it really weird that there is no expectation for the heir to the throne to do anything!

Charles is the Head of State I believe, and he went all out supporting this, giving speeches, talking to veterans and generally giving VJ Day the respect it deserves on its 80th anniversary I am no royalist but if we are going to have a monarchy, why can't the heir to the throne show up and do his bit, otherwise what's the point?

Call it an 'unwarranted expectation' if you like, yes it's my opinion and yes it is an expectation of mine that the future heir and future head of the armed forces makes an effort.

80 years for VJ day is not an 'archaic annual ritual'. It will probably be commemorated in 10 years time now, and obviously in 20 years time for the 100th.

The great British Public pay The RF to turn up to 'deary church services' and represent them. The whole point of the RF is too enact archaic meaningless rituals. That is the definition of them. William won't call time on any of them because he wants the RF to continue. That is his only purpose. To make sure he can pass the entire load of old nonsense to his son with a much money and privilege as possible.

I would normally be a staunch defender of the Waleses, while finding the Sussexes utterly ridiculous.

but William should have been at the VJ commemorations, the last major anniversary when there will be any living veterans. In a professional capacity I’m close to organisations such as veterans charities, and while none would make any public comment, it is a shocking snub that he didn’t attend.

@Rhaidimiddim ’dismal archaic rituals’? So ignorant and scathing, the final very elderly representatives of that generation are still with us, and the Heir to the Throne should absolutely have taken a few hours out of his day to publicly acknowledge their incredible sacrifices.

NB I really hope Catherine is ok

Same I normally give the Wales a lot of leeway as they’ve had a rough year or so , but yes William should have taken a day off his holiday to attend. The veterans who were there aged over a 100, really deserved to be honoured and certainly won’t be around in 10 years for the next big commemoration. Big misstep IMO.

Here a thread for you all to discuss it and not derail this one

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/the_royal_family/5395136-williams-non-attendance-to-important-events?utm_campaign=thread&utm_medium=share

’dismal archaic rituals’? So ignorant and scathing, the final very elderly representatives of that generation are still with us, and the Heir to the Throne should absolutely have taken a few hours out of his day to publicly acknowledge their incredible sacrifices.

Completely agree. And rituals are important, anyway. VJ day is very meaningful in my family; 80 years since my grandfather was freed from being a PoW.

William is our next king. Can't imagine Charles having missed something like this as heir.

@Spectre8 I'm not sure it's reasonable to tell people (twice!) where and what they can discuss

I'm rather thinking that W values his life (and that of his older son) more highly than this, since he chooses to blow off this performative stuff in favour of charity work and holidays. I'd do the same in his position.

QE2 had her style and priorities, and you can't fault her sense of duty. But, she was stuck in an Ealing Comedy-era Britain, and a lot of people (who have never known a different monarch) seem to think that hers was THE way to do royalling.

For example, Commonwealth Day. How shall we celebrate the Commonwealth one day a year?

Oh, I know!

We'll round up all the family; put the men in ceremonial uniforms or tail coats, give the ones who haven't won any medals some party-attendance ones; dress the ladies in a style of costume not otherwise seen in the wild outside a Cotswolds-set wedding (and insist on stockings and hats, even on the hottest of days); and .....wait for it.......Have A Church Service!!!!!

Why not a one-day festival of music and dance, accompanied by a nationwide programme of exhibitions promoting the Commonwealth and its cultural history? Something relevant, rather than performative.

I guess it boils down to a preference. I'd rather the RF kept out of my face, while others want them seen, even if all that they're seen doing is dress-up praying.

Why not a one-day festival of music and dance, accompanied by a nationwide programme of exhibitions promoting the Commonwealth and its cultural history? Something relevant, rather than performative.
Because no one really cares about the Commonwealth anymore?
One morning in a church service is not that much of an imposition. He's presumably in Norfolk. To be driven there and back would have taken 3 hours max and saved 2 80 year olds a trip from Norfolk to Suffolk?
William and his oldest son ( and other children) will have far, far more comfortable lives as part of the Monarchy than they will if they were just random rich people without the culture of deference around them and they know it.

There weren't any dreary church services last week to commemorate VJ Day. The Great British Public didn't have any to go to. Which employers in this country do you think would have allowed their employees to have a couple of hours to go to a service in their local churches?
There was a big commemoration at the Arboretum and the King and Queen represented the nation. Did you watch any of it? I'm sure it would have been on I Player for people who were at work while it was on. It was serious but not dreary. It wasn't a church service.
It is a shame if these commemorations are losing relevance. The world needs to be reminded constantly of the appalling things which happen in wars.(They happen in 'peace' time, too, but to a lesser extent,) Have you ever looked at the war memorials in the villages of the UK? You will see that usually more men died in WW1 than in WW2. In my village two young men died on the first day of the battle of the Somme and there were nothing like as many people in the village back then. Have you known anyone who was a prisoner in the far east, enduring awful conditions? Have you ever read Primo Levi's books or the 'Forgotten Voices' series of books put out by the Imperial War Museum?
Paying respect to all of those people is never irrelevant.

It sounds as if you don't set any store by rituals but some people do.

Which archaic annual rituals would you like William to call time on? Which more relevant and celebratory ones would you like him to keep?

Perhaps the younger generation - who get poppies and rainbows and international this-and-that day at school - had a day a year of meaningful celebration of the Commonwealth they might.

VJ day? My grandsons didn't even register it.

My point being, the RF should choose different now. What they comemmorate and how. If they want to stay relevant.

I am not ignorant of the history of the World Wars. My dad fought for 7 years - in Italy and Africa - in WW2. Two family relatives were POWs - one captured by the Canadians, one by the Russians.

So please don't ascribe my rather eccentric view of how we, as a nation, look back on the World Wars to ignorance.

And I've read a lot about the diplomatic farce that resulted in WW1 and know the sacrifice those young men were asked to make was entirely unnecessary. Partly the result of a barmy king.

So I'd rather our monarchs looked forward, and lent their currency to initiatives to foster good international relationships.

And if W decides that he won't ever again dress up like a character from a panto and abolishes the Order of the Garter, I'd be all for it.

You actually can’t make this up.

A man honours the war dead and his late grandfather, and he’s criticised, because his brother didn’t bother.

Harry was being performative as Ever. William should have been there. It’s pretty simple IMP

Not because of that but because he is a sneaky snake. He's the ghost prince. Sad really...

Fwiw I’m twixt and between on this one. I think it’s entirely appropriate for Harry to leave a wreath because of his involvement with Invictus and injured veterans.

I don’t think we know enough about William’s situation to judge him for not attending the VJ commemorations. I have a family member who has suffered similarly to Catherine and their recovery has been much longer and much more arduous than you might imagine. So while I think he should have been there, he may have very good reasons not to be.

Coming from a forces family, I don’t think these commemorations are remotely archaic. I am not a monarchist but anyone with the most cursory understanding of current world events must surely understand the importance of learning about, and remembering our history, and those lost. I would have thought that is just as pertinent today as it ever was.

At the same time, I also have some sympathy for Rhaidimiddim‘s view about our group of countries needing to look forward as well as looking back, and that’s something that we have difficulty doing because we don’t really have a good sense of where we sit on the world stage any more.

Especially now we have rejected the left-centrist Christian democrat position of the EU and it’s pretty obvious that we are not transforming in to the Singapore-on-sea beloved of Brexiteers, and owing to recent events, our so-called special relationship with the USA is in decline.

Where, in all of this muddle, as the global power axes shift, does a Royal Family sit or fît exactly? Does the institution of the monarchy help us as a group of nations to move forward?

H's new PR push will inevitably fail as PR cannot overcome H's public actions that were widely reported on. People have formed their views from actions such as the following:

-H missed a Royal Marines IRA memorial for a Disney event where he told Iger (Disney CEO) that his wife does voiceovers.

-H dramatically flounced off with his HIHO proclamation revealing his disconnect from the reality that it was QE2's monarchy and she would be the one picking and choosing who represented her and in what capacity. H had zero agency in this matter.

-H's book contained kill counts and references to enemy combatants as chess pieces leading to retired Admiral Lord West's comment that H's publicisation of such matters was "very stupid"

IMHO, West is right...."very stupid" indeed!