Harry and RAVEC - claims he was trapped by RF

[smilesy]

Okay. So first of all thanks to everyone on the last thread for a really civilised discussion about Harry and his security. The Telegraph has an exclusive article where Harry claims that his security was removed to “trap” him in the RF. I’m really sorry but for some reason I am unable to archive Telegraph articles at the moment. Could anyone help?

I don’t mind Harry but even I don’t think we should provide security for him in the US. That’s his choice to live there.

When he visits the UK, I think he should be treated like any other VIP - an assessment carried out as to what protection is or isn’t required. Isn’t that what he is arguing? That they didn’t follow that usual procedure and instead invented a random ‘bespoke’ process just for him?

@Hazeby they created a bespoke process because there was no recent precedent for this situation. And the bespoke process is exactly what you think he should have: an assessment for each visit.

I think that is exactly what they do. A bespoke approach just means that they tailor the approach to what he is doing when he gets here. The same as for any other visitor who gets security. That usually involves someone visiting with the Royals or interacting with the government. Or, as a one off, Taylor Swift. Indeed that was the most clear example of “bespoke” security recently. She would never have ordinarily got that level of security. So all that is meant by bespoke is looking at Harry’s need on a case by case basis

I agree with Katherine Parr (PP) that the judges may reprimand Harry for speaking to the press specifically about the closed court stuff. It was closed for security reasons...What a liability he is.

I'm not even sure whether Harry or Boris about the legalities of arriving at a country and requesting a longterm visa with a group of British police in tow. In all honesty Harry would still be whining if he kept his security when the home office vetoes their use for royal tours and travel, he'd probably still be in a court case.

Is all this so H can ease himself back into the UK on a more regular basis, giving him a bolthole when life in Montecito becomes too much? He could flit back and forth (on his own, obviously) without having to announce his arrival 10 days in advance, and without having to officially split from M. Is he looking to the future?

Charles offered to have Harry stay with him in a Royal Residence last year. It would mean Harry had ultra high security and they could meet in private.

Harry refused and stayed in a hotel. We know now it was so he could bring in ITV cameras and crews for an interview.

Who's not reconciling there?

Harry gets Met Police protection whenever he is in the UK at the level is deemed necessary after a thorough security review.

When he visits the UK, I think he should be treated like any other VIP - an assessment carried out as to what protection is or isn’t required

And that's exactly what he gets now.

But it’s the manner of that assessment that the case is about isn’t it? He’s saying they are not doing whatever it is they usually do, that they are treating him differently?

And one can infer that it is somehow ‘lesser’ and that’s the purpose of the case.

He doesn't know what they do, because he isn't a security professional, serving at a senior level in the Met, or in the Home Office. It's arrogant in the extreme.
Harry gets security, paid for by the taxpayer. He is protected. His requirements are assessed.
Why is this not good enough for him?

Maybe his PA or his brother (ex brother) wrote to Ravec to deny him protection? Who knows. As he said it shocked him. May be he will write this in the second book

I could quite easily believe that Harry will write a second book with his latest claims, but would anyone believe a word of it when so much else has been shown to be lies or just derangement based on a total lack of understanding?

Had to smile at the claim that it'll be "swords down" if he gets the security he wants though ... as if He also said that about the "apology" he wants, and ike a toddler he'd simply move on to the next demand and then the next

As so many have said it's clearly not about the security or whatever any more, but his unfortunate mindset ... and it's not one I'd enjoy having

I wonder what his counsel think of him blabbing to the press, I was a witness (victim) a few years ago in a trial and was explicitly told not to speak to anyone outside of family about it until the trial was over

Edited to add Harry may well have been told the same, @Profhilodisaster, but then he'll be told many things and clearly ignores what doesn't suit - especially if it comes from one of the "little people" who are deemed to be standing in his way

I think it’s the fact that he has to give notice of his arrival that he doesn’t like. But quite whose he expects to do otherwise is baffling. Does he think special protection should just be hanging around waiting em for him to appear? This is what I and many other posters can’t understand- what exactly does Harry want that is “better@ than this alleged “inferior” treatment?

Ravec’s terms of reference state they should get expert risk analysis from the RMB when assessing security. They didn’t get this before they downgraded his security.

So he is saying that they didn’t follow their own procedures.

They’re saying used a bespoke process instead, which is adequate.

That’s what’s the argument is about as far as I can make out.

'Treating him differently' from who?

What other member of the royal family chose to live on another continent as a private citizen? What is the baseline for Harry's 'treatment'?

If I understand it correctly, he is saying that the decision to do this (decide on his security on a case by case basis) did not go through the usual process for VIPs which includes a specific risk assessment committee.

The Home Office is saying that his case was considered differently ('bespoke') because there was no precedent: there had not previously been a non-wprking royal deciding to live abroad. Security experts gave full consideration and decided that this was best.

The legal case is simply about the process. If I am correct, should Harry win, RAVEC will be told that their process was wrong and should be reviewed. That doesn't mean that the decision itself was wrong, and is very likely to be repeated.

Of course, in most people's understanding, 'bespoke' is actually a superior version.

Is the phrase ‘swords down’ an actual quote? If so it’s very childish and overlooks the fact the other side has refused to engage.

Also, didn't his lawyer say or at least imply that he and Meghan were 'forced' to leave?

So now he's saying that 'they' were trying to 'trap' them into staying?

Which is it? It cannot be both. I suspect it is neither.

This is typical, @IcedPurple because they contradict themselves the whole time. Neither of them seem to have the sense to at least get the stories straight.

It's easy to see why there is so much confusion about this case, as what Harry says is not what the case is about. Harry clearly is still obsessed that his security was pulled when in Canada and the noise around that decision. It's why IPP gets so often repeated even though the case is about the process not necessarily the decision. But for Harry this is about IPP and it's about money, this case was the only vehicle he had available to air his grievances and has caused so much disconnect in the subject.

Of course, in most people's understanding, 'bespoke' is actually a superior version

Well, this is key isn’t it? He obviously believes it isn’t whereas they think it is, or at least equal to.

From other VIPs for whom they do these assessments I guess.

I think he never wanted to stop being a senior royal but just wanted his own bespoke arrangement. He got shocked when HMQ said no, basically you do things the traditional way or not at all. He flounced off, thinking they would get a shock and beg him to come back. They didn’t and this legal case is just way for him to keep complaining about his treatment.

Sometimes I think about the Netflix trailer with Harry saying in dark portentous tones, 'it's a hierarchy '. No shit Sherlock.

was there an interview during that visit ( I lose track!)

Does he have evidence that he is treated worse? Many of us have seen celebrities on the tube, at the theatre, in cafés and shops. They can't all be taken around in limos and have armed guards.
Taylor Swift normally doesn't, but her assessment changed with a genuine terrorist threat against her, so it was upgraded.